Insights from an ex-Soviet tank crewman

[Airforce Comman]

It is very nice to hear such things from a tank crew member's POV but reaching conclusions based on it is a potential minefield.





Russian MBT's had a life expectancy of what? A few days at best in a confrontation between WP and NATO. So why waste things as airco on them? Especially if that allows you to buy more tanks, which you need for your horde tactics.

Its popular to deride Soviet/Russian equipment and tactics at the moment, especially by Americans (who can't seem to quell a guerilla war in Iraq and Afghanistan, so doesn't that that mean the American war machine sucks too?).

This superiority feeling is mostly based IMO on the unqualified success of American/Coalition forces against the Iraqis (twice). Yet does anybody believe the Iraqis would have done better if they had American equipment? Or that the Arabs would have done better against the Israeli's if they had been equipped with American equipment? Its not the equipment, its how you use it.

I beg to differ sir, up-to a certin point, it's not the equipment, but the tactics, but once you start having equipment that is so far advanced, it's about the equipment-with numbers AND tactics, for example, I didn't know until recently that the Arabs, air-defence networks did not "overlap" each other, for years I thought it did, and the Isreali's learned the frequencies they operated and jammed them, but thats not what happend, they (Isreali's) flew under, and around the "few" SAM radar's Syria had and bombed them from different angles.

[Equilibrium]

Sounds like joke.
He definitely meant something other but not the food.



As for me I learnt about Soviet military from the magazine "Tekhnika Molodezhi", in English - "Technics for Youth". There was a lot of articles about Soviet tanks, subs, warplanes etc. Also this magazine issued the articles about Western military equipment. That was interesting. I still keep some these old magazines.

How would the Soviet era magazines describe Western military technology?

Also, in movies, were there the equivalent of Soviets v. enemy capitalist Yankees? We the Americans portrayed as evil, deceitful, deviously laughing killers bent on Soviet destruction and brave Soviet heroes working to stop them?

[MrFirst]

How would the Soviet era magazines describe Western military technology?

Actually, I don't remember.
I'll look at my magazines later, if you wish.

Also, in movies, were there the equivalent of Soviets v. enemy capitalist Yankees? We the Americans portrayed as evil, deceitful, deviously laughing killers bent on Soviet destruction and brave Soviet heroes working to stop them?

Undoubtedly. Though I can recall Rambo much easier than its Soviet equivalents. :) Shame on me. I'm a child of 80-s.
This Rambo was very brave hero, though in the movies only the different sorts of idiots countered him. ;)

[Pingvinov]

How would the Soviet era magazines describe Western military technology?

Also, in movies, were there the equivalent of Soviets v. enemy capitalist Yankees? We the Americans portrayed as evil, deceitful, deviously laughing killers bent on Soviet destruction and brave Soviet heroes working to stop them?

I would disagree with MrFirst on how Soviet movies portrayed Americans in those kinds of movies. The main focus was not on the eveil nature of the Americans or their thirst for innocent blood.
The underlying idea was that in a capitalist world people were deeply unhappy and frustrated with the system. Most characters lived without hope for a better life, destined to live in a sad world, where money was the only thing that mattered. Law and ethic values were no more than items for sale to the highest bidder.

Western military technology was described with a fair level of detail. One could find much more reading on foreign weapons than on owr own. Those weapons were given due respect. At the end there would normally be a short statement saying that Soviet Armed Forces have equivalent systems of equal or higher potential. There were a few exceptions though. For example Carriers were labeled as an agressor's weapon, which the Soviet Union as a country looking only to defend itself, refused to build.

P.S.: Now that I think about it, I can recall only two movies which presented stories of local confrontations between Soviet and US Armed Forces (in both cases at sea, not on land) where Navies fired in anger. Both movies came out after the second and third episodes of Rambo.
The spy theme has been getting much better coverage both in books and in movies, but this is a different story.

[Dreadnought]

Dreadnought,

You have missed the wonders of the world.

It is your loss.

Cabbage is not the sole delight of the world!!

Odours are better than bland food and there are marvels in the world organised by the western world called Kitchen Chimneys!

Invest in one! ;) :))

Ah but Sir,
When cabbage is boiled and wrapped around a combination or ground meat, rice, chopped pepper and seasonings, topped with tomato soup as sauce cabbage fits in quite well.

[Shamus]

Ah but Sir,
When cabbage is boiled and wrapped around a combination or ground meat, rice, chopped pepper and seasonings, topped with tomato soup as sauce cabbage fits in quite well.

