Any Life Left!?

[Shipwreck]

You wouldn't have to worry about training up like you would for the 16" guns and associated equipment. Even with the uniqueness of the 16" guns and the FC system, you would still get many volunteers who would know how to operate those systems, and then would be able to train the new comers.

You have no clue on what you're talking about.

[Shipwreck]

"Propulsion - System is old, unreliable, potentially unsafe and lacking skilled personnel." That is a complete lie.

Steam was the third cause of Navy on-duty fatalities in non-aviation accidents for the 1988-96 period, with a single steam leak accident killing 10 sailors on USS Iowa Jima (LPH-2) in October 1990.

More recently, a steam leak aboard USS Frank Cable (AS-40) in December 2006 injured 8 sailors. One of them died from injuries shortly after.

[Shipwreck]

If they say scram jet is feasible, turn 2 damn it.

The scramjet thingy is pure BS.

John Lehman (spit, puke, gag ), William Stearman (spit, puke, gag ) and their acolytes made it up for the gullibles.

[Gun Grape]

So Im guessing that you have the final piece to the NGFS support triad hiding in your pocket?


The Honorable Roscoe G. Bartlett:
Chairman, Subcommittee on Projection Forces:
Committee on Armed Services:
House of Representatives:

Subject: Information on Options for Naval Surface Fire Support:

Dear Mr. Chairman:

Land-, air-, and sea-based components form the "fires triad" that is
used to support Marine Corps amphibious assault operations. The sea-
based part of the fires triad is referred to as Naval Surface Fire
Support (NSFS). From World War II until the Persian Gulf War in 1991
NSFS resided mainly in the capability of the 16-inch guns on the Navy's
Iowa class battleships. The thick armor of these battleships and the
24-nautical-mile range of their 16-inch guns gave the battleships
increased survivability in high-threat scenarios. The last Iowa class
battleship was decommissioned in 1992.

Their retirement left a void in the NSFS part of the fires triad.

I won't go through the whole rambling GAO letter but the portion that I highlighted is pure Bullcrap. I would like for anyone to tell me what amphibious landing we used the Battleships for after WW2.

Survey says None.

Or what the dominant, most useful guns were for NSFS in Korea, Vietnam and all the little piddle places in the 80s. Hint it wasn't the 16/50.

To address our engagement objectives, we interviewed responsible
officials and reviewed official documents, including internal memos,
operational requirements documents, and related studies, from the
Marine Corps Combat Development Command, the Navy's Inactive Ships
Program Office, the Navy's Surface Warfare Directorate, the Navy's
Guided Projectile Office, the Joint Staff (J-8) Force Application
Assessment Division, and the U.S. Naval Fire Support Association. We
also toured the Battleship Wisconsin (BB-64) and the USS Winston
Churchill (DDG-81). We conducted our work from April through September
2004 in accordance with generally accepted government auditing
standards.

Oh thats where the Bull came from.:)

[Shipwreck]

Oh thats where the Bull came from.

LOL

[glyn]

Shipwreck is WABs own Scarlet Pimpernel (aka Sydney Carton).

[Shipwreck]

Shipwreck is WABs own Scarlet Pimpernel (aka Sydney Carton).

They seek him here,
They seek him there,
Those Frenchies seek him everywhere.

Is he in heaven?
Is he in hell?
That demmed, elusive Pimpernel.

[Ytlas]

Not my opinion Steamin. I operated Babcox Willcox 600lb boilers for years and have a very good understanding of them. Thought they were very good power plants in my judgement. Most of this is only assesed from behind a desk and closed doors. Being in the field would certainly have changed some of this assesment.;)

And would you run the boilers through main steam piping that was 65 years old and only been hydro tested because a full visual piping inspection couldn't be done because of the nasty insulation? We're talking about a few hundred feet of piping (including cross connects). In case of a steam leak, how fast can you jump in the bilges, because you'd never make it up the escape trunk.

[RustyBattleship]

Mr. L. a quick question. I know Philadelphia still has their blade shops. When they refiited the Iowas in the 1980's do you know where the props went for trueing and inspection? Im not sure how many of the major yards left still have the capabilities for them.

All props were sent to some other facility for basic repair and re-annealing. Because bronze age hardens, they have to be changed out every few years for re-annealed replacements. Since the Iowas used all Essex class 4 and 5 bladed props, new ones were already sent and waiting for the ships and we sent the old ones back.

We had a brand-spanking new propeller balancing shop built. Even new props had to be balanced and though re-annealed still had some cracks and chips on the edges. So that required rebrazing, grinding, polishing and rebalancing.

We had a 5-bladed prop on display during an open house at the shipyard. They turned on the machine to full rpm and you had quite a wind coming out of the big north door of the shop.

Good thing too because it was a hot day and that was the coolest place in the whole shipyard.

[Ytlas]

We had a brand-spanking new propeller balancing shop built. Even new props had to be balanced and though re-annealed still had some cracks and chips on the edges. So that required rebrazing, grinding, polishing and rebalancing.

We had a 5-bladed prop on display during an open house at the shipyard. They turned on the machine to full rpm and you had quite a wind coming out of the big north door of the shop.

