The battle of Brexit!

[snapper]

Not sure why you mention Gina Miller alongside Banks. I admit I have forgotten her but she is not married to a Muscovite Lady or Gentleman, never met the Muscovite Ambassador or was offered mining rights in Muscovy... she raised a legal challenge to the Government enacting Article 50 without a vote in Parliament.

[Double Edge]

I mean yea that's a pretty good case but sadly the UK needs a Independent Prosecutor type system to get to the bottom of it, the Tories are full of Muscovite funding at their London fundraiser Party's (I went to one once in 2009) and Comrade Corbyn's 'Chief Strategist' Seamus Milne is a Stalinist who regularly meets with Putin in Muscovy.

It's a bit odd nothing has been said given the Salisbury affair. If anything you'd think the remain lot would make a big deal out of it. Nope, nothing.

Do they need an independent prosecutory system ? i think they have enough safeguards in place if anything funny goes on. If nobody has said anything then there isn't a case to begin with.

[Freyr]

Not sure why you mention Gina Miller alongside Banks. I admit I have forgotten her but she is not married to a Muscovite Lady or Gentleman, never met the Muscovite Ambassador or was offered mining rights in Muscovy... she raised a legal challenge to the Government enacting Article 50 without a vote in Parliament.

Gina miller, Huawei 5G, Banks .....all part of operation mass confusion. The UK state is in the process of reneging on its democratic mandate and dragging any headline or self important twit into its agenda...

[snapper]

They are certainly not all working on the same side. Gina Miller launched a court case, Banks is the subject of a criminal inquiry, Huawei is obliged by Chinese law to reveal code encryption to the Chinese Government if asked so naturally and rightfully people are questioning it's help in setting up 5G networks. Nor does any of it mean that anyone (apart from Banks and the leave campaign who blatantly lied a la Trumpkin) is engaged in "reneging on its democratic mandate" just because they are not doing exactly as you might wish. Nor indeed it is clear which path would be the more 'democratic' even. These issues are very separate to most people; a cod is not a herring though both are fishes.

Mrs May apparently had supper on Monday with some wealthy Muscovite donor; https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...don-hotel.html

[Freyr]

They are certainly not all working on the same side.

Correct , they don't need to

Gina Miller launched a court case,

To impose parliaments lawful right to hijack the referendum result, which its doing splendidly so far

Banks is the subject of a criminal inquiry,

To help undermine the integrity of the result, which ultimately will help lead to a second referendum

Huawei is obliged by Chinese law to reveal code encryption to the Chinese Government if asked so naturally and rightfully people are questioning it's help in setting up 5G networks

. Huawei helped set up the present 4G network. Nobody said anything! I understand the fears. They're not dissimilar to the ones I have about Google, FB, Amazon and so on ..all of which are US companies. But GCHQ will be monitoring those also.

Nor does any of it mean that anyone (apart from Banks and the leave campaign who blatantly lied a la Trumpkin) is engaged in "reneging on its democratic mandate" just because they are not doing exactly as you might wish. Nor indeed it is clear which path would be the more 'democratic' even.

The Remain side made just as many ridiculous headlines as the leave side...not heard of anybody being investigated on that side

These issues are very separate to most people; a cod is not a herring though both are fishes.

Yes and they swim in the same sea

[snapper]

To impose parliaments lawful right to hijack the referendum result, which its doing splendidly so far

Well no actually. Miller's case was about forcing the Government to put the Article 50 activation to a vote in Parliament rather than enacting by Order in Council. It was in a way forcing greater representative democracy.

To help undermine the integrity of the result, which ultimately will help lead to a second referendum

Well again no; it is about illegalities committed in the funding of the leave campaign and trying to work out who payed for it since it is clear that Aaron Banks does not have that sort of money to throw around.

Huawei helped set up the present 4G network. Nobody said anything! I understand the fears. They're not dissimilar to the ones I have about Google, FB, Amazon and so on ..all of which are US companies. But GCHQ will be monitoring those also.