Or when boiled with onions,garlic and fresh kielbasa....yum....;):)).(Opening all the windows in the house is highly recommended after ingesting this concoction;).)

[Ray]

Yuck!

What bland food you chaps can eat and then exult! :))

You are all invited to my house in India. And I seriously extended this invitation to all WABbers!

Taste the difference! :))

Try Shorse Islish, Ilish Paturi etc etc.

[Officer of Engineers]

Sir,

I don't think my ucler can take such strong foods anymore. The days of hot wings (I mean you have to drink one beer per wing) are long over for me.

[Equilibrium]

I would disagree with MrFirst on how Soviet movies portrayed Americans in those kinds of movies. The main focus was not on the eveil nature of the Americans or their thirst for innocent blood.
The underlying idea was that in a capitalist world people were deeply unhappy and frustrated with the system. Most characters lived without hope for a better life, destined to live in a sad world, where money was the only thing that mattered. Law and ethic values were no more than items for sale to the highest bidder.

Western military technology was described with a fair level of detail. One could find much more reading on foreign weapons than on owr own. Those weapons were given due respect. At the end there would normally be a short statement saying that Soviet Armed Forces have equivalent systems of equal or higher potential. There were a few exceptions though. For example Carriers were labeled as an agressor's weapon, which the Soviet Union as a country looking only to defend itself, refused to build.

P.S.: Now that I think about it, I can recall only two movies which presented stories of local confrontations between Soviet and US Armed Forces (in both cases at sea, not on land) where Navies fired in anger. Both movies came out after the second and third episodes of Rambo.
The spy theme has been getting much better coverage both in books and in movies, but this is a different story.

With all the US made equipment that fell into Hanoi's hands after the conquest of South Vietnam, did the Soviet media ever do any reviews such equipment or use them in any films?

In the US, modified Western equipment was often used until (from what I have been told)Soviet equipment captured by Israel starting to be seen towards the end of the Cold War.

Was there any media reaction to the Rambo films in the East? I can imagine that it must have been negative.

[Pingvinov]

With all the US made equipment that fell into Hanoi's hands after the conquest of South Vietnam, did the Soviet media ever do any reviews such equipment or use them in any films?

In the US, modified Western equipment was often used until (from what I have been told)Soviet equipment captured by Israel starting to be seen towards the end of the Cold War.

Was there any media reaction to the Rambo films in the East? I can imagine that it must have been negative.

There were reviews published, but not so much in publications popular with general public.
For example, in early 80-s, I remember reading very detailed accounts of British and Argentinian actions during hostilities over Folkland Islands. There were some in depth analyses of tactics and weapons used by both sides.

In Soviet movies they used some modified Russian or Warsaw Pact equipment acting as NATO hardware. Small arms were usually authentic.

The "First Blood" went unnoticed, but the sequels certainly saw tons of negative press for very obvious reasons.

[usplanefan67]

I didn't realize that people in America felt so strongly about where they eat. It's really not a big deal here in Moscow. Many people go to McDonalds because of their children. Kids like the way they make fries.

The statement about unemployment being illegal is correct. The law however didn't suggest severe penalty. In reality what happened was that if a bum (of which indeed there were very few) came to attention of the local police they would suggest that he should get a job. Normaly an officer would pay him a visit a month later and check out his formal employment satus. This was easy, because every person had a formal document known as Employment record book. It is a small book the size of a passport. These things are still in use today. When a peson gets his first job, employer company issues one. Anyway, after a few reminders an unmotivated bum would usually find some simple job. Their preference was usually to offload delivey trucks which brought stuff to grossery stores. This gave them all the free time in the world. Another easy alternative would be to tend heat boilers in residential or industrial buildings. This would give them and their buddies a nice warm hangout place in winter. Remember, it gets rather chilly in the cold season in most parts of Russia.

\

Personally I would love to visit your country one day. You do have one thing wrong though, Most Americans don't feel that strongly about where they eat unfortunatly Mcdonalds here at least in my view anyway has been marketed and advertised to death, I dont know how many mcdonalds you have over there but here there is one in just about every city and in the bigger cities dozens its not that were picky just tired of seeing them pop up all over the place. Now getting back to russia. I have seen pictures of moscow and I think at least now anyway has some attractive features I dont know what it looked like in the 80's I was a teenager and had other thoughts on my mind.. Anyway beauty is all in the eye of the beholder the gentleman he is interviewing maybe one in 10,000 that doesnt like it, I know some americans that dont like most of the cities here also, I hate visting New York city myself. For the most part we have homeless people here because there are some that could work but prefer not to because everything is handed to them. Personally I think the Russians and Americans could learn a few things off each other, I think both of our countries politicians are well bad but every russian I have met anyway our views are very much close to being the same. But the insights from both side are good great articles this is probably the longest I have every stayed reading all the posts.

