2018 Toronto Van Murders

[snapper]

Alot of women fight. I suppose that does not make them some ill conceived idealised image of a Mater in your terms so ignore it. Not all Ladies want to be Mothers, not all want to sit at home and look after men and small people. Try treating us as the individuals we are - not a categorised gender - and you may be treated with the same respect back!

[Versus]

In the expanded view, what I said is that, at its core, woman's default social behavior is fundamentally anti-social and that has nothing to do with her personality or morality. It is a biologically driven, by her sexual prerogatives and directives. Her biological drive to mate with the most dominant man in the hierarchy so in order for her to do so, hierarchy must exist and it must be based on dominance. The moment you have dominance, you have oppression. This means that utopias of equality and rights are nothing more than a fables and that striving towards them is an waste of time.
That is why every civilization is fundamentally based on woman's oppression and submission. On violation of her biological prerogatives. But that is done not because of the hate towards women, but because it is not possible to build advanced society based on her biological urges. Muslim societies use 90% of their energy on the maintenance of this system and the price for that is that they are permanently stuck in time. Yes, they have population but nothing else from that. Their anger comes exactly from this source, from hatred that woman has towards arranged marriage and her submissive position that she projects, in secret, on to society by being submissive and glorifying the man. Just so that more men can waste their life in the pursuit of their "divine" goal aka by blowing themselves up or to wage senseless wars. That is why they are permanently stuck in the teenage days, in the delusions of omnipotence. Just as Alek and Eliot immature, narcissistic crime actions were.

[Versus]

Alot of women fight. I suppose that does not make them some ill conceived idealised image of a Mater in your terms so ignore it. Not all Ladies want to be Mothers, not all want to sit at home and look after men and small people. Try treating us as the individuals we are - not a categorised gender - and you may be treated with the same respect back!

But I do.

[snapper]

Most men want children too but you do not so readily categorise the male gender.

[Oracle]

Lot of dark thoughts. Some secrets are out. This thread infuriates me and Snapper. And the Colonel doesn't give a shit.

[GVChamp]

Two things

An unattractive guy isn't likely to be with some one attractive so it balances out because like women they compensate in other ways. See Ironduke's signature. And all this attractive or not business becomes less important with age. Health becomes the key factor then

A guy doesn't have to be attractive to get some one attractive. I've seen this so many times that it beggars belief. Why because we are conditioned by media. Which is one big fiction.



Guess the girl next door just sits there unrequitted then. These guys are going after something impossible and getting upset when they find its impossible. Can always get lucky and then that one experience will teach them good

Expectations

I have a bad feeling about these incels. If the public reads about what they are, they are only going to get victimised further. Given how easy it is to be mean. i hate social media for this reason its just a cess pool of utter crap

Forums is as far as it goes

You're being conditioned by media to see that male attractiveness isn't really a big deal and guys got a pretty sweet deal. They really don't. It really, really, really sucks being the average guy. I've run the gamut between hideously unattractive, passably acceptable, and honestly attractive, and it is a world of difference.

Yeah, guys can "make up" for their lack of attractiveness, but it's still an uphill battle.

Obviously the best strategy is just to wait until you get older. Because you'll keep getting attractive as you fill out muscle, build a cool life with travel, earn more money, become more confident...and women become substantially less attractive. The downside is that good partners interested in marriage get attached and married while they are young. The longer you wait, the fewer partners are available.

For a lot of these guys, getting a GF isn't impossible, but it's pretty damn near impossible due to a combination of merely average or below average attractiveness, and most importantly personality traits. And these personality traits aren't BAD, just not conducive to courtship. I am going to see Avengers with a buddy of mine who is superficially fine (dresses well, average face, architect) but has a terribly boring personality punctuated by bouts of Jon Stewart-sarcasm and a total inability to take the lead. So he went on something like 80 first dates with absolutely no second dates, and sort of just fell into his marriage with a woman who was "Ready" and just decided to take the lead.

I dug myself out of that hole, so anyone can, but it requires some rather significant personality overhaul for a lot of these guys. Also, girls are going to have get used to taking some initiative, because of a lot of the guys have just been brow-beaten into never talking to girls. And I am not talking about going up to the guys YOU find immediately attractive, I mean talking to every Tom, Dick, and Harry.

Whatevs, I'm married so I don't have to worry about this until I have kids that get flung into this crap. And even then, they'll have to figure it out on their own.

I'm not really afraid of people on the internet regardless, though. Aunt had a heart-attack, which is way more likely to kill people than some internet loser who can't get laid.

[Ironduke]

Lot of dark thoughts. Some secrets are out. This thread infuriates me and Snapper. And the Colonel doesn't give a shit.

I'm not sure whose posts you're referring to exactly - but a few of us have simply pointed that there are far better alternatives to nursing an obsessive hatred of women and becoming the Toronto Van Murderer.

The kid was sexually frustrated, a celibate, and self-radicalized himself into a murderous ideology. I don't see what's wrong with pointing out that if you're really that hard up for female companionship, there are ways you can get it where nobody gets hurt, and the both of you part happily, with both having got what they want.

