We Got the IOWA

[GrayGhost1975]

Better there in LA Harbor than in Brownsville, TX.......

[Gun Grape]

I never understood the need, or want to make the entire class Museum ships. Missouri was historically significant. Glad they saved her. The others not so much.

In Gun Grapes world the other three ships would have been used as parts to bring Mo as close to her WW2 exterior look as possible. What a fitting tribute at Pearl.

[YellowFever]

^ I also agree with this statement.

My reaction to touring the MO was:

"Wow, those are huge guns"

"Wow, this is where WW2 officially ended"

"Wow, I wonder how it felt to be standing right here when those guns fired"

"Wow...huh....that phalanax really looks weird and out of place there...."

[Dreadnought]

I never understood the need, or want to make the entire class Museum ships. Missouri was historically significant. Glad they saved her. The others not so much.

In Gun Grapes world the other three ships would have been used as parts to bring Mo as close to WW2 exterior look as possible. What a fitting tribute at Pearl.

Disagree, Missouri gained her fame due to politics as compared to her time at sea. Truman saw to that and to his daughter having christened her at launch.

New Jersey (which was supposed to have had the surrender ceremony aboard before politics intervened) spent more time at sea and holds more battle stars then the rest was definately well worth preserving.

[surfgun]

It would appear the location is good for Hollywood as last nights NCIS LA appeared to have used the Iowa for scene shots for a fictional CVN.

[Gun Grape]

Disagree, Missouri gained her fame due to politics as compared to her time at sea. Truman saw to that and to his daughter having christened her at launch.

Well she was the ship where the treaty ending WW2 was signed. Much more significant than NJ battle stars for post war service.

[RustyBattleship]

Iowa's role in WW II didn't amount to much? Okay, you "Historians". Look up Iowa's very first mission in WW II where she sailed into the Baltic Sea. What was anchored in Norway at that time and why did it stay there? Because just enough info had been (quote) leaked out (unquoate) that the Iowa could outrun, out manuever and outshoot that dude any time of the day or NIGHT.

It took the entire British Home Fleet to bring down the lead ship of that class, but just one IOWA to keep her huddled up in a safe fjiord (until the Brits built their X-crafts and perfected their Tall Boys).

[Daniel_B]

- First, I wonder what equipment, specifically, you were wanting to salvage from the other 3 ships to backdate the Missouri to her WWII appearance? Considering they're all in basically the same (1980s) fit now? It's not as if you could raid the Iowa for her 40mms, the NJ for her aircraft crane and floatplane catapults, the Wisconsin for her 20mms and WWII-era radars and masts... Sure, you could get four 5" mounts (and you could get those from just 1 ship), but that'd be just a drop in the bucket of the needed stuff. You'd never find originals for anything close to all of it (I imagine that by now the Massachusetts, Alabama, and NC have probably found all of those things from that period that are still in existence). So you'd be forced to resort to lots and lots of phony mock-ups, and if you're making all that stuff, anyway, what's four fake 5"ers, too? Oh, and then of course you'd need a shipyard for lots of major structural work, and probably a couple hundred million $, just to even make her look correct cosmetically. So, I don't think her 3 sisters being tabbed for museum duty is the major roadblock holding up that particular project.

- Second, I'd argue the contention that her sisters' lack historical significance. They don't have the Missouri's 1 claim to fame, sure, but I don't think they exactly pale in comparison to most museum ships. And there's more reason for saving a ship than just its specific, individual history. They also serve to represent the dozens and dozens of ships that can't be saved. A guy might not be able to take his grandkids to the destroyer he served on 40 years ago, because it's long since scrapped, but he can take them to visit the Iowa or Massachusetts or Turner Joy, and give them some idea of what it was like...

- And third, you ask why save the entire class, when just one oughta be enough? Well, it's not as if the Missouri is in a location that's easy to visit for the vast majority of folks. All four are saved, and they're spread out across the country, where many different people have a reasonable opportunity to see at least one. Heck, why did we save all the space shuttles, then? Why not just save one? If a spot can be found for a ship, and it can keep itself economically viable as a museum because enough people continue to wanna go see it, I don't really understand what the complaint is...?

