2016 Orlando nightclub shooting

[gunnut]

Only law abiding people follow laws. Criminals don't care about "common sense gun restrictions."

How did the Paris shooter get his rifle? I didn't know one could walk into a corner gun store in Paris and buy an AK type rifle.

[gunnut]

Doesn't that impinge on the First Amendment guarantees freedoms concerning religion, and the Fourth Amendment originally enforced the notion that “each man’s home is his castle”, secure from unreasonable searches. It protects against arbitrary arrests, and is the basis of the law regarding search warrants, stop-and-frisk, safety inspections, wiretaps, and other forms of surveillance, as well as being central to many other criminal law topics and to privacy law.

Are you against "common sense" restrictions on dangerous thoughts and gatherings?

[gunnut]

Again, why are we talking about restricting a CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT rather than going after the terrorists? The fucker actually swore allegiance to IS! He was investigated. FBI knew about him, just like FBI knew about the shooters in San Bernardino. What happened? No one connected the dots? Is Obama as incompetent as Bush at connecting dots? How many dots do we need to connect?

[Dazed]

Yes. Yes it is.

The 49 victims had their rights taken away by a lone individual. I can live with that.

What I cannot live with is the government as an institution taking the rights of the population away to "protect" us.

If the answer is yes to the question. "Second Amendment overrule the other nine amendments" Why is it the Second and not the First? If the answer to the question: is the Second Amendment so black and white it forbids any restrictions? . Yes it is. Than why can't I buy a surplus Scud, land mine, or grenades for my M-79 for protection of the families Idaho vacation home?

.[/QUOTE] The 49 victims had their rights taken away by a lone individual. I can live with that.[/QUOTE]
You or one of your family members was killed in this situation, you would be fine with it. No need to pursue change or compensation because Omar Mateen right to bear arms and the actions that follow are allowed by the Supreme Constitutional Right the Second.

US history says there are limits to all the US Constitutional Amendments.

[Dazed]

Are you against "common sense" restrictions on dangerous thoughts and gatherings?

Like maybe restricting access of firearms to people who shouldn't have them? Preventing the slaughter of civilians in their day to day lives, everything should be subject to review.

[surfgun]

Commercial sales of the AR-15 goes back to at least 1963. The Dems have screaming about them since the 1980's. All of this screaming has increased AR-15 sales to the point that they are the most popular rifles in the land to the point that are over 8,000,000 in civilian circulation. They are not going anywhere. So, everyone needs to get over it!
Continuing to call for a ban will just increase sales.

[troung]

If the answer is yes to the question. "Second Amendment overrule the other nine amendments" Why is it the Second and not the First? If the answer to the question: is the Second Amendment so black and white it forbids any restrictions? . Yes it is. Than why can't I buy a surplus Scud, land mine, or grenades for my M-79 for protection of the families Idaho vacation home?

Time to stop pretending that the Second means nothing. The far left believes in divining rights out of the 14th, often concerning things illegal or no-go at the time those bills were passed, but wants to gut the 2nd. I'm not fine gutting the first over this issue, but it is damn indicative that immediately the regressives were out there calling to continue to chip away at the second.

Again, why are we talking about restricting a CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT rather than going after the terrorists? The fucker actually swore allegiance to IS! He was investigated. FBI knew about him, just like FBI knew about the shooters in San Bernardino. What happened? No one connected the dots? Is Obama as incompetent as Bush at connecting dots? How many dots do we need to connect?

Gay Muslim terrorist the FBI knew about and who struck a privileged minority group that another privileged minority group hates - yeah let's keep this one on guns.

[Cactus]

Is it OK to restrict and tax every single muslim in this country? No, and I will be the first to oppose that. So why is it OK to restrict and tax every single gun owners when they practice their CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT?

Any federal taxes on arms, ammunition and reloading equipment will be through excise and import taxes -- i.e. taxes on the manufacturers and importers. Obviously they will bundle the tax-costs into the price and passed on to the customers, but the customer isn't taxed directly.

We effectively do the same with immigration via caps on immigration -- think of it as an opportunity tax if the immigrant is "manufactured" in China, India or Mexico -- and no one complains much about it because the taxing is done at the source. As Parihaka once very cuttingly observed, we in the West have become overly delicate about treating religious identities and dogma; there is no reason why they shouldn't be treated just like any other political ideology and identity, and dealt with in the same way as we deal with the latter factors when making immigration policy.

[Dazed]

Again, why are we talking about restricting a CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT rather than going after the terrorists? The fucker actually swore allegiance to IS! He was investigated. FBI knew about him, just like FBI knew about the shooters in San Bernardino. What happened? No one connected the dots? Is Obama as incompetent as Bush at connecting dots? How many dots do we need to connect?

Adam Lanza, Eric David Harris, Dylan Bennet Klebold not Muslim,

Problems are complex. It is easy to come up with knee jerk reaction that do nothing to solve the problem. This includes total or no prohibitions on fire arms. The solution will require a number of changes in many areas.

Plane crashes. The crews have thousands of hours. The make and model of aircraft has flown for years. It crashes, hundreds die. The crew f up no need to change anything. The crew is dead that won't happen again. No the incident is investigated, everything is looked at. Pandemics ditto. Mass shooting fall into the same category.

