Terror Attacks in Paris : 17 killed, Terrorists dead

[Mihais]

I am wondering what sort of special treatment these bastards can be given once they are caught

Had they lived,Nobel Prize.Like Arafat or Mandela.

[Bridgeburner_]

it's most likely to do with current operations in Iraq. How conveniently France's position before the 2003 invasion is ignored (!)

The message to all is those that want to take on Da'ish are vulnerable. they can claim they have a spectacular attack in Paris itself.

Am very interested to know if these guys actually did any time there. They know how to handle themselves.

They've definitely undergone, at the very least, rudimentary firearms training, if not participated in actual combat. Look at the bullet spread in the attached image, it's very clustered

[kato]

Am very interested to know if these guys actually did any time there. They know how to handle themselves.

Cherif Kouachi and Amedy Coulibali were supposedly part of the "Buttes-Chaumont network" which sent up to a dozen jihadists to Iraq between ca 2003 and 2005.

- Cherif Kouachi himself tried to go to Iraq in 2005, but was arrested when trying to leave France. His motivation, in his own words, were the pictures of Abu Ghraib published back then. He was convicted for his (minor) part in the "Buttes-Chaumont network" and served 18 months in prison where he met Djamel Beghal, who was serving a 10-year sentence for planning to bomb the US Embassy in Paris in 2001. Beghal himself was in a training camp in Afghanistan in 2000 to 2001. The two supposedly stayed in contact after 2006, in particular with Kouachi visiting for a longer time when Beghal was released in late 2009 (only for Beghal to be rearrested three months later, and sentenced again).

- Cherif Kouachi did a multi-month trip to Yemen in 2011 supposedly, possibly to an Al Quaeda camp there.

- Said Kouachi, his older brother, was also arrested in 2005, but cleared of charges after 72 hours police custody. He has since not appeared in the crosshairs of French counter-terrorism domestic intelligence.

- Amedy Coulibali is a gang thug, being involved in drugs, theft and armed robbery since youth. Around age 20 he became a radical muslim, and in 2009 assisted the escape of former GIA terrorist Ait Ali Belkecem from prison. He was arrested at the time, and convicted for this involvement and the possession of illegal small arms munitions in 2013. After serving a total of five years, he was released in November last year.

[Mihais]

With a modicum of surveillance you can learn everything one needs to know about police reaction times and the security the the objective.As for their tactical acumen,while heads and shoulders above the regular Arabs,it's still very basic and can be (self)learned in a few days.
Although correct from a tactical pov yesterday is nothing compared to hundreds of ops which had been carried by the Caliphate or AQAP .
The only difference is those had tactical objectives,while this is a strategic op.It's PSYOPS with other means.And it will work.

And no,shooting someone doesn't results in hollywoodesque blood and gore being visible right after the bullet hits the target.Blood and gore results after explosions,being hit by arty shrapnels or high caliber bullet in the range .5 BMG or more.

[kato]

The shooting of the police officer by Coulibaly was probably actually a mistake; it is assumed that his primary target was a jewish school nearby.

The two Kouachi brothers supposedly first got the wrong building (house number 6 instead of 10) according to witnesses.

[kato]

The two brothers supposedly didn't have a hostage. One person who was in the factory at the time hid from them and phoned the police to give them information on their whereabouts and exact positions for the raid.

CNN claims that Hayat Boumedienne, Coulibaly's girlfriend, sneaked out of the supermarket with the hostages and is now at large.

[kato]

Video of the supermarket raid:

Edit: Different angle:

[drhuy]

another one?

Reports say an armed man is holding two hostages at a jewellery store in Montpellier, southern France, but there is no indication it is linked to the hostage situations in Paris.

[kato]

Nah, that's probably just a botched robbery attempt.

[Parihaka]

One of the clearer opinion pieces thus far...
Paris and beyond: Europe is at war with itself | Europe | France | Religion and atheism | spiked

[Mihais]

Of course.Just like Rome was at war with itself,when Alaric sacked it.The Goths lived on Roman soil for generations.Or just as the Aethelstan's Saxons were at war with themselves.Because the Danes had lived there for 50 years.Or like Leon and Castilia were at war with themselves,because the Moors lived in Spain centuries.Or the Byzantines were at war with themselves because the Turks had live in Asia Minor.
Or ... etc...