I am not sure if they were involved in 4G but one problem at least is that the US, Canada and Australia have voiced concerns about this Chinese involvement. That matters because UK's partners in 5 Eyes. I was reading that the Defence Secretary was fired yesterday for leaking about this. He denies he was the source of the leak and if he were it would be a criminal offence but the PM apparently does not want to prosecute... since when was that her decision and not the Crown Prosecution Service? It seems they are trying to cover up something to do with this Huawei contract that they seem intent on taking irrespective of any security issues or not.

The Remain side made just as many ridiculous headlines as the leave side...not heard of anybody being investigated on that side

Perhaps they did not break any laws or go boozing with the Muscovite Ambassador? Face it the Brexit vote and the Muscovite interference was a trial run for the 2016 US election. Cambridge Analytica in both, Muscovite bots and fb adds, secret meetings with Muscovite's, money appearing from nowhere...

Yes and they swim in the same sea

So I put a water melon, a bicycle and a hunk of ham in a road and behold! Suddenly they are a common feature! They are in the road.

[Freyr]

Well no actually. Miller's case was about forcing the Government to put the Article 50 activation to a vote in Parliament rather than enacting by Order in Council. It was in a way forcing greater representative democracy.

Which is not what cameron said before the brexit result, he said the UK would leave immediately after the result. He said nothing about parliament having a say. That only happened because Gina Miller was wheeled in from obscurity with more knowledge than anybody else..

Well again no; it is about illegalities committed in the funding of the leave campaign and trying to work out who payed for it since it is clear that Aaron Banks does not have that sort of money to throw around.

Of course he doesn't. Thats the whole idea to discredit the result..Wheel in another turnip that nobodies heard of and present him as some Spectre figure dealing in laundered money to spice up the BS

I am not sure if they were involved in 4G

Well they are. BT has announced it is in the process of removing Huawei's equipment from the core of its existing 3G and 4G mobile operations and will not use the Chinese company's gear in central parts of the next 5G network. But the NCSC (part of GCHQ) recently concluded that any risk posed by involving the Chinese technology giant in the development of new networks can be managed.

but one problem at least is that the US, Canada and Australia have voiced concerns about this Chinese involvement. That matters because UK's partners in 5 Eyes.

Apparently 5G will be alot harder to monitor and that is the worry. So time to play catchup. sounds like investment is needed...either that or the west starts to lag behind

I was reading that the Defence Secretary was fired yesterday for leaking about this. He denies he was the source of the leak and if he were it would be a criminal offence but the PM apparently does not want to prosecute... since when was that her decision and not the Crown Prosecution Service? It seems they are trying to cover up something to do with this Huawei contract that they seem intent on taking irrespective of any security issues or not.

Its more to do with the Defence secretaries naked ambition than anything else.

Perhaps they did not break any laws or go boozing with the Muscovite Ambassador? Face it the Brexit vote and the Muscovite interference was a trial run for the 2016 US election. Cambridge Analytica in both, Muscovite bots and fb adds, secret meetings with Muscovite's, money appearing from nowhere...

Cambridge analytica is a subsidiary (or was) of a company with close ties to the British establishment whose Psychological operations are both internal and external involving military and non military elements....Conjuring up Russians at every turn is a total red herring. Yes we should be worried about certain activities.. But also get them in context!

So I put a water melon, a bicycle and a hunk of ham in a road and behold! Suddenly they are a common feature! They are in the road.

But if you threw them in the sea only the melon would float! ;)

[snapper]

Which is not what cameron said before the brexit result, he said the UK would leave immediately after the result. He said nothing about parliament having a say. That only happened because Gina Miller was wheeled in from obscurity with more knowledge than anybody else..

In which he clearly says that he thinks it would take 10yrs, which as it happens was the same view as the former UK Ambassador to the EU Sir Ivan Rogers (who got fired for saying so publicly).

Of course he doesn't. Thats the whole idea to discredit the result..Wheel in another turnip that nobodies heard of and present him as some Spectre figure dealing in laundered money to spice up the BS

I would think the point of the investigation is to bring charges or not depending on the findings.

Well they are. BT has announced it is in the process of removing Huawei's equipment from the core of its existing 3G and 4G mobile operations and will not use the Chinese company's gear in central parts of the next 5G network. But the NCSC (part of GCHQ) recently concluded that any risk posed by involving the Chinese technology giant in the development of new networks can be managed.