[Gun Grape]

Iowa's role in WW II didn't amount to much? Okay, you "Historians". Look up Iowa's very first mission in WW II where she sailed into the Baltic Sea. What was anchored in Norway at that time and why did it stay there? Because just enough info had been (quote) leaked out (unquoate) that the Iowa could outrun, out manuever and outshoot that dude any time of the day or NIGHT.

It took the entire British Home Fleet to bring down the lead ship of that class, but just one IOWA to keep her huddled up in a safe fjiord (until the Brits built their X-crafts and perfected their Tall Boys).

She stayed in Newfoundland for 2 months at Naval Station Argentia. Just like the USS North Carolina had done.

Washington was the first American BB assigned to the British Home Fleet. She conducted operations with the HMS KG V to include screening for convoys PQ-15-17 (Iceland to Murmask) Her deployment lasted from March - July 42

Two other Battleships were stationed with the British Home Fleet at Scapa Flow. South Dakota and Alabama. Along with the Cruiser Tuscaloosa. Task force 61

Assigned to the Home fleet from Feb to Aug 42. They were involved in Operation Governor along the coast of Norway and in the reinforcement of Svalbard. Where they deployed above the Arctic Circle.

So no Iowas deployment to Newfoundland was not "Historically significant"

[Gun Grape]

- First, I wonder what equipment, specifically, you were wanting to salvage from the other 3 ships to backdate the Missouri to her WWII appearance? Considering they're all in basically the same (1980s) fit now? It's not as if you could raid the Iowa for her 40mms, the NJ for her aircraft crane and floatplane catapults, the Wisconsin for her 20mms and WWII-era radars and masts... Sure, you could get four 5" mounts (and you could get those from just 1 ship), but that'd be just a drop in the bucket of the needed stuff. You'd never find originals for anything close to all of it (I imagine that by now the Massachusetts, Alabama, and NC have probably found all of those things from that period that are still in existence). So you'd be forced to resort to lots and lots of phony mock-ups, and if you're making all that stuff, anyway, what's four fake 5"ers, too? Oh, and then of course you'd need a shipyard for lots of major structural work, and probably a couple hundred million $, just to even make her look correct cosmetically. So, I don't think her 3 sisters being tabbed for museum duty is the major roadblock holding up that particular project.

Scrap the other ships and use that money for restoration of the Missouri. After you use the steel from those ships to provide material for the rebuilding of the Missouri superstructure

Define a "Phony mockup". If you use the original blueprints to build a catapult and crane for the Missouri, is that a phony mockup? Or to build the 40mm and 20mm mounts?

Or do you mean plastic hollywood mockups as phony?

Now that they all have homes, I don't ever see that as being done. That is what I would have done when Missouri was first being considered as a museum ship.

[tbm3fan]

She stayed in Newfoundland for 2 months at Naval Station Argentia. Just like the USS North Carolina had done.

Washington was the first American BB assigned to the British Home Fleet. She conducted operations with the HMS KG V to include screening for convoys PQ-15-17 (Iceland to Murmask) Her deployment lasted from March - July 42

Two other Battleships were stationed with the British Home Fleet at Scapa Flow. South Dakota and Alabama. Along with the Cruiser Tuscaloosa. Task force 61

Assigned to the Home fleet from Feb to Aug 42. They were involved in Operation Governor along the coast of Norway and in the reinforcement of Svalbard. Where they deployed above the Arctic Circle.

So no Iowas deployment to Newfoundland was not "Historically significant"

However, I will say that Iowa was the only BB to have a sitting President sail on for more than a short little publicity jaunt.

[RustyBattleship]

She stayed in Newfoundland for 2 months at Naval Station Argentia. Just like the USS North Carolina had done.