Just because one is born in a barn doesn't makes him a horse.Just because one has a paper doesn't turns him into a national.That may be less true in settler nations,but between Ireland and Kamchatka we don't have settler societies.
More to the point,we have don't have a simple problem.Ohh,let's debate Islam in Europe.Hmm,well,it's debated for 20 years.And why there is no answer yet is simple.Islam is not the root source of the problems.The source of the problem is the attempt to change Europe into something else.That's being tried by the revolutionaries of the 60's by all means possible.It's done politically,within the frame of the EU,that undermines the national states.It's done culturally,by all the means available to the leftist establishment.It's done economically via the rise of the welfare state and the battering the middle class receives.Socially via the new proletariat.Ethnically via migrants,who also happen to be the new proletariat.
Simply pointing out Islam(or any other factor individually) is at best a naive thing and at worst a diversion.The problems must be tackled all at once.

Each of the problems has the potential to cause a disaster in itself.But the synergy between them makes the situation virtually impossible to solve.Even if next,all Europeans understand the entire magnitude of the situation(which is an impossibility) and start working feverishly to solve them(an equally impossible task),it is too late.Stopping immigration would require border control and that's the EU gone.If the EU tries to secure the Med border,the bleeding hearts that vote will make an outcry and those already in will make a riot.Even if succesful,it's too late to prevent the 2020-30's generation of fighting age men to be one quarter/one third of 3d world origin.That will be as uneducated and unemployable as those today.
Even if the leaders of Europe suddenly get rid of the welfare state and the market is willing to employ the ex-parasites,they have no skill.Of course,in real life,touching welfare will result in burning of cities.

Yes,Europe is at war with itself.But the war is bigger than simply blaming extremism,defend free speech in words and waving banners with ''Je suis Charlie'' ,all while under heavy police protection.
Similar turning points in history are countless.Sometimes they have a single cause,but mostly there were complex causes leading to the flashpoint.But we have yet to see situations where so many completely opposed interests met that ended peacefully.

[Parihaka]

You're in agreement with the article then?

[Mihais]

With the title yes.But the article treats the causes of the situation very superficially and sometimes is blatantly wrong,IMO.To say multiculti is the cause of segregation is wrong.That ideology is rammed down the throats of the Europeans.But segregation is only the natural state of affairs,IMO,given the wide discrepancies.
And the conclusion:''But if Europe wakes up, this won’t necessarily be the future'' is hope for the sake of hope.

But hey,I'm just one who revels in chaos :D

[Double Edge]

With a modicum of surveillance you can learn everything one needs to know about police reaction times and the security the the objective.As for their tactical acumen,while heads and shoulders above the regular Arabs,it's still very basic and can be (self)learned in a few days.
Although correct from a tactical pov yesterday is nothing compared to hundreds of ops which had been carried by the Caliphate or AQAP .
The only difference is those had tactical objectives,while this is a strategic op.It's PSYOPS with other means.And it will work.

It's a bit different from the norm. Norm being london, madrid, bali etc. These guys like bombs, more casualties, lower risk to themselves.

But no, this was a targeted op. High risk. Low casualty count. Not a suicide op. A few guys shooting up the place isn't that spectacular unless the target is chosen for the effect. They got the coverage. If you compare with the boston bomber, it does not take a lot to get coverage. You can pretty much shut the entire city down.

It's like they decided to pick something that was upsetting people in order to get their support for other operations. To sustain the effort.

[Mihais]

They don't care about coverage.They aren't making a political statement.They are thinking like military men.Gain and keep the initiative.In their case,initiative in PSYOPS.
Incidentally,the now famed video of the supplicant cop being executed at a stroll is another benefit.The lil' shits in Paris that today made the V sign behind the reporters backs(but still in front of cameras) knew this and you can bet the vast majority of the islamic world felt a bit of pride at the defiance shown by some of their own.