BB trivia

[RustyBattleship]

How so ?

Unlike USS Mississippi and USS Newport News, USS Iowa was a cold-barrel explosion.

USS Iowa didn't suffer a projectile in-bore explosion (like USS Newport news). The propellant on board USS Iowa was not ignited by burning embers (like USS Mississippi).

Regardless of the cause, it was always the center barrel of Turret II. Almost like it's a jinx.

[TopHatter]

1. The 16"/50 Mark-7 and the previous 16"/50 Mark-2 had the same ballistics.)

Except that the Mark 7 has a higher muzzle velocity.

2. The 16"/45 had better dispersion than the 16"/50.

Source?

3. The 16"/50 is definitely no match for best-in-class land artillery (e.g. the South African 155m/52 can achieve a PEr @ 40,000 yards less than half that of the 16"/50).

40 years after the Mark 7 made it's debut? God I should hope it's better.

Regardless of the cause, it was always the center barrel of Turret II. Almost like it's a jinx.

You can expect that sort of attitude from Shipwreck.

It was perfectly obvious that Fred was merely drawing attention to overall turret disasters consistently occurring in Turret 2, Center Gun.

Instead, Shipwreck just had to trot all sort of reasons why he was wrong.

[Gun Grape]

After Suq Al Gharb (19 Sep 1983), it was pretty obvious to all factions that the *gloves were off*.

No one was ever *told to miss* after that day.

Disagree. That was the day we quit being seen as Peacekeepers and started being looked at as fair game. They just forgo to inform us of that decision.

[Gun Grape]

I'll defer to the experts on this one But,

I read a report long ago that stated that 8 inch NGB was the most accurate.
And later on that the Des Moines class8"/55 were the most accurate.

[Shipwreck]

Typo

1. The 16"/50 Mark-7 and the previous 16"/50 Mark-2 had the same ballistics.

This post should say :

"1. The 16"/50 Mark-7 and the previous 16"/50 Mark-2 had the same dispersion."

[Shipwreck]

Source?

Various USN docs.

[Shipwreck]

40 years after the Mark 7 made it's debut?

System development for the South African 155mm/52 actually commenced in 1992, i.e. almost 50 years after the Mark-7 made its debut.

To name another one, the 8-inch Howitzer M1 also had much better dispersion than the 16"/50.

God I should hope it's better.

In dimensionless figures, e.g. calibers, a range of 40,000 yards is more than 3 times as far for the 155mm as for the 16" gun...

[Shipwreck]

It was perfectly obvious that Fred was merely drawing attention to overall turret disasters consistently occurring in Turret 2, Center Gun.

I rephrase : given the causes of the explosions mentioned by Dick Landgraff (USS Iowa, USS Mississippi and USS Newport News) were different, what is supposed to be inferred from the fact that all three occured in the center gun of Turret II ?

[Shipwreck]

I read a report long ago that stated that 8 inch NGB was the most accurate.
And later on that the Des Moines class 8"/55 were the most accurate.

That's not the case :

1. the dispersion for the 8"/55 is significantly larger than that for the 16"/50 (e.g. ~2.5 times larger PEr @ 30,000 yards).

2. the 8"/55 Mark-12/14/15 (bags) and the 8"/55RF Mark-16 (cartridges) had essentially the same dispersion.

[Shipwreck]

Disagree. That was the day we quit being seen as Peacekeepers and started being looked at as fair game. They just forgo to inform us of that decision.

The decision to turn loose USN guns in support of the Lebanese Army at Suq Al Gharb not only meant we would no longer be perceived as peacekeepers, it also implied by its very nature that the gloves were off.

After Suq Al Gharb, things could only go crescendo in a rather disastrous kind of way.

[HazeGrey]

Pics for Thanks

Some pics. also have many others including Re Pete and Ditto. Happy Thanksgiving to all...
Fred

[HazeGrey]

Originally Posted by TopHatter
It was perfectly obvious that Fred was merely drawing attention to overall turret disasters consistently occurring in Turret 2, Center Gun.
You are correct. What makes that Turrett so different?

[HazeGrey]

Turret not Turrett

My apologies. Another pic not so clear at the Harpoons.

[HazeGrey]

oops another

Benchmark....

[Gun Grape]

The decision to turn loose USN guns in support of the Lebanese Army at Suq Al Gharb not only meant we would no longer be perceived as peacekeepers, it also implied by its very nature that the gloves were off.

After Suq Al Gharb, things could only go crescendo in a rather disastrous kind of way.

No, If the gloves had been taken off then the RoE for ground forces and the Air would have changed. Thoses things didn't.

If the gloves had been taken off then we would have been weapons free. At least for self protection. That didn't happen. If the NCA requires you to have tape over your magazines, and the mag be in the pouch vice locked and loaded when on post, the gloves are not off.