I would say rather that GCHQ, NCSC and the other security services have representatives that along with the some ministries constitute the National Security Council which is where this Minister is alleged to have leaked from.

Apparently 5G will be alot harder to monitor and that is the worry. So time to play catchup. sounds like investment is needed...either that or the west starts to lag behind

I don't understand the high tech mumbo jumbo of it all. Changing plugs, fuses and light bulbs is about my tech know how. But if there is a possibility that a system which you expect many people will use may be compromised if it relies on some Chinese tech then I would rule out that option for starters.

Its more to do with the Defence secretaries naked ambition than anything else.

Unlikely that he could have become PM in the near future. I quite liked him though I only met him briefly in Odessa.

Cambridge analytica is a subsidiary (or was) of a company with close ties to the British establishment whose Psychological operations are both internal and external involving military and non military elements....Conjuring up Russians at every turn is a total red herring. Yes we should be worried about certain activities.. But also get them in context!

Pretty sure Cambridge Analytica is owned by the Mercers in the US who also fund Brietbart. I also see another similarity - the Muscovite connection.

But if you threw them in the sea only the melon would float! ;)

You miss my point... A water melon, a bicycle and a ham have next to nothing in common but I put them in a road and then claim they're being in the road they share is common is artificial commonality. I could put any number of random unconnected objects in a field and say "look there is something going on here! I put them in all these things in a field." That is not proof of their having something in common though.

[Freyr]

In which he clearly says that he thinks it would take 10yrs, which as it happens was the same view as the former UK Ambassador to the EU Sir Ivan Rogers (who got fired for saying so publicly).

Very probably more than 10 years....Trade deals are a work in progress as new technologies become available.

I would think the point of the investigation is to bring charges or not depending on the findings.

Investigation lol....We've seen this sort of thing before though haven't we....When banks are found guilty of money laundering the authorities unable to tax the Bank simply Fines them, so all is legal and the result is the GOV gets its cut and nobody goes to jail...

I would say rather that GCHQ, NCSC and the other security services have representatives that along with the some ministries constitute the National Security Council which is where this Minister is alleged to have leaked from.

Smoke and mirrors !

I don't understand the high tech mumbo jumbo of it all. Changing plugs, fuses and light bulbs is about my tech know how. But if there is a possibility that a system which you expect many people will use may be compromised if it relies on some Chinese tech then I would rule out that option for starters.

and you will end up 10 years behind in terms of tech

Unlikely that he could have become PM in the near future. I quite liked him though I only met him briefly in Odessa.

Couldn't stand the man. Wreaked of Imperialism!

Pretty sure Cambridge Analytica is owned by the Mercers in the US who also fund Brietbart

it was owned by SCL now also defunct . Cambridge analytica's old London address is now housing a new company called Emerdata Limited and many of the same people work for it .[QUOTE]

I also see another similarity - the Muscovite connection.

No doubt Russia would like to maintain its Ukrainian buffer and is very unhappy with Nato and the western influence there but I think home spun mischief is the key to unlocking this nest.

ou miss my point... A water melon, a bicycle and a ham have next to nothing in common but I put them in a road and then claim they're being in the road they share is common is artificial commonality. I could put any number of random unconnected objects in a field and say "look there is something going on here! I put them in all these things in a field." That is not proof of their having something in common though.

I got your point and I made a joke did it not float?

[snapper]

Very probably more than 10 years....Trade deals are a work in progress as new technologies become available.

Not what the Leave campaign said... an EU trade deal would be the simplest thing ever! they said. Now you are agreeing with me that they lied.

Investigation lol....We've seen this sort of thing before though haven't we....When banks are found guilty of money laundering the authorities unable to tax the Bank simply Fines them, so all is legal and the result is the GOV gets its cut and nobody goes to jail...

Well I could discuss the 'sub prime mortgage' selling in the US that brought about the 2008 crash but I think the UK, like the rest of the 'West' (and Ukraine though to lesser extent) is infected by dirty Muscovite money and influence. The difference is we are fighting them daily so understand it better and are more on the look out for it's signs. When Mrs May and some of her cabinet are having supper in the Queens favourite hotel in Belgravia with the Wife of a Muscovite oligarch and clearly pushing this Chinese infection in a UK 5G network one has to ask why?