By the way to the Russians in here how does the T-90 or T-92 (I dont know what its called) stand up against its western counter parts?

[Andrey Egorov]

\

Personally I would love to visit your country one day. You do have one thing wrong though, Most Americans don't feel that strongly about where they eat unfortunatly Mcdonalds here at least in my view anyway has been marketed and advertised to death, I dont know how many mcdonalds you have over there but here there is one in just about every city and in the bigger cities dozens its not that were picky just tired of seeing them pop up all over the place. Now getting back to russia. I have seen pictures of moscow and I think at least now anyway has some attractive features I dont know what it looked like in the 80's I was a teenager and had other thoughts on my mind.. Anyway beauty is all in the eye of the beholder the gentleman he is interviewing maybe one in 10,000 that doesnt like it, I know some americans that dont like most of the cities here also, I hate visting New York city myself. For the most part we have homeless people here because there are some that could work but prefer not to because everything is handed to them. Personally I think the Russians and Americans could learn a few things off each other, I think both of our countries politicians are well bad but every russian I have met anyway our views are very much close to being the same. But the insights from both side are good great articles this is probably the longest I have every stayed reading all the posts.

By the way to the Russians in here how does the T-90 or T-92 (I dont know what its called) stand up against its western counter parts?

Hi. We'll be glad to meet you here. Just don't come in winter or, especially in autumn :) Moscow can be quite depressive regarding to season. But our McDonald's way better than australian, as my mate stated from Sydney. He migrated couple of years ago.


As for tanks. T-90 was desperate attempt to upgrade T-72B to T-80U level, because T-80 manufacture left in Ukraine. Later in 90-s they gained new 1000hp engine and new turret in addition to already installed T-80's gun, targeting system, reactive armour and all that shtora stuff. These became known as T-90S Vladimir.

I don't know how to compare tanks that differ more than 15 tons weight. It seems like Pzkf. IV to T-34 comparision additionally, autoloader shown its vulnerablity to side hits of even RPG-7

[usplanefan67]

Hi. We'll be glad to meet you here. Just don't come in winter or, especially in autumn :) Moscow can be quite depressive regarding to season. But our McDonald's way better than australian, as my mate stated from Sydney. He migrated couple of years ago.


As for tanks. T-90 was desperate attempt to upgrade T-72B to T-80U level, because T-80 manufacture left in Ukraine. Later in 90-s they gained new 1000hp engine and new turret in addition to already installed T-80's gun, targeting system, reactive armour and all that shtora stuff. These became known as T-90S Vladimir.

I don't know how to compare tanks that differ more than 15 tons weight. It seems like Pzkf. IV to T-34 comparision additionally, autoloader shown its vulnerablity to side hits of even RPG-7

Thanks for the Info, I will keep that in mind if I ever visit moscow, I am from West Virginia which has a climate probably close to the moscow region so cold and depressing weather doesnt really bother me. Thanks for the info on the Tank.

[Andrey Egorov]

I guess you didn't get it. Moscow winter is depressing due to lack of snow and lots of mud in the streets except of couple of weeks in January when it's colder than -25. All around is pale, grey-brown colour. Cars, buildings, even roads and pavements. I don't like Moscow in winter.

EDIT: I looked on the map - West Virgina is way souther than Moscow, be aware. Typical (not average) winter temperature in Moscow is around 0 F...

[BD1]

I guess you didn't get it. Moscow winter is depressing due to lack of snow and lots of mud in the streets except of couple of weeks in January when it's colder than -25. All around is pale, grey-brown colour. Cars, buildings, even roads and pavements. I don't like Moscow in winter.

EDIT: I looked on the map - West Virgina is way souther than Moscow, be aware. Typical (not average) winter temperature in Moscow is around 0 F...

ah, your description unfortunately mirrors my home town winter (at least last 2 years). Endless November, that ends in April. Couple weeks of snow at best case, and even then itīs rarely above knee.