The Korean Dilemma

[montgomery]

I don't know to what extent Trump is under control is true. He plays to his base sure. But the primary problem with Trump i have perceived is he is NOT under control and by that i mean from the establishment. In fact he's anti-establishment and does not have any qualms telling them where to go.

What does ultimately restrain Trump are the checks & balances in the system. I've always taken this as a given.

Your disagreement with Freyr on Trump being establishment/ anti-establishment, seems to me to be a differing understanding of the meaning of establishment.

[Double Edge]

Trump is completely of the establishment, any idiot can see that. He's playing the crowd..Its all just pure theatre to entertain the masses and distract from the real issues. You'll find that while he's been talking outrageous BS he's also been playing around with tax break etc everything to fix his clique!

Tillerson, McMaster & Mathis gone. They were establishment. This is why there were referred to by an establishment media as the grown ups in the cabinet.

If you buy that line : )

[Freyr]

Tillerson, McMaster & Mathis gone. They were establishment. This is why there were referred to by an establishment media as the grown ups in the cabinet.

If you buy that line : )

We're talking at cross purposes. Establishment in terms of corporate, the puppet master in the background. Trumps antics resemble a Roman emperor announcing games for a hundred days or staging prisoners from a war that never happened maybe like the king with no clothes in reverse..In that the joke is on the electorate.

[Officer of Engineers]

We're talking at cross purposes. Establishment in terms of corporate, the puppet master in the background. Trumps antics resemble a Roman emperor announcing games for a hundred days or staging prisoners from a war that never happened maybe like the king with no clothes in reverse..In that the joke is on the electorate.

The Illumnati? St Peter's Slippers!

[Freyr]

The Illumnati? St Peter's Slippers!

Bilderberg? Smoked Kippers!

[montgomery]

Tillerson, McMaster & Mathis gone. They were establishment. This is why there were referred to by an establishment media as the grown ups in the cabinet.

If you buy that line : )

I'm not disagreeing with that. So rather than trying to interpret Freyr's angle he's promoting, I'll just explain mine. I'm suggesting that Trump is establishment inasmuch as he isn't challenging the main status quo of the two major US political parties.

As opposed to Bernie Sanders who was and is promoting a break from the US style of capitalism, to socially responsible capitalism as is practiced in most capitalist countries. And fwiw, the Dem candidates seem to be slowly coming to the realization that's what it's going to take to win the Dem nomination.

That's expanding somewhat on the original question on 'establishment' but it's the logical direction in which to take this discussion I think. Your thoughts?

[montgomery]

We're talking at cross purposes. Establishment in terms of corporate, the puppet master in the background. Trumps antics resemble a Roman emperor announcing games for a hundred days or staging prisoners from a war that never happened maybe like the king with no clothes in reverse..In that the joke is on the electorate.

Did my explanation to Double Edge explain your opinion well enough?

[Freyr]

Did my explanation to Double Edge explain your opinion well enough?

Yeh I think we ironed that one out. I think he's more interested in the psychology of how the opinion came about in the first place. But he can speak for himself :)

[Double Edge]

That's expanding somewhat on the original question on 'establishment' but it's the logical direction in which to take this discussion I think. Your thoughts?

ok, i guess the word 'establshment' is too broad in scope here. I don't know what word to use to convey what i mean though

status quo, convention, the 'norm', ancien regime ? heh

[montgomery]

ok, i guess the word 'establshment' is too broad in scope here. I don't know what word to use to convey what i mean though

status quo, convention, the 'norm', ancien regime ? heh

I think your use of the word 'establishment' was correct. Just in a different context from Freyr's meaning.

Any of those you've listed but 'grownups' would be my choice. ;-)

[Freyr]

Any of those you've listed but 'grownups' would be my choice. ;-)

The establishment are grown ups, meaning nobody else is...hmm?

[montgomery]

The establishment are grown ups, meaning nobody else is...hmm?

In context to what Double Edge was saying. Basically, I think that is the same as saying that compared to Trump, everbybody is a grownup.

[Freyr]

In context to what Double Edge was saying. Basically, I think that is the same as saying that compared to Trump, everbybody is a grownup.

The establishment or ruling class are a class of people in society that exercise authority and control far in excess of their contributions to society. This power is used to acquire wealth that is greatly disproportionate to their own endeavors. For example, today in the United States, the average CEO makes 400 times what the average entry level worker makes....

[montgomery]

The establishment or ruling class are a class of people in society that exercise authority and control far in excess of their contributions to society. This power is used to acquire wealth that is greatly disproportionate to their own endeavors. For example, today in the United States, the average CEO makes 400 times what the average entry level worker makes....

Yes, I can agree with that. That would basicallly be the Bernie Sanders message, and the message the US establishment are frantically trying keep out of the hearts and minds of the people.

It's contrary to the 'American way' which impresses on the people that if they're poor then they're not working hard enough, and that if they all work harder then they can become the president too! FFS!

So the Dems are running shit scared of the chance that Bernie could be their nomination. Because the Dem party is just as much 'establishment' as the Repub party.

Take it to a thread that is appropriate if you're interested. This one's about Korea.

[Freyr]

Take it to a thread that is appropriate if you're interested. This one's about Korea.

Do Korea not have an establishment?