I recall what Bukovsky (an old Soviet dissident) said when he came to give a talk at the Uni I was then at. I had heard of him, even in Polish emigre circles he was known and appreciated, but he said something like "the Soviet Union worked on a dual system that fought each most of the time. The first was the Party ideology and the second was corruption. The ideology was a sham and disintegrated first, now only the corruption remains." Corruption is a tool for Moscow.

Smoke and mirrors !

Minsters of Departments do not get involved below that level is all.

and you will end up 10 years behind in terms of tech

I doubt that. I would take year longer for increased security.

Couldn't stand the man. Wreaked of Imperialism!

Made a good case for increased Defence spending by all accounts. That is not 'imperialism' but the UK armed forces are run on an outmoded 'save pennies today' basis in the view of many which neglects the long term cost (and time) of replacing various components. Right now Ukraine could probably successfully invade the UK if they were next door. The planning in British military acquisition has frankly been abysmal since the 2010 'Strategic Defence and Security Review' which was basically an operation in cost cutting.

[QUOTE=Freyr;1050756]it was owned by SCL now also defunct . Cambridge analytica's old London address is now housing a new company called Emerdata Limited and many of the same people work for it .[QUOTE]

How is that linked to the 'British establishment'? Which Duke or Prince owns shares or is a board member?

No doubt Russia would like to maintain its Ukrainian buffer and is very unhappy with Nato and the western influence there but I think home spun mischief is the key to unlocking this nest.

Funny how Muscovy is connected to all but just a 'coincidence'? Maybe all coincidences that anyone that Putin does not like ends up dead too... That far right Parties all over Europe get Muscovite funding...

I got your point and I made a joke did it not float?

I merely concerned that I had not been correctly understood.

[snapper]

Very probably more than 10 years....Trade deals are a work in progress as new technologies become available.

Not what the Leave campaign said... an EU trade deal would be the simplest thing ever! they said. Now you are agreeing with me that they lied.

Investigation lol....We've seen this sort of thing before though haven't we....When banks are found guilty of money laundering the authorities unable to tax the Bank simply Fines them, so all is legal and the result is the GOV gets its cut and nobody goes to jail...

Well I could discuss the 'sub prime mortgage' selling in the US that brought about the 2008 crash but I think the UK, like the rest of the 'West' (and Ukraine though to lesser extent) is infected by dirty Muscovite money and influence. The difference is we are fighting them daily so understand it better and are more on the look out for it's signs. When Mrs May and some of her cabinet are having supper in the Queens favourite hotel in Belgravia with the Wife of a Muscovite oligarch and clearly pushing this Chinese infection in a UK 5G network one has to ask why?

I recall what Bukovsky (an old Soviet dissident) said when he came to give a talk at the Uni I was then at. I had heard of him, even in Polish emigre circles he was known and appreciated, but he said something like "the Soviet Union worked on a dual system that fought each most of the time. The first was the Party ideology and the second was corruption. The ideology was a sham and disintegrated first, now only the corruption remains." Corruption is a tool for Moscow.

Smoke and mirrors !

Minsters of Departments do not get involved below that level is all.

and you will end up 10 years behind in terms of tech

I doubt that. I would take year longer for increased security.

Couldn't stand the man. Wreaked of Imperialism!

Made a good case for increased Defence spending by all accounts. That is not 'imperialism' but the UK armed forces are run on an outmoded 'save pennies today' basis in the view of many which neglects the long term cost (and time) of replacing various components. Right now Ukraine could probably successfully invade the UK if they were next door. The planning in British military acquisition has frankly been abysmal since the 2010 'Strategic Defence and Security Review' which was basically an operation in cost cutting.

it was owned by SCL now also defunct . Cambridge analytica's old London address is now housing a new company called Emerdata Limited and many of the same people work for it .

How is that linked to the 'British establishment'? Which Duke or Prince owns shares or is a board member?

No doubt Russia would like to maintain its Ukrainian buffer and is very unhappy with Nato and the western influence there but I think home spun mischief is the key to unlocking this nest.

Funny how Muscovy is connected to all but just a 'coincidence'? Maybe all coincidences that anyone that Putin does not like ends up dead too... That far right Parties all over Europe get Muscovite funding...

