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  • Originally posted by JRT View Post

    Seems like a good set of missions for a fast coastal patrol corvette with a stern boat ramp and a helicopter flight deck and hangar, and with a relatively small crew augmented with an embarked VBSS team, visit, board, search, and seizure. ...No?

    That frees up the Arleigh Burke DDGs for blue water missions better suited to the larger and more capable warships.

    What is the better alternative, if constrained to realistic practicable choices, from among ships currently in commission?
    None, unless the Coast Guard is assigned to some of the missions. My point I guess was that the LCS was supposed to be capable of so much more! And now it's been relegated to missions a basic OPV could perform.
    Last edited by Monash; 30 Dec 22,, 22:45.
    If you are emotionally invested in 'believing' something is true you have lost the ability to tell if it is true.

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    • Oh, and as I think I may have stated previously (with the benefit of hindsight of course) if the Navy had just concentrated on perfecting just one module from the LCS program - the mine clearing system the Navy would have ended up with class of vessels that would have justified its existence. Something that could both fill a capability gap AND also free up larger hulls from having to perform low intensity maritime patrol duties.
      Last edited by Monash; 31 Dec 22,, 01:51.
      If you are emotionally invested in 'believing' something is true you have lost the ability to tell if it is true.

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      • Not a bad idea...the Perry's and even the non-VLS Tico's were used in SOUTHCOM waters for things like drug interdiction, as I recall.

        Yeah...a mission for which it will work at way too much funding. And I wonderf what their operationally ready frate will be.
        “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
        Mark Twain

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        • Originally posted by Monash View Post
          Oh, and as I think I may have stated previously (with the benefit of hindsight of course) if the Navy had just concentrated on perfecting just one module from the LCS program - the mining clearing system the Navy would have ended up with class of vessels that would have justified its existence. Something that could both fill a capability gap AND also free up larger hulls from perform low intensity maritime patrol duties.
          The LCS was a material solution in search of a functional requirement.
          “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
          Mark Twain

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          • And I bet all of the projects original proponents/enthusiasts inside the Navy who championed the program in the first place have now either left or rigged for silent running. I'd also assume it no longer appears on any of their resumes. 'Program, what program'?.
            Last edited by Monash; 19 Jun 23,, 14:12.
            If you are emotionally invested in 'believing' something is true you have lost the ability to tell if it is true.

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            • Guess it's better than scrapping?...

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              • Barely.
                If you are emotionally invested in 'believing' something is true you have lost the ability to tell if it is true.

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                • I still think that "40knots speed" for a post WWII hull that size was a stupid idea; this isn't a coastal missile boat. I bet the compromises, extra design work and extra machinery needed greatly added to the cost, both design and maintenance.

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                  • Originally posted by jlvfr View Post
                    I still think that "40knots speed" for a post WWII hull that size was a stupid idea; this isn't a coastal missile boat. I bet the compromises, extra design work and extra machinery needed greatly added to the cost, both design and maintenance.
                    And breakdowns.
                    If you are emotionally invested in 'believing' something is true you have lost the ability to tell if it is true.

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                    • Has anyone else seen reports these last few days stating that the US Navy has (finally) received permission from the Senate to 'retire' all LCS hulls some of which are less than a year old! Because they are not apparently 'survivable in combat'. Writing on the wall or not how many billions of dollars of tax payers money has just been sent to the scrap yard. Perun's latest video on how procurement destroys armies (well in this case navies) could not be more pertinent.
                      If you are emotionally invested in 'believing' something is true you have lost the ability to tell if it is true.

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                      • Originally posted by Monash View Post
                        Has anyone else seen reports these last few days stating that the US Navy has (finally) received permission from the Senate to 'retire' all LCS hulls some of which are less than a year old! Because they are not apparently 'survivable in combat'. Writing on the wall or not how many billions of dollars of tax payers money has just been sent to the scrap yard. Perun's latest video on how procurement destroys armies (well in this case navies) could not be more pertinent.
                        You mean this news?

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                        • Originally posted by Monash View Post
                          Has anyone else seen reports these last few days stating that the US Navy has (finally) received permission from the Senate to 'retire' all LCS hulls some of which are less than a year old! Because they are not apparently 'survivable in combat'. Writing on the wall or not how many billions of dollars of tax payers money has just been sent to the scrap yard. Perun's latest video on how procurement destroys armies (well in this case navies) could not be more pertinent.
                          I saw that one last night. As far as I am concerned everyone who had a hand in that disaster should never be allowed to work again on a ship design.

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                          • Question is of course who do they actually they give them away to? Given the, now official view of the US Government that the ships aren't fit for combat there won't be many allied Navies who would want to take them on for such purposes even if they do come are gift wrapped in a giant pink bow. That basically leaves them a role as overpriced, over engineered and costly to run and maintain OPVs. Maybe the Coast Guard can be strong armed into taking some, at least from the class of their choosing.

                            Seriously though what a debacle, and of course no one will end up being held accountable. It never ceases to amaze me how the lowly peons of the public service can be routinely held accountable for errors they make with with public money but the senior executive service? It can blow billions of dollars on 'bold, visionary plans' that leave the tax paying public with nothing to show for it and .....?
                            Last edited by Monash; 20 Jun 23,, 05:49.
                            If you are emotionally invested in 'believing' something is true you have lost the ability to tell if it is true.

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                            • Originally posted by tbm3fan View Post

                              I saw that one last night. As far as I am concerned everyone who had a hand in that disaster should never be allowed to work again on a ship design.
                              The last thing the Coast Guard needs with their budget is an expensive to maintain dead end

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                              • The Inside Story of How the Navy Spent Billions on the “Little Crappy Ship”

                                Sprawling article on the LCS fiasco

                                “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

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