2017 American Political Scene

[Monash]

You just described 90% of the 535 members of Congress.

Yep, in fact on those occasions when I've put my mind to contemplating my 'ideal' democratic model I've often thought one of the first conditions would be the mandatory screening of potential candidates for office for any of the various personality disorders listed in the psychiatric guides. A sort of 'No sociopaths need apply' clause in my constitution.

[Bigfella]

Too bad...I was enjoying the show. The handwriting was on the wall from day 1. His so called interview with the New Yorker guy iced it.

I'm with you JAD. I had high hopes for the Mooch. He was pure comedy gold and a human bulldozer to boot. Six months of Mooch action would probably have been the highlight of this Administration.

[Bigfella]

Thank you.

He won't respect them, he can't respect them. He can't respect anyone but himself. He's also not capable of understanding that there's a problem, much less getting to work on it.

This is not a rational, mentally-stable person we're dealing with. He cannot do any of those things. It's simply impossible for him.

I know I sound angry but it's more of a cold assessment of the man based on prior personal experience.

I've worked for multiple people exactly like him in the past, for 7 years straight. Day after day, month after month, a few trusted coworkers and I would attempt to explain their actions or hope that "maybe this time they'll change." We were trying to rationalize irrationality, not unlike beating one's head against a brick wall.

Donald Trump is no different than my former employers, in fact he's far worse.

People who have never personally dealt with a sociopathic personality have a great deal of difficulty (almost an impossibility) understanding what they're dealing with. In this case, the American people.

Fortunately I haven't has a boss like this, but I've had co-workers & people in friendship circles. They can act like they get it, but deep down they never do.

The one thing I could see turning Trump around is that he recognizes that he is in danger of public humiliation and takes good advice in order to prevent that - his ego forcing him to do it. That is one of the most fascinating aspects of the next 3 years - can he learn on the job. I'm not confident he can, and I'm damned pleased I'm on the other side of the Pacific.

Oh it'll be nice for a while. Then Trump will do or tweet something heinous and Gen. Kelly will resign, OR Gen. Kelly will tell Trump "No" or something similar and Gen. Kelly will be fired.

When you're dealing with a sociopath, these things are almost scripted.

Yep. A mere 11 days ago he was listening to the Mooch and giving him significant authority. Flash to yesterday & he publicly humiliated a guy he has known for years. Things can change quickly in Trumpworld.

Kelly might be able to lessen the chaos for a while, but he isn't really in charge. How long will Ivanka & Jared be prepared to abide the new rules? How about Bannon? How long until they start doing end runs around Kelly - perhaps at one of those regular weekends in Florida? How many times will Trump let an employee tell him 'no'?

I would LOVE to be a fly on the wall when any combination of Mattis, Kelly & McMaster are alone in a room together. That would be worth hearing. :-D

[TopHatter]

How many times will Trump let an employee tell him 'no'?

That's exactly why no one with an ounce of integrity will last in the Trump Administration.

[Albany Rifles]

Best line about the firing.....

There are some BBQ recipes that take longer than the Mooch's tenure!

And, yes, I worked for 2 different boss's like Trump.

Not fun.

[astralis]

BF,

The one thing I could see turning Trump around is that he recognizes that he is in danger of public humiliation and takes good advice in order to prevent that - his ego forcing him to do it. That is one of the most fascinating aspects of the next 3 years - can he learn on the job. I'm not confident he can, and I'm damned pleased I'm on the other side of the Pacific.

his discipline can only take him so far. when he's under -extreme- duress, he's shown that he can tone it down for oh, about a week. then it breaks and he's back to his old antics. (see: his response to the grab 'em video).

it's worse now because he -won-, and thus in his mind all the people who told him to turn off his Twitter/etc during the campaign were all wrong.

[snapper]

My denunciations of Donald Trump are not an endorsement of any other candidate or politician, nor a commentary on current events.

