Kyoto Tax

[bigross86]

What about Cold Fusion? Or is that even more of a pipe dream?

[Praxus]

Now what party of the country is this fusion power plant providing power to?

None, I never claimed that it did. And since I said that it takes more energy then it produces as of now it couldn't yet.

What about Cold Fusion? Or is that even more of a pipe dream?

In order for Fusion you need either a mix of high pressure and high tempatures(for example the sun). On Earth we can not produce the pressure required to create fusion at lower tempatures, therefor we have to create tempatures hotter then the sun to produce fusion(about 100 million degrees C).

Cold Fusion might be possible maybe 40-60 years from now, but thats a long way off.

[Ironduke]

None, I never claimed that it did. And since I said that it takes more energy then it produces as of now it couldn't yet.

I didn't say you did. It was a rhetorical question that I already knew the answer to.

In order for Fusion you need either a mix of high pressure and high tempatures(for example the sun). On Earth we can not produce the pressure required to create fusion at lower tempatures, therefor we have to create tempatures hotter then the sun to produce fusion(about 100 million degrees C).

Cold Fusion might be possible maybe 40-60 years from now, but thats a long way off.

Thanks for making my point. It's a theoretical process that is a looong time away from any application, if at all.

Solar panels and capacitors already exist, however. They key is making them more efficient and reducing the costs, much as has happened with microprocessors and superconductors.

[Praxus]

Thanks for making my point. It's a theoretical process that is a looong time away from any application, if at all.

I said COLD FUSION won't happen for another 40-60 years. We can already make Fusion we just need to perfect it to get the energy we want out of it.

Solar panels and capacitors already exist, however. They key is making them more efficient and reducing the costs, much as has happened with microprocessors and superconductors.

Now who is going to force companies to develope it?

[Trooth]

At this moment in time Fusion reactors are essentially an academic plaything they are not contributing any energy to the planet but waste a lot of money not doing it.

Solar power currently contributes happily in many places around the world. In fact even the "pay and display" machines in car parks in rainy old England are powered by solar panels.

Fusion may well start to be practical. But it is likely to become practical sooner if people started using more energy efficient stuff and the driver for that will be solar power. The usage of solar power has made many electronic components more efficient.

But the reality is that we will get what ever the big corporate lobbies want us to get, and as "the city" only looks ahead to the next quarterly results this will be more fossil fuel usage.

[Ironduke]

Originally posted by Praxus
I said COLD FUSION won't happen for another 40-60 years. We can already make Fusion we just need to perfect it to get the energy we want out of it.



Now who is going to force companies to develope it?

Tell me, who is going to force companies to develop fusion power plants?

As for solar panels, nobody needs to force anybody to develop solar panel technology, it's already being done.

Scientists have developed single-crystalline wafers that reach 24% efficiency, and multicrystalline silicon that have reached 18%.

[Trooth]

The trouble with Fusion

Fusion project decision delayed

ITER - NUCLEAR FUSION PROJECT

The international project is estimated to cost $12bn over the next 10 years
It will produce the first sustained fusion reactions
Iter is the final stage before a commercial reactor is built
A decision on where to site the world's first big nuclear fusion reactor has been postponed until next year.
Officials from several countries meeting in Washington were divided on whether to build the international reactor in France or Japan.

The US has been against the French option because of France's opposition to the US-led invasion of Iraq.

Nuclear fusion holds out the promise of virtually limitless pollution-free energy.


Experts say the country hosting the International Thermonuclear Experimental Reactor (Iter) project will gain a potentially-lucrative head start in expertise and technology.

Pros and cons

Representatives from the US, EU, Japan, Russia, China and South Korea were hoping to make a final decision on the location of the project.

"At the end of the meeting... t was agreed by all parties present that no definite choice could be made at this stage," France's research ministry said in a statement.

A French Government envoy at the meeting, Pierre Lellouche, said the matter would be deferred until next year, probably mid-February.

The Japanese site of Rokkasho-mura has the advantages of proximity to a port, a ground of solid bedrock and a nearby US military base.

The French site at Cadarache offers an existing research facility and a more moderate climate.

Iter consortium
European Union
United States
Russia
China
Japan
South Korea

The experts were supposed to reach a consensus based on objective criteria.

But BBC News Online science editor Dr David Whitehouse says the decision is highly political, involving huge amounts of horse-trading behind the scenes.

Delegates were hoping, he says, that one of the countries involved would drop out and so avoid the need for a vote.

The European Union, Russia and China are backing France - but South Korea, the United States and Tokyo itself are reported to be favouring Japan.

The US, in particular, has raised objections to the French option, citing its opposition to the Iraq invasion.

"We have the structure, scientific and technical environment to ensure that this scheme can start up with competence, expertise and solid safety guarantees," French Research Minister Claudie Haignere said.

"If our site is chosen, Japan will cover the costs that are needed," said Hidekazu Tanaka, a senior official of the Japanese Education, Culture, Sports, Science and Technology ministry.

Self-sustaining

Iter is the boldest nuclear initiative since the Manhattan Project - the effort to build the first atom bomb, says Dr Whitehouse.


It would also be the world's largest international co-operative research and development project after the International Space Station.

Scientists say it will be the first fusion device to produce thermal energy at the level of an electricity-producing power station.

Its goal will be to produce 500 megawatts of fusion power for 500 seconds or longer during each individual fusion experiment and, in doing so, demonstrate essential technologies for a commercial reactor.

But they are all agreed that taming the power of the Sun will not be easy.

The super hot gas in which the fusion takes place is notoriously difficult to control.

The gas, termed a plasma, has to be kept hot and contained for fusion to take place. So far, no one has achieved a prolonged self-sustaining fusion event.

Advocates of fusion power point out that if they succeed, there is an almost limitless supply of power available because the deuterium atoms on which it would be based can be derived from seawater.

In nuclear fusion, atoms are brought together, as opposed to nuclear fission in which energy is released by splitting the atom.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/3336701.stm