Constitutional Rights are very, very important but not monolithic or unquestionable. The Bill of Rights (1-10)did not prohibit slavery so the 13th Amendment. 21rst Amendment repeals the 18th. etc

[tbm3fan]

.

So why is it OK to restrict and tax every single gun owners when they practice their CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT?

Who said that so far? No one that I can tell. I am ok with handguns, shot guns and rifles. However, I believe assault rifles, which can be made automatic, should be heavily controlled like the Thompson machine gun. Or, are you going to argue that the Thompson shouldn't have any controls and be available to anyone because it is covered by the 2nd. Whether that would matter since the cat has been out of the bag so long I don't know.

[tbm3fan]

If the person himself claims it is an ISIS attack and ISIS kindof claims it as one of their attacks, then why wouldn't it be an ISIS attack?
The fact that there was no direct coordination from ISIS does not exclude leaderless resistance as the reason for the attack.

Mentally unbalanced people make all sorts of claims to justify what they do. The soup du jour of today would be ISIS.

As far as ISIS taking credit, why not? There is no downside to doing so for them and by doing so they can instill a little doubt and fear in others.

[tbm3fan]

Yes. Yes it is.

The 49 victims had their rights taken away by a lone individual. I can live with that.

What I cannot live with is the government as an institution taking the rights of the population away to "protect" us.

Whoa. You can live with 49 people getting killed that easily? Cold hearted aren't you? Would you say that if family members were lost? Can you say that to the face of all those families who lost loved ones?

What I find absolutely intriguing is your selective stance on rights. Sort of like I'm fine with taxes... on the other guy. I like my right to own weapons but I'd really like some others to lose their rights. I need to check my dictionary once again concerning hypocrite.

[tbm3fan]

Just what we need. A revival.

http://www.sfgate.com/local/politics...ee-8160109.php

The Cold War-era House Un-American Activities Committee should be revived to wage a war on Islamic extremism, according to ex-U.S. House Speaker Newt Gingrich, who is running hard to be Donald Trump's running mate.

"We're going to ultimately declare war on Islamic supremacists and we're going to say, 'If you pledge allegiance to (the Islamic State, or ISIS) you are traitor and you've lost your citizenship.' And we're going to take much tougher positions," Gingrich said Monday on Fox & Friends.

Gingrich was discussing the Orlando massacre, committed by an American-born U.S. citizen from Port St. Lucie, Florida, who called 911 during the killing spree at the Pulse nightclub to declare his support for ISIS.

The House Un-American Activities Committee was known for often-questionable "investigations" of suspected communists. The committee broadened its mandate to target civil rights groups as well as 1960s advocates for a ban on nuclear weapons testing.

Its tactics drew scathing criticism, such as a probe into the venerable ban-the-bomb group Women Strike for Peace.

A famous drawing by Washington Post cartoonist Herbert Block ("Herblock") showed a congressman arriving at the hearing and whispering to a colleague: "What's un-American today, women or peace?"

Gingrich noted that HUAC, as the panel was known, came into being in 1938 to ferret out both Nazis and communists operating in the United States.

"We passed several laws in 1938 and 1939 to go after Nazis and we made it illegal to help the Nazis," he said. "We're going to presently have to take similar steps here."

Gingrich is not the first to make the suggestion. Rep. Steve King, R-Iowa, a loud opponent of immigration reform, was quoted by MSNBC voicing support for a new HUAC and saying: "I think that is a good process and I would support it."

Ex-Rep. (and 2012 presidential candidate) Michele Bachmann memorably said during the 2008 campaign that Congress should be investigated to "find out if they are pro-America or anti-America."

The hearings of HUAC were famous for demanding that witnesses name names. If they refused, a contempt sentence followed, and following that a place on blacklists of suspected communist sympathizers (or "Comsymps" in the parlance of the 1960s far-right). The blacklist meant becoming jobless and unemployable.

A similar panel in Congress' upper chamber, the Senate Internal Security Subcommittee, was chaired by Mississippi's arch-segregationist Sen. James Eastland and "investigated" communist influence in the 1960s civil rights leadership.

Four newly elected Washington Democratic congressmen took what was then considered a radical step in 1965 by voting against funding of the House Un-American Activities Committee. Only 53 colleagues had the courage to join them.

Eventually, the House made attempts to gussy up HUAC, in 1969 renaming it the House Internal Security Committee.

The post-Watergate Congress abolished the committee in 1975.

[Parihaka]

you purge all the time. Much of this is ongoing, whether racial, cultural or polical.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...2005Mar28.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Media_Elite#Findings
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-C...3_21st_century this of course covers the Irish as well
http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2016...geted-scandal/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Histor..._United_States
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nativi...#United_States

[DOR]

So, how are those laws restricting undesirables from gun ownership working out?
Pretty poorly, it seems.

Does that mean laws can't work, or that these laws -- varied by state -- are not working?
I'll go with the latter.

Those who believe in the sanctity of the original intent of the founding fathers when they wrote the constitution, should recognize that "arms" were muzzle-loading flintlocks, bladed weapons and cannon. They should also accept that the phrase "for the purpose of a well ordered militia" was not tossed in as an after thought.

Guns kill more Americans than terrorists, including home-grown ones using guns.
It is a national health issue.
We need a vaccination program.