Mine neither! Hilary certainly had her problems. I am not a Poroshenko fan at all either but the alternative - Tymoshenko - would have been far worse in my view. Then again I even voted for PiS in Poland but they turned out to be barmy and I pray they get out asap. Duda (and his Party) and Poroshenko may be idiots or completely nuts in some cases but they are honest fools and not traitors.

[Bigfella]

BF,



his discipline can only take him so far. when he's under -extreme- duress, he's shown that he can tone it down for oh, about a week. then it breaks and he's back to his old antics. (see: his response to the grab 'em video).

it's worse now because he -won-, and thus in his mind all the people who told him to turn off his Twitter/etc during the campaign were all wrong.

Agree with all of that and I think it is by far the most likely outcome. I would also point out, however, that during the campaign he did show some ability to change direction under pressure and salvage a seemingly hopeless situation. I don't hang too much off that observation except to point out that nothing is foreordained.

My other observation would be that having set a pretty rock bottom benchmark thus far, anything remotely competent will look good. The size of the hole is already pretty big and I'm not convinced he knows how to stop digging, but I'm not sure it is yet a bigger task than winning the election.

As I said to TH, the other variable is the Dems. Thus far they have played it pretty well, but danger always lurks. They weren't that far away from putting Keith 'I only use my own name now & promise I din't hang with anti-semites any more' Ellison into the top job at the DNC and there are some genuine nutters & nasties making their way in from the fringe. After 2016 I refuse to under estimate their ability to screw up.

[DOR]

I don’t get this “just because I think The Trumpet is a disaster doesn’t mean I support Hillary” thinking.

In the American political culture, there are only very, very rarely more than two candidates.
1968, 1980 and 1992 are the only ones in my lifetime.

If one thinks The Trumpet is a total disaster, then one must prefer the alternative.
Or, your name is Vladimir Putin.

[snapper]

I don’t get this “just because I think The Trumpet is a disaster doesn’t mean I support Hillary” thinking.

In the American political culture, there are only very, very rarely more than two candidates.
1968, 1980 and 1992 are the only ones in my lifetime.

If one thinks The Trumpet is a total disaster, then one must prefer the alternative.
Or, your name is Vladimir Putin.

My name is not VV Putin or anything Putina. I knew Trumpsky would be a disaster before he won; his narcissism was clear for any to see already and it amazes me that sensible people like TH are now surprised at it. Certainly if I had been a US citizen last year I would have voted for Hilary but that does not mean I endorse her or everything she might have done. Like I said I voted for the current Polish Government (PiS) and at first just thought they were just naive and needed to learn... Sadly I was wrong and they are truly stupid - incurably so. Voting for someone does not endorse all they do nor mean I cannot criticise some or all their policies later. There is no carte blanche to my vote.

[TopHatter]

I don’t get this “just because I think The Trumpet is a disaster doesn’t mean I support Hillary” thinking.

In the American political culture, there are only very, very rarely more than two candidates.
1968, 1980 and 1992 are the only ones in my lifetime.

If one thinks The Trumpet is a total disaster, then one must prefer the alternative.
Or, your name is Vladimir Putin.

Really? You don't get the concept of independent thinking? Your world is that binary?

I don't know how to respond to that.

Wow...just, wow.

[TopHatter]

John Kelly cannot make Trump effective

The excitement — or maybe it’s just relief — among Republicans that greeted John F. Kelly’s ascension to chief of staff may be short-lived. Here are five reasons:

First, this administration has zero legislative accomplishments and seems unable to negotiate with members of its own party. Kelly, who has been openly scornful of Congress, is unlikely to help in that regard. (“If lawmakers do not like the laws they’ve passed and we are charged to enforce, then they should have the courage and skill to change the laws,’’ he said about congressional critics of immigration enforcement. “Otherwise they should shut up and support the men and women on the front lines.’’) That’s a problem as the administration faces deadlines for the debt ceiling and the budget. Ironically, Trump needs help to close deals, and Kelly doesn’t have those skills.

