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  • Originally posted by DonBelt View Post
    Iron ram? CSS Virginia vs USS Cumberland?
    Bingo, below is a chart that shows the evolution of the Battleship bow. Now I recognize that the later Battleships might not of had reinforced Rams but it is interesting how long that feature survived in the minds of naval architects.
    It's a lot like the human Coccyx, a vestige of evolution.

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/donn_thorson/8014707326/
    Craig Johnson

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    • What you are calling a "Bow Ram" shaped hull, actually an Inverted or bulbious bow, was used because it provided stability especially for firing guns. A leftover from trimblehull ships.
      Not reinforced, not a weapon.

      Fell out of favor once ships were able to go over 20 knots. They tended to dive into the waves making for a wet ride.

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      • Originally posted by Gun Grape View Post
        What you are calling a "Bow Ram" shaped hull, actually an Inverted or bulbious bow, was used because it provided stability especially for firing guns. A leftover from trimblehull ships.
        Not reinforced, not a weapon.

        Fell out of favor once ships were able to go over 20 knots. They tended to dive into the waves making for a wet ride.
        Right. A bulbous bow (the bigger the better) carries your bow wave WITH the ship so the rest of the hull does not have to push away too much water. That's why Dolphins/Porpoises can swim as fast as the ship. They are riding in your own bow wave.

        As a matter of fact, besides the corrosion problems we had with New Jersey's forefoot skeg and paravane eye, I had it replaced with a bulbous bow which David Taylor proved ages ago with his model test basins. (page 197, 204 & 205 of my book). It was already a semi-bulbous bow except for that paravane eye that caused so much turbulence it actually ate a hole into the 7" IPS chain pipe and flooded the forepeak tank.

        Before you dig out your steel pipe manuals, 7" IPS pipe (and all other odd numbered pipe sizes above that) was deleted from manufacture. So only the Iowa and New Jersey had 7" chain pipes but the Missouri and Wisconsin have 8" IPS chain pipes.

        Oh, Gun Grape: When you typed "trimblehull", didn't you mean "tumblehome" instead where the breadth of the main deck is narrower than at the waterline?












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        Able to leap tall tales in a single groan.

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        • The bulbous bow ....

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Jm3E3kClUE

          After Harry Truman finishes his remarks you'll get a very clear view of the Bulbous Bow at 3:25......




          Originally posted by RustyBattleship View Post
          Right. A bulbous bow (the bigger the better) carries your bow wave WITH the ship so the rest of the hull does not have to push away too much water. That's why Dolphins/Porpoises can swim as fast as the ship. They are riding in your own bow wave.

          As a matter of fact, besides the corrosion problems we had with New Jersey's forefoot skeg and paravane eye, I had it replaced with a bulbous bow which David Taylor proved ages ago with his model test basins. (page 197, 204 & 205 of my book). It was already a semi-bulbous bow except for that paravane eye that caused so much turbulence it actually ate a hole into the 7" IPS chain pipe and flooded the forepeak tank.

          Before you dig out your steel pipe manuals, 7" IPS pipe (and all other odd numbered pipe sizes above that) was deleted from manufacture. So only the Iowa and New Jersey had 7" chain pipes but the Missouri and Wisconsin have 8" IPS chain pipes.

          Oh, Gun Grape: When you typed "trimblehull", didn't you mean "tumblehome" instead where the breadth of the main deck is narrower than at the waterline?












          0

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          • LBNSY and the Bulbous Bow of the Mighty MO ...

            Originally posted by blidgepump View Post
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Jm3E3kClUE

            After Harry Truman finishes his remarks you'll get a very clear view of the Bulbous Bow at 3:25......
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lDUXBqyyIU4&t=1159s

            13:25 illustrates the Bulbous Bow of the Missouri at LBNSY....

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            • Originally posted by blidgepump View Post
              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lDUXBqyyIU4&t=1159s

              13:25 illustrates the Bulbous Bow of the Missouri at LBNSY....
              So sorry about that. The clip you show ALSO shows the Paravane Eye at the Forefoot Skeg of the bow. All four Iowa class BB's were built with the same "bulbous bow" but with the Paravane Eye at the Forefoot Skeg. ONLY the New Jersey had the Paravane Eye cut off and the bow plating replaced with a "smooth" bow.

