Today in the American Civil War

[Albany Rifles]

John,

All very valid points regarding Sheridan.

And I am hardly his greatest champion. And as the VIth Corps is very near & dear to my heart I know very well abour Cedar Creek and Sheridan's bogarting Wright's laurels.

That said, Warren had made a habit of being tardy and questioning orders ever since he had been placed in command of the V Corps durign the Overland Campaign. He was too deliberate and exacting for effective corps field command.

What was called for at Dinwiddie and 5 Forks was decisive, aggressive action. I know the roads were poor, the terrain heavily wooded and the troops were lashed by rain. But Warren's pacivity was a main cause for the V Corps in being too slow to prepare for battle.

And Sheridan did have authority from Grant to relieve Warren if Sheridan believed it was needed to achieve success. Sheridan grasped the vital significance here...that he had the chance to, finally, after 9 long months, to turn Lee's right flank on the Petersburg line. This he did, opening the way for the breaking of the Siege of Petersburg & Richmond. For all intents and purposes the war ended 7 days later.

As for Chamberlain...he was a great combat commander. He is looking over my shoulder as I type this from a paionting on the wall behind me. But Old Joshua was known to stretch a tale in the telling to make things out better for himself and his friends. And he was also guilty of the Eastern Army-Western Army bias towards Sheridan, Wilson, etc and otehrs who Grant had brought east.

I believe the right move was made for the Union...and that is what matters.

[Albany Rifles]

1865 The Battle of Five Forks. Phil Sheridan Makes Hell Tremble and Grant finally get's around Lee's right flank. It has taken 11 months.

The Battle of Five Forks Summary & Facts | Civilwar.org

[astralis]

one of the things which impress me when reading about Civil War commanders is that many of them started out with at most small-unit experience...and most of them had jumped extremely fast through ranks, probably with not enough time to fully develop their skills at each level.

Warren and Sheridan started out as a 1LT and a newly promoted Capt, respectively. it's interesting to see how they developed so fast over such a short time, and to see which ones obviously hit their level of incompetency. hooker and hood, for instance, were quite competent at division-level command but failed miserably at the next level. Warren seems to have been one level lower than that.

i'd really be curious as to how well our junior leaders today would do if you were to slot them into such a leadership role.

[Albany Rifles]

one of the things which impress me when reading about Civil War commanders is that many of them started out with at most small-unit experience...and most of them had jumped extremely fast through ranks, probably with not enough time to fully develop their skills at each level.

Warren and Sheridan started out as a 1LT and a newly promoted Capt, respectively. it's interesting to see how they developed so fast over such a short time, and to see which ones obviously hit their level of incompetency. hooker and hood, for instance, were quite competent at division-level command but failed miserably at the next level. Warren seems to have been one level lower than that.

i'd really be curious as to how well our junior leaders today would do if you were to slot them into such a leadership role.

Eric,

You have hit on a great point. Warren was a brilliant staff engineer. No doubt on that. What a lot of folks forget is that Sheridan was initially Curtis's quarermaster general as a captain in the Army of the Southwest and performed brilliantly. His ability to change the logistics tail 180 degrees overnight at Pea Ridge was masterful...I am not sure Ingalls could have done as well.

So many of these men grew very rapidly...and many opthers were promoted beyond their competency. There were 3 main reasons (I believe) for this.

1. Some recognized their shortfalls and voluntarily removed themselves...whether in a fit of pique or acknoledging their own shortfall.

2. Politics. A civil war is a politic event at its heart. And the long list of politicians who jumped at eagles and stars on both sides is hardly surprising. 2 further subpoints fall into this category:

- The number of professional military men who used "office" politics in the Old Army for promotion and advancement operated on a grander scale during the ACW. And what did great military success mean in prior generations? The keys to the White House. So whether a local pol or a pol in uniform that was a goal seemingly within their grasp if they could just....

- The other fact is just how competent so many of these political colonels and generals became is astounding.

3. Casualties. The casualty lists of key leaders of both sides was long and bloody. Try to imagine an AOP in 1863 with corps commanders of Reynolds, Hancock and Sedgwick, or Hancock, Reyn9lds and Richardson....well that would have been a hell of a different fighting machine. Look what the loss of Jackson did to the ANV.


And finally, all of these reasons are why I am loath to condemn decisions made on the battlefield ny a commander. I have the benefit of hindsight...they did not.

Except in the case of Judson Kilpatrick...he just sucked!

[Shek]

after White Oak Road and the ensuing Battle of Five Forks, Sheridan really did a bad turn against GK Warren. it had to suck, serving with a fair amount of distinction throughout the war only to be relieved at the very end.

It made for a fitting biography title . . . "Happiness is not my companion."

[Shek]

one of the things which impress me when reading about Civil War commanders is that many of them started out with at most small-unit experience...and most of them had jumped extremely fast through ranks, probably with not enough time to fully develop their skills at each level.

Warren and Sheridan started out as a 1LT and a newly promoted Capt, respectively. it's interesting to see how they developed so fast over such a short time, and to see which ones obviously hit their level of incompetency. hooker and hood, for instance, were quite competent at division-level command but failed miserably at the next level. Warren seems to have been one level lower than that.

i'd really be curious as to how well our junior leaders today would do if you were to slot them into such a leadership role.

With war transitioning into the modern era in the ACW, the old timers had more preconceived notions that the younger officers to overcome. Over time, cream rises to the top.

[Shek]

Eric,

You have hit on a great point. Warren was a brilliant staff engineer. No doubt on that. What a lot of folks forget is that Sheridan was initially Curtis's quarermaster general as a captain in the Army of the Southwest and performed brilliantly. His ability to change the logistics tail 180 degrees overnight at Pea Ridge was masterful...I am not sure Ingalls could have done as well.

So many of these men grew very rapidly...and many opthers were promoted beyond their competency.

I'd add in that many folks were products of the command climate that they were born in. Warren was a product of growing up cautious under McClellan. For the AoP going into May 1864, the only great days they'd had was in the defense at Gettysburg. On the offense, they had oft been surprised by Lee, and so timidity was reinforced by experience. If you had served under Grant, the only bad day that you'd had by May 1864 was in the defense at Shiloh on day 1. If you were on the offense, you were winning. While there are many examples of folks not being bound by the command climate they served in, I think it's something to take into account along with what Buck has above.

[JAD_333]

What a lot of folks forget is that Sheridan was initially Curtis's quarermaster general as a captain in the Army of the Southwest and performed brilliantly. His ability to change the logistics tail 180 degrees overnight at Pea Ridge was masterful...I am not sure Ingalls could have done as well.

He used his rank effectively. By that I mean, he was curt, gruff, and intimidating when he wanted action from his subordinates. I have come across a few senior officers who use those qualities to put the fear of God in their people, and they always get fast results. On the other extreme there are officers who tend to forgive poor performance, and I don't mean slip-ups, which are always bound to happen. They're not feared. In between there are officers you want to please, who can chill you to the bone when they call you on the carpet, but yet are able to calmly inspire you to do better. I admire those in the middle most. A little story to illustrate this: When Colin Powell was not a household name and serving as the SecDef's MA, I was called to his office and asked to bring along 2 officers, a major and a LTC, both army, who had advanced an out-of-town visit for the SecDef. I had no idea what to expect, as I was new to that particular unit and a civilian. It turned out the 2 officers had enjoyed themselves a little too much at a social event held for the SecDef and were out of pocket at the very moment the SecDef decided to leave. They had to be tracked down to get things moving, causing delay in takeoff time. The officers, macho guys both, stood there pale as ghosts while Power dressed them down. He didn't ask for excuses and they didn't give any. I'm sure they had visions of being fired and their careers ruined. Then just like that, Powell shifted gears, got up from his desk and walked over to them. He put his arms around their shoulders and said in a fatherly voice, "Ok men, now let's get on with it." (I don't remember his exact words, but it was something to that effect) And he was right. Both of them became the best advance guys we had. Beyond 'hi' and 'see you later', he didn't say shit to me. He didn't have to. I'd just become their boss, but I got the message loud and clear. To me that is the best and most effective way to officer. Sheridan was the polar opposite, but if results are what count in the end, he deserves his due.

[Albany Rifles]

John,

I have complete agreement with you on GEN Powell...I was squarely in his sites as a Captain when he was FORSCOM commander and he gave me one of the most effective gentlemanly asschewings of my career.

However, that was in a conference room at FT Stewart in peacetime.

Sheridan was on the field of battle with the opportunity to end an 11 month long siege and possibly end a brutal 4 year war.

The mentoring form of leadership was not what was called for.

Was Phil Sheridan a horrible human being? Without a doubt. But by late 1864-1865 he had evolved into a hell of a combat commander.

[Albany Rifles]

Not a good date for the Confederacy.

1863 A mob demands bread from a supply wagon in Richmond, starting the so-called Bread Riot. The mob looted other stores and was personally addressed by Jefferson Davis, who tossed the money from his pocket into the crowd. Police and soldiers eventually dispersed the crowd.

1865 Confederate Government evacuates Richmond, Virginia

The AOP , lead by an assault column formed by the VIth Corps, storms the Confederate lines at Petersburg, shattering the defenses and capturing the Southside Railroad at Sutherland Station and Fort Gregg. AP Hill is killed and Lee realizes his defenses are untenable. He orders his army to withdraw over the Appomattox River in Petersburg and a movement westward to try to link up with the forces from Richmond at Amelia Courthouse.

After 11 months of siege, the 5th Vermont of the famed Vermont Brigade is credited with being the first unit to breech the lines. Led by their 19 year old commander Charles Gould, Company H would be first over the top into the Confederate lines.

Vermont Civil War, Lest We Forget

Selma, Alabama assailed and captured

The Battle of FT Blakely in Mobile begins. The Battle of Fort Blakely Summary & Facts | Civilwar.org

[JAD_333]

John,

I have complete agreement with you on GEN Powell...I was squarely in his sites as a Captain when he was FORSCOM commander and he gave me one of the most effective gentlemanly asschewings of my