Second, the president refuses to learn in office or master any level of detail. He therefore is far less influential in pressing lawmakers to pass his initiatives. Without understanding individual lawmakers’ objections, his ability to persuade and cajole them is limited to repeating empty talking points. The same problem that afflicted him in the health-care debate will be evident no matter what the topic.

Third, Kelly cannot and should not attempt to defend Trump’s actions regarding Russia. (Kelly doesn’t want to be part of any conspiracy to cover up actions that are now the subject of an FBI investigation.) Moreover, it seems no one — not even Trump’s relatives and lawyers — can prevent him from digging himself a deeper hole. With regard to the revelation that he dictated a misleading statement regarding Donald Trump Jr.’s meeting with Russian officials in 2016, my colleague Aaron Blake notes that the leaked story is a sign of desperation:

In this story, [advisers are] admitting that he is personally responsible for deliberately misleading the American people about a major topic of the Russia investigation. They’re saying that he did something that could very well be construed as a cover-up and could damage his legal defense. The reason? Because they apparently can’t prevail upon him in person and they think he simply doesn’t get what kind of jeopardy he is putting himself in.

Fourth, Kelly is more likely to accentuate Trump’s alienation from Republicans. Already strained because of health reform, the president’s serial outbursts and the Russia scandal, the relationship between Congress and Trump seems more like that between a president and the majority of the other party. In point of fact, Trump’s never really been a Republican (except insofar as he inhabited the party), so this may have been the inevitable course of his presidency. Nevertheless, Kelly has no particular ideological leanings, no ties to the conservative movement and no experience in domestic policy. That leaves Trump even less tethered to his party than he was at the onset of his term. For those rooting for Trump to be stymied and ultimately ejected from the party, this is good news. (House Speaker Paul D. Ryan (R-Wis.) rationalized support for Trump on the grounds he’d help get the GOP agenda through. That goes down as one of the worst political misjudgments in years.)

Fifth, Trump refuses to be disciplined. He rejects the overwhelming sentiment among voters that Twitter is a dangerous distraction. Trump doesn’t agree. He tweeted again Tuesday: “Only the Fake News Media and Trump enemies want me to stop using Social Media (110 million people). Only way for me to get the truth out!” Without a disciplined boss, the administration and Congress will be tied up in whatever controversy of the day Trump creates. Trump remains the obstacle that’s impossible to overcome. As long as he is there, effective leadership will be a fantasy. Link
___________

A quite good op-ed that doesn't lay 100% of the blame on Trump for why Kelly can't and won't have a positive lasting effect on this 3-Ring Circus masquerading as an Administration.

But she does sum up the ultimate problem: Trump remains the obstacle that’s impossible to overcome. As long as he is there, effective leadership will be a fantasy.

[astralis]

joe,

Really? You don't get the concept of independent thinking? Your world is that binary?

I don't know how to respond to that.

Wow...just, wow.

what i think David's trying to get at is the act of voting in a US Presidential election follows from a binary decision, just due to the structure of our system. you can THINK what you like, but if you don't pick from the two, you are essentially abrogating your right to vote.

given the state of the US Libertarian Party, this is essentially the anti-Green Party/Jill Stein argument more than anything else. don't think there were enough "never-Trumpers" from the GOP side to really count for anything.

[TopHatter]

joe,
what i think David's trying to get at is the act of voting in a US Presidential election follows from a binary decision, just due to the structure of our system. you can THINK what you like, but if you don't pick from the two, you are essentially abrogating your right to vote.

So noted, and apologies if I missed the sarcasm. I'm probably just really tired of people saying things like that (seriously or jokingly).

I do have a right to vote, but I also have the right to abstain. "Abrogate" has a nasty connotation of evasion or shirking.

[astralis]

joe,

fair enough, although i detest the Steinian "reject all evil, lesser or not" argument. the US system has ALWAYS been about the lesser evil, however it is you define "evil", because no candidate on earth will have exactly your own viewpoints...other than yourself.

so i have particularly little sympathy for both the Stein folks and the never-Trumpers (not that they care). rejection of reality doesn't make a person more moral, it is just wilful blindness.