China’s democratization and reunification

[nickel1106]

No, I have never read the article "Tibet culture scribble" written by 耶律大石. Could you please provide a link?

i've posted all episodes on another forum

here is the link

http://www.global_defence_forum.com/...ead.php?t=1391

remove two "_" of that link to make it works

seems G D F has been censord here

[pin_qinghai]

i've posted all episodes on another forum

here is the link

http://www.global_defence_forum.com/...ead.php?t=1391

remove two "_" of that link to make it works

seems G D F has been censord here

Thanks, I have got the access to the article.

Happy new year.

[gunnut]

Sir. gunnut,

Baywatch is so famous, but I didn't have a chance to watch it yet.

Oh I know Baywatch is famous. It's like the most watched most famous show in the history of television. We make fun of the Germans and their obsession with David Hasselhoff. I just didn't know Baywatch is famous in China as well.

[Zhang Fei]

lol, and the US is illegally occupying hawaii, as well. ;)

Lemme guess - this is an expression of Astralis's *pride* in being American. Funny how his "pride" consists mostly of bashing America and defending China. You might almost suspect that his American citizenship is purely a flag of convenience, that the Motherland is where his real loyalties lie.

[astralis]

looks like someone doesn't know the meaning of sarcasm.

i was born in taiwan, which is definitely not PRC; and i grew up in america. pray tell, how is china is supposed to be my "motherland"?

----

EDIT:

mods, can you guys check to ensure that this thread does not fall into flaming? this is the second time i've asked a certain member to comply with the forum rules, but for my part i will cease to reply in the interests of keeping the thread on-topic. thanks.

[pin_qinghai]

astralis is very polite. But I am not going to be that polite to this Zhang Fei guy.


Zhang Fei,

I am in a vacation trip and really don’t want to make any comments now. But when read your comments, I can not control my anger and would like to give you some words. Are you Chinese, Chinese American or just use a fake Chinese name? Have you had any connection with China?

You spread lot of lies in the forum about China and Chinese people. One of the reasons that I start this thread is to clear your lies about China and Chinese people.

When I started this thread, I hoped that you can come out and I wanted to make some arguments with you. You hided somewhere for so long and did not even dare to show up. Once you show up, you made such despicable charges on astralis. astralis gave a balanced view on China, good or bad. Some other people accuse China for its lacking democracy or freedom. Their accusations have some bases. China does have these problems. But your accusations are always baseless and despicable. You are one of those extremists that hoped China to collapse with a dark heart.

I don’t even want to argue with you any more because you are not those who hate China because China has lot of problems. You are one of those extremists who hate China because you are dark heart hated people. China wants to make friend with entire world. But you are not one of them.

You are China’s enemy. You are Chinese people's enemy.

You can dream on China’s collapsing. You can make your efforts for China’s collapsing. I will work hard to make China a better Country. Let’s make the competition and see who will be the winner?

If you have Chinese origin, I would like to give you a Chinese saying (数典忘祖) that best fit you.

Sorry, I don’t want to wish you a better 2007. You can give me a bad wish too.

[Ray]

Do you think he is a Taiwanese and not a Chinese and that is why he speaks from the Taiwanese point of view?

Could it be that he is a important functionary of the KMT?

But whatever, we must respect his views and if one thinks he is wrong, then one should give facts to show how he is wrong/ misguided.

[astralis]

ray,

whatever zhang fei is, he is assuredly not KMT, considering the treatment the CCP gave former KMT chairman lien chan when he visited china.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8q79pAQf4Y0

the kids are saying, "grandpa lien, you've finally come back!..." with the obligatory 拍馬屁, "patting horse butt", aka flattery.

this was pilloried in taiwan for months, with the schoolchildren chant being used from everything from cellphone ring tones to KFC commercials.

so no, he is not KMT. however, his opinions on the matter are not altogether clear, seeing as how his "views" on this thread seem to be that of challenging my patriotism towards america, which is both incorrect and neither here nor there.

[ajtigger]

I don’t even want to argue with you any more because you are not those who hate China because China has lot of problems. You are one of those extremists who hate China because you are dark heart hated people. China wants to make friend with entire world. But you are not one of them.