              I know. I was the one who designed it and have inspected all four BB-61 Battleships in Dry Dock.

              THAT was my job.
              Able to leap tall tales in a single groan.

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              • Where did the Naval term "As the Crow fly's" originate?
                Craig Johnson

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                • Originally posted by Battleship IOWA View Post
                  Where did the Naval term "As the Crow fly's" originate?
                  It's a naval term? Is it?


                  The earliest known citation of the phrase, which explicitly defines its meaning, comes in The London Review Of English And Foreign Liturature, by W. Kenrick - 1767:
                  The Spaniaad [sic], if on foot, always travels as the crow flies, which the openness and dryness of the country permits; neither rivers nor the steepest mountains stop his course, he swims over the one and scales the other.

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                  • Originally posted by tbm3fan View Post
                    It's a naval term? Is it?


                    The earliest known citation of the phrase, which explicitly defines its meaning, comes in The London Review Of English And Foreign Liturature, by W. Kenrick - 1767:
                    The Spaniaad [sic], if on foot, always travels as the crow flies, which the openness and dryness of the country permits; neither rivers nor the steepest mountains stop his course, he swims over the one and scales the other.
                    I should of been more clear.
                    Where did the term "As the Crow fly's" as used by mariners originate?
                    Craig Johnson

                    Comment


                    • As the crow flies is an idiom ....

                      Originally posted by tbm3fan View Post
                      It's a naval term? Is it?


                      The earliest known citation of the phrase, which explicitly defines its meaning, comes in The London Review Of English And Foreign Liturature, by W. Kenrick - 1767:
                      The Spaniaad [sic], if on foot, always travels as the crow flies, which the openness and dryness of the country permits; neither rivers nor the steepest mountains stop his course, he swims over the one and scales the other.
                      There goes the neighborhood... I though the phase was an idiom not a naval term... though there is the phase from Mutiny on the Bounty of the Helmsman keeping the wake as straight as a rooster's tail....

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by tbm3fan View Post
                        It's a naval term? Is it?


                        The earliest known citation of the phrase, which explicitly defines its meaning, comes in The London Review Of English And Foreign Liturature, by W. Kenrick - 1767:
                        The Spaniaad [sic], if on foot, always travels as the crow flies, which the openness and dryness of the country permits; neither rivers nor the steepest mountains stop his course, he swims over the one and scales the other.
                        Synonymous for straight line distance
                        Last edited by Dazed; 10 May 17,, 02:15.

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                        • Originally posted by blidgepump View Post
                          There goes the neighborhood... I though the phase was an idiom not a naval term... though there is the phase from Mutiny on the Bounty of the Helmsman keeping the wake as straight as a rooster's tail....
                          Not to worry blidgepump because it's still a beautiful day in the neighborhood. https://youtu.be/6PHCZofULqQ?t=24
                          Last edited by Battleship IOWA; 10 May 17,, 06:43.
                          Craig Johnson

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                          • This question is also related to the Naval term "Crow's Nest".
                            Craig Johnson

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                            • Recent research has found some crow species capable of not only tool use, but also tool construction. Crows are now considered to be among the world's most intelligent animals with an encephalization quotient equal to that of many non-human primates.
                              Craig Johnson

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                              • Maybe this was too easy but I never heard this before.

                                "In the old days of sail, Crows were employed by navigators’ to aid in finding land when they thought they were closing on land but were not sure what direction land laid. The navigator would release a crow. Because crows were land birds, they would fly directly toward land, the navigator would then plot a course based on the direction the bird was flying. The were used most when the weather was very cloudy and foggy, But there is the more to the story, the crows were kept high on the main mast, they were fed by the members of the crew who were on lookout watch in the same structure of the mast which became known as the “Crows’ Nest.”

                                Steve Tibbetts, Chief Gunner’s Mate USN (ret.) USS Iowa Volunteer
                                The question is open.
                                Craig Johnson

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