I got your point and I made a joke did it not float?

I merely concerned that I had not been correctly understood.

[tankie]

A little girl was leaning into a lion's cage. Suddenly, the lion grabs her by the collar of her jacket and tries to pull her inside to slaughter her, all under the eyes of her screaming parents.

A biker jumps off his Harley runs to the cage and hits the lion square on the nose with a powerful punch. Whimpering from the pain, the lion jumps back, letting go of the girl, and the biker brings the girl to her terrified parents, who thank him endlessly.

A reporter has watched the whole event.

The reporter, addressing the Harley rider says, "Sir, this was the most gallant and bravest thing I've seen a man do in my whole life.”

The Harley rider replies, "Why, it was nothing, really. The lion was behind bars. I just saw this little kid in danger, and acted as I felt right.”

The reporter says, "Well, I'll make sure this won't go unnoticed. I'm a journalist, you know, and tomorrow's paper will have this story on the front page. So, what do you do for a living, and what political affiliation do you have?”

The biker replies "I'm a British Army veteran, a Conservative and I voted for Brexit”. The journalist leaves.

The following morning the biker buys the paper to see if it indeed brings news of his actions, and reads, on the front page: UK far right VETERAN ASSAULTS AFRICAN IMMIGRANT & STEALS HIS LUNCH.

And THAT pretty much sums up the media's approach to the news these days...Especially the ... . .BBC.........

[snapper]

UK Local Election results:

[Freyr]

The brexit referendum question is below



Its delightfully simple, no ambiguity and quite deliberate!....and it was answered :)

Its always interesting to hear the Remain arguments. But I could definitely make a better job of it. The problem I have with it in the main is it completely ostracises too many for the sake of a minority of a clique of a small percentage of an elite of an elite of spoon fed and sometimes not even spoon fed ..almost shovel fed condescending twerps..over educated no nothings creating a parallel universe where reality has no bearing..they really haven't had to do anything but have it given to them ....WOW!!!

[snapper]

The problem I have with it in the main is it completely ostracises too many for the sake of a minority of a clique of a small percentage of an elite of an elite of spoon fed and sometimes not even spoon fed ..almost shovel fed condescending twerps..over educated no nothings creating a parallel universe where reality has no bearing..they really haven't had to do anything but have it given to them ....WOW!!!

I fear you are again mistaken. Starter for 10: Who is this?



Let me give a you clue... He lives at Gournay Court:



Was brought up by the family Nanny, went to Eaton and Trinity College Oxford, worked for a while in the city, together with his Wife is worth around £150m, his Wife being Helena Anne Beatrix Wentworth Fitzwilliam de Chair, the daughter of Lady Juliet Tadgell and Victor Hervey, 6th Marquess of Bristol... Manages an investment company called Somerset Holdings that for the most part banks offshore and the HQ of which he moved to Dublin following the Brexit vote.

Or Boris, I mean again Eaton and Oxford, where he was a member of the 'toffs gone wild club' known as the 'Bullingdon Club' (favourite pastime smashing and defecating all over restaurants and then paying to keep it quiet). Boris did at least study Classics. Apparently had a bust of Pericles on his desk at the FCO. Boris earns £100,000 per article from the Daily Torygraph...

Cameron too was an old Etonian - Oxford alumni. He is a second cousin of the Queens.

Nigel Farage: Dulwhich College, his Father worked on the Stock Exchange, so the son followed having failed academically at school which made Oxbridge impossible. Farage worked on the commodities markets (mostly metals it is said) married twice (second time to a German Lady) still lives where his parents lived (apart from London, Brussels flats etc) in Downe (which is actually where Darwin lived). We used to walk there sometimes on a Sunday when I was younger and my parents moved to Cudham. Farage has made a fortune from his political 'career' such that he despite his hatred of the EU he refuses to give up his EU pension and can currently afford a private plane. There are loads of rackets for elected MPs regarding second homes and expenses - which UKIP was recently forced to repay some £100,000, which according to Farage is a "small donation". Tell that to people doing three jobs and 60/70hrs per week for minimum wage to feed their children....

So if you want 'elites' I think you are barking up the wrong tree.