Hold a second. HOLD A SECOND.

HOOOLLLLD AAAAAA SECCCCCOND.


"China wants to make friends with the entire world".

They just snubbed our PM. If China keeps playing funny games with the world on its human rights abuses, and freaking out completely when someone makes a critical statement about them, they, like a little baby, start acting like a brat, go and sit in their corner, and cry about how "they won't talk to us because we said something critical about them".

That is what I call poor international relations. China's objective shouldn't be making enemies, but it should be making friends with a wide variety of middle and upper world powers--particularly Western powers--to increase its influence in the world. Indeed, the more trade they do with these upper and middle powers, the more economic importance they will have with these nations, and thus the more influence they will have on the world stage. However, the key to having a truly good and influential relationship with a country is not only achieved through a large economic relationship, but also through a strong diplomatic relationship. A strong diplomatic relationship amplifies one's influence within a particular country, even if their are already strong economic ties. China should be looking towards improving its human rights situation and adopt democracy themselves before it starts sending election observers to other countries (yes, that did happen), and it will have less adversarials in the Western World.

And, on Taiwan, give me a break! Let the Taiwanese people be. As seen through their new, democratically-elected government (note democratically elected), a plurality, and likely a growing majority of the Taiwanese people are looking toward independence. They have had their own economy and own, unique, democratic government for quite some time, and should not give it up to China because they--not the PRC--worked so hard to achieve what they achieved economically and democratically.

There. That is my two cents on China.

[highsea]

Pin- welcome to WAB. I have just noticed this thread and have read some but not all of it.

Nice OP, but long! I couldn't read it all in one setting. Maybe next time you could break it up a little bit.

I agree with some of what you have said, and disagree with some. But you have been polite and tried hard to explain yourself, and we appreciate that.

We see a lot of CCP die-hards in these forums, kids who think China can do no wrong, etc etc.. You seem to have a more mature view and are not afraid to say that there is much room to improve. That's good to hear.

I thought your comments on Taiwan were very good- you recognize the value of Taiwan and Hong Kong in bringing much needed reforms to mainland China. That's a big plus for you.

You really should watch some Baywatch, the Germans love David Hasselhoff...

[Ray]

Baywatch is taken to be subversive to the culture in some countries, though not in India. :)

Just ribbing.

In India, it is called Bodywatch! ;)

[-{SpoonmaN}-]

Dear SpoonmaN,

You made reply without even read my comments, do you?

No matter how much economic interdependency we have with Japan, we will not accept the insults. We will protest.

Have you heard how many times Chinese leader called for Sino-Japan friendship? Have you ever heard any Chinese leader and Chinese army leader called for destroying Japan?

For the extreme words in the forum, I myself feel uncomfortable. I started this thread mainly for the reason that hope people will not look at Chinese people as extremists.

Will you be happy to join a celebration of British conquers the Irish and the atrocity they committed to Irish people because British is too important to Irish economically?

Will you be happy to see German PM to honor Adolf Hitler and other Nazi war criminals as and descend of German Jews?

Pin I have to apologise I quoted the wrong post by accident, my comments weren't directed at you, I was going after wangrui961 and I quoted you by accident. And I think you're totally missing the point, he's argued for the outright destruction of Japan, I think you'd have to agree with me that such breathtaking ignorance isn't helping anyone right now, Japan should apologise and take responsibility for its wartime actions, no question about that, but violence will NOT make that happen. Anyway Abe looks like he might be someone the PRC can do business with.
And I don't agree with Koizumi paying a visit to Yasikuni because it makes a point of honouring war criminals, but Japanese people have a right to remember the lives of the millions of people they lost during the war, war criminals aside most of them were victims of Japanese Militarism as much as anyone else in Asia and the Pacific during the War.

[pin_qinghai]

Sir. Ray said “The Master (Serf) relation also exists in China between the Politburo and the common man! in #185 of the India Vs. China (borderline War) thread”.

In fact, Master surf relation also exists in my family. Unfortunately, I am the Serf and my wife and kid are the Masters. They are angry with me on my reading web and making response during vacation. They went to buy stuffs and I got my freedom back, an easy freedom without fight.


I think that Zhang Fei is a Taiwan separatist who predicted that China is certainly going to collapse. I remember that he made such claims. If I am wrong, I would like to apologize to him. If he is a Taiwan separatist, he is China’s enemy, he is Chinese people's enemy and he is my enemy.

Zhang Fei may also be a FLG member. If he is a FLG member, I apologize to him. But I don’t want to talk to him again. I don’t think that FLG is a religion. I think that it is a cult. I don’t want to talk to cult members.


Dear ajtigger,

If you have time, please read the first comment of this thread. I discussed human right, Chinese foreign policy and Taiwan policy.

China’s foreign policy today is making friend with entire world, especially with its neighbors. China is making every effort to make friend with developed countries even if China’s effort is not well received by the opponent, such as the case with Canada.

Canada’s new PM wanted to make a flamboyant show for its domestic audiences. He wanted to show the Canadians that he can teach Chinese President Hu Jiangtao a lesson about human right in public.

Can you image any possibility that Chinese President may let your Canada’s new PM to perform such a show?

It is really your PM Stephen Harper who doesn’t have any diplomatic skill. If he really cares about China’s human right, he can talk with Chinese President in close door. The China’s human right is not really what he cares about; the show that he teaches Chinese President a lesson on human right is really what he cares about.

Sorry, China will not cooperate with your PM on his show that raises his status and puts down Chinese President’s status.

But, China puts all these disputes in low profile and doesn’t want to distort the Chinese-Canada relation too much. Chinese President even meets your PM Stephen Harper for 15 minutes in Hanoi to save some faces for each other.

If Stephen Harper continues to behave in this way, I think that China will treat him in a similar way as China treated Japanese PM Koizumi, which means China will stop top level official contact but let the low level communications and economical cooperations unaffected.


Dear highsea,

I am glad that you like the writings. Thanks.


Dear SpoonmaN,

If Japanese PM changes his visit from official visit to private visit then the confrontation will be lower. China has clearly hinted Japan for that but Japanese PM Koizumi refused. Of cause, China will protest any Japanese PM’s visit of Yasukuni Shrine. The new Japanese PM Shinzo Abe was invited to visit China right after his inauguration. He did not agree that he would totally stop visiting Yasukuni Shrine. China showed good will to him and now the ball is in his field.

In fact, Japanese PMs have done private visit before and China did not raise confrontation to this degree. Please read my comment to Francois in #29.

Happy 2007 !

[astralis]

pin_qinghai,

If he is a Taiwan separatist, he is China’s enemy, he is Chinese people's enemy and he is my enemy.

as you can tell, i am no pan-green- but i support status quo until china is a democratic republic.

however, having said that, i think many chinese, as well as the chinese gov't, would be well-advised in NOT considering separatists "enemies". after all, if the chinese goal is unification, these separatists will also become chinese citizens, no? and we are informed all the time that taiwanese are brothers to the chinese. like a marriage, or a family relationship, you will have good apples with the bad.

better to use a method that includes instead of excludes people. the chinese schizophrenia between policies of inclusion and rhetoric of exclusion has not had a good effect on taiwanese. while most people on taiwan think chen shui-bian's ideas of a "taiwan republic" with a seperate "taiwanese culture" to be rather ridiculous, it is these policies over the last 50 years that have given taiwanese a more separate identity from the chinese.

it is important to understand the roots of why some taiwanese want to be separate from china, if for nothing else than to follow sun tzu's advice of "know thy enemy."

[pin_qinghai]

astralis,

I totally agree to the idea of keeping status quo until china is a democratic republic. I would also take your suggestion to not call the separatists the enemy.

Not considering them as enemy is really a hard thing to do. Around world, there is no bigger threat to China’s future and Chinese people’s future than them. The fight over the Taiwan Strait will be catastrophic for Chinese people in both sides.

Look at those dark greens, some of them even shouted to use Olympic game 2008 (in Beijing) and World Expo 2010 (in Shanghai) as opportunities for independence. They would even like to become the enemy of entire world.

Chinese people look at the Olympic game and World Expo as the milestones to show that hundred years of struggling, suffering and hard work finally achieved something. But those guys wanted to destroy it.