Some may disagree with that on moral and ethical grounds, but isn't that better than murdering a bunch of women?

[Ironduke]

Obviously the best strategy is just to wait until you get older. Because you'll keep getting attractive as you fill out muscle, build a cool life with travel, earn more money, become more confident...and women become substantially less attractive.

If I ever get married, I'm waiting (for marriage/cohabitation) until 50. Around that age, I might just then see if I can find a decade younger, somewhat attractive spinster who's infertile.

Until then, it's basically this: https://youtu.be/92gP2J0CUjc?t=92

[Double Edge]

You're being conditioned by media to see that male attractiveness isn't really a big deal and guys got a pretty sweet deal. They really don't. It really, really, really sucks being the average guy. I've run the gamut between hideously unattractive, passably acceptable, and honestly attractive, and it is a world of difference.

Yeah, guys can "make up" for their lack of attractiveness, but it's still an uphill battle., less so for a guy

Not media, it was a comment by some one who ran a dating site. The women have it harder. A woman that isn't attractive will find it harder than a guy. A woman has to be somewhat attractive less for a guy. He just needs to be able to provide.

Am still standing by what i said earlier, never envy someone with an attractive partner, you don't know what they put up with

[Ironduke]

Not media, it was a comment by some one who ran a dating site. The women have it harder. A woman that isn't attractive will find it harder than a guy. A woman has to be somewhat attractive less for a guy. He just needs to be able to provide.

Am still standing by what i said earlier, never envy someone with an attractive partner, you don't know what they put up with

Less attractive women do seem to make up for it with better personalities.

[Double Edge]

The kid was sexually frustrated, a celibate, and self-radicalized himself into a murderous ideology. I don't see what's wrong with pointing out that if you're really that hard up for female companionship, there are ways you can get it where nobody gets hurt, and the both of you part happily, with both having got what they want.

I don't get why this Massinian guy could't figure that out himself or are the options you mention forbidden by these people. Some stigma attached. They can be in conservative religious circles of any denomination.

One wonders what his reasons were.

Some may disagree with that on moral and ethical grounds, but isn't that better than murdering a bunch of women?

Exactly

It doesn't even have to go to such an extreme, at some point meat is meat and men gotta eat.

[Ironduke]

I don't get why this Massinian guy could't figure that out himself or are the options you mention forbidden by these people.

No idea what the laws are in Toronto concerning certain practices, but that being said, massages that feature everything and anything except the part that is illegal are available everywhere in the US and Canada. One can go to them, or they can come to one.

One can simply make an appointment for one or two hour sessions every couple of weeks or so, and as a bonus he might even learn how to talk to women, and learn how their minds work, if he keeps at it for a few years.

Some stigma attached. They can be in conservative religious circles of any denomination.

In my opinion, anyone who publicly goes about shaming and stigmatizing people for these things has psychiatric problems.

[Double Edge]

No idea what the laws are in Toronto concerning certain practices, but that being said, massages that feature everything and anything except the part that is illegal are available everywhere in the US and Canada. One can go to them, or they can come to one.

One can simply make an appointment for one or two hour sessions every couple of weeks or so, and as a bonus he might even learn how to talk to women, and learn how their minds work, if he keeps at it for a few years.

Again N/A as far as Toronto is concerned. Quite frankly this incident is not the sort of thing one expects to happen in a place like Canada or the US where anything and everything is available on a competitive basis.

In my opinion, anyone who publicly goes about and stigmatizes people for these things has psychiatric problems.

They call it peer pressure, Circles i kept that were anything but religious looked down on this sort of thing. Its funny how these red lines are drawn arbitrarily in groups.

What Clinton said applies. don't ask, don't tell. Simple.

[Ironduke]

don't ask, don't tell. Simple.

With certain people, especially friends, certainly tell.

If they judge you or tell other people what you confided in them, you know they can't be trusted and they're not your friend. ;-)

Easy way to separate the wheat from the chaff.*

*this stratagem might not be applicable in countries such as India. Works very well in the West, as long as you're a private citizen and don't work for the government

Again N/A as far as Toronto is concerned. Quite frankly this incident is not the sort of thing one expects to happen in a place like Canada or the US where anything and everything is available on a competitive basis.

Can you clarify what you mean by this? What is non-applicable as far as Toronto is concerned?

[Versus]

Its not the sex that they wanted, they wanted intimacy and love, although they interpreted that as sex. In both cases, Eliot's and Alek's it was the vision of reality that was perceived by them to be worse than death, that compelled them to commit these acts. Both cases were suicides in essence, while the murders were just the mechanics that would ensure that. In order to get the girls, they need to be Chad and they hate Chad but want the girl. So in a way, they have to destroy themselves in order to become a Chad. Many of them don't see themselves to be bad, they don's see the reasons why they need to destroy themselves in order to become Chads so they project that inner conflict onto the world. They want the world to conform to them not vice versa.