Awww, I missed the open house (late 1995), was in San Diego that week. I don't miss the shafts and rudder posts in that shop though. :)

[Shipwreck]

And would you run the boilers through main steam piping that was 65 years old and only been hydro tested because a full visual piping inspection couldn't be done because of the nasty insulation? We're talking about a few hundred feet of piping (including cross connects). In case of a steam leak, how fast can you jump in the bilges, because you'd never make it up the escape trunk.

Now that sounds like someone who REALLY had a "hands on" experience in operating those systems.

[Shipwreck]

More recently, a steam leak aboard USS Frank Cable (AS-40) in December 2006 injured 8 sailors. One of them died from injuries shortly after.

A second sailor from USS Frank Cable (AS-40) died from injuries in April 2007.

RIP. :(

Second injured sailor dies from steam leak aboard USS Frank Cable
By Jeff Schogol Stars and Stripes
Pacific edition, Saturday, May 5, 2007

ARLINGTON, Va. — A second sailor from the USS Frank Cable has died following a December steam leak aboard the ship.

Eight sailors were injured when scalding pressurized steam escaped from the Frank Cable’s fire room while the ship was on Guam.

Two sailors were treated and released on Guam and six sailors were flown to Brooke Army Medical Center in Texas.

Chief Petty Officer Delfin Dulay, 42, died Monday evening at the hospital, a Brooke Army Medical Center spokeswoman said.

Dulay, from Baguio City, Philippines, had been in the Navy for close to 19 years and was on the Frank Cable since Oct. 13, according to the Navy.

His family could not be reached for comment by deadline on Thursday.

Dulay was one of four sailors from the Frank Cable awarded the Navy and Marine Corps Commendation Medal for their actions the day of the steam leak, according to an April news release from the Frank Cable.

He was given the medal at a ceremony at Brooke’s intensive care unit with his wife, two sons, parents and sister in attendance, the news release says.

Though the Navy has yet to release an official report on the incident, Frank Cable’s captain has already told the injured sailors’ loved ones that they stayed at their posts despite the scalding steam, said the mother of the other Frank Cable sailor who died.

“The captain of the ship had a video conference with the families, and he said all of them in their compartment took the time to shut down the equipment before they left the space, preventing further damage to the ship or injuries to others on the ship,” said Colleen Valentine in a December interview with Stars and Stripes.

Valentine’s son, Seaman Jack Valentine, 20, died Dec. 7 at Brooke from his injuries.

An investigation into the incident has been completed and a redacted copy will be available to Stars and Stripes soon, said Cmdr. Mike Brown, a spokesman for Commander Submarine Force, U.S. Pacific Fleet.

Link

[Dreadnought]

And would you run the boilers through main steam piping that was 65 years old and only been hydro tested because a full visual piping inspection couldn't be done because of the nasty insulation? We're talking about a few hundred feet of piping (including cross connects). In case of a steam leak, how fast can you jump in the bilges, because you'd never make it up the escape trunk.

Pal, I have encounted MSTS (Main steam system) leaks before as well as popped tubes,cracked headers and so fourth. We have even done steam shots at the header before connecting to the the turbine with targets. (1" square chrome plated rod approximately two feet in length that hung in front of the serrated test pipe. The chromium allowed us to see how saturated/superheated the steam flow was so we didnt slug the turbine with water and destroy the blading sections and one hell of am explanation and extreme cost to repair. (Had a nut left in the line from piping/valve assembly prior to our testing area that when it hit the target it bent it almost in half on the first full blow. (Gave it too the lead engineer who was retiring at the time after the crew engraved their names in it and the date.)

Certainly not something you want to happen during operation but as we both know it happens.(Thats why the training as I'm sure you have had and a good sense of self preservation:)) ) Some methods even call for Xraying the welded joints as well (most now days on any high pressure boiler in those days only critical path). We always hydro'd with the boilers full. Yes it costs alot of time if a leak is found in draining and refilling (hours and hours). However we were probably given more time and suitable removal methods then you gentlemen were and alot less eyeballs around us. Miss those days.

[Dreadnought]

Pal, I have encounted MSTS (Main steam system) leaks before as well as popped tubes,cracked headers and so fourth. We have even done steam shots at the header before connecting to the the turbine with targets. (1" square chrome plated rod approximately two feet in length that hung in front of the serrated test pipe. The chromium allowed us to see how saturated/superheated the steam flow was so we didnt slug the turbine with water and destroy the blading sections and one hell of am explanation and extreme cost to repair. (Had a nut left in the line from piping/valve assembly prior to our testing area that when it hit the target it bent it almost in half on the first full blow. (Gave it too the lead engineer who was retiring at the time after the crew engraved their names in it and the date.)

Certainly not something you want to happen during operation but as we both know it happens.(Thats why the training as I'm sure you have had and a good sense of self preservation:)) ) Some methods even call for Xraying the welded joints as well (most now days on any high pressure boiler in those days only critical path). We always hydro'd with the boilers full. Yes it costs alot of time if a leak is found in draining and refilling (hours and hours). However we were probably given more time and suitable removal methods then you gentlemen were and alot less eyeballs around us. Miss those days.

As far as hands on experience...Been there done that. And yes do miss it sometimes and still find it interesting. Spent quite a few years working for Westinghouse.

[Dreadnought]

Awww, I missed the open house (late 1995), was in San Diego that week. I don't miss the shafts and rudder posts in that shop though. :)

Pal,
Boilermaker by trade or Millwright?