Washington was the first American BB assigned to the British Home Fleet. She conducted operations with the HMS KG V to include screening for convoys PQ-15-17 (Iceland to Murmask) Her deployment lasted from March - July 42

Two other Battleships were stationed with the British Home Fleet at Scapa Flow. South Dakota and Alabama. Along with the Cruiser Tuscaloosa. Task force 61

Assigned to the Home fleet from Feb to Aug 42. They were involved in Operation Governor along the coast of Norway and in the reinforcement of Svalbard. Where they deployed above the Arctic Circle.

So no Iowas deployment to Newfoundland was not "Historically significant"

Stayed in New Foundland? B.S.

August 27 - En Route to Newfoundland and the North Atlantic for her first war patrol. Assignment, the "Tirpitz Watch", the German battleship, thereby contributing to the neutralization of the threat presented by that warship then poised in Norwegian waters. (From USS Iowa WW II history - sorry, forgot to add the link but I'm sure you can find it as well as several more that reveal the Iowa's first mission was to make sure the Tirpitz stayed put).

She went well beyond and into the Baltic that effectively bottled up the Tirpitz in Norway. There are other records of her first mission that support that.

The German Bismarck class only had Navigational RADAR. Bismarck blew her own RADAR out with her first 15-inch gunfire at the two British Cruisers that first sighted her and had to use Prinz Eugen for Navigational guidance. Tirpitz was no better whereas we had developed FIRE CONTROL RADAR on the Iowas.

I have worked on every class of Americand warships from pre-WW II vintage on up to the latest Perry's, Spruances, Tycos , Tarawas, Forrstalsand Waspsas well as DSRV, SEALAB II, and the "Pop-Up" Polaris, Poseidon and Trident (C-4) missile projects. But I'm still amazed at the almost perfection of the Iowa class when the closest thing we had for "computers" were slide rules and Marchant electro-mechanical calculators.

[Gun Grape]

However, I will say that Iowa was the only BB to have a sitting President sail on for more than a short little publicity jaunt.

Because Tuscaloosa had been specially fitted out for FDR and was his normal navy ship to sail on. Since we sold and scrapped CA-37 I don't see that as a reason to save the Iowa.

[Gun Grape]

Stayed in New Foundland? B.S.

August 27 - En Route to Newfoundland and the North Atlantic for her first war patrol. Assignment, the "Tirpitz Watch", the German battleship, thereby contributing to the neutralization of the threat presented by that warship then poised in Norwegian waters. (From USS Iowa WW II history - sorry, forgot to add the link but I'm sure you can find it as well as several more that reveal the Iowa's first mission was to make sure the Tirpitz stayed put).

She went well beyond and into the Baltic that effectively bottled up the Tirpitz in Norway. There are other records of her first mission that support that.

The German Bismarck class only had Navigational RADAR. Bismarck blew her own RADAR out with her first 15-inch gunfire at the two British Cruisers that first sighted her and had to use Prinz Eugen for Navigational guidance. Tirpitz was no better whereas we had developed FIRE CONTROL RADAR on the Iowas.

I have worked on every class of Americand warships from pre-WW II vintage on up to the latest Perry's, Spruances, Tycos , Tarawas, Forrstalsand Waspsas well as DSRV, SEALAB II, and the "Pop-Up" Polaris, Poseidon and Trident (C-4) missile projects. But I'm still amazed at the almost perfection of the Iowa class when the closest thing we had for "computers" were slide rules and Marchant electro-mechanical calculators.

Yes she did the SAME THING as North Carolina an less than SD or NC.

[Thoddy]

The German Bismarck class only had Navigational RADAR. Bismarck blew her own RADAR out with her first 15-inch gunfire at the two British Cruisers that first sighted her and had to use Prinz Eugen for Navigational guidance. Tirpitz was no better whereas we had developed FIRE CONTROL RADAR on the Iowas..

I do not want to digress from the topic, but this is not right. The german battleships had radar fully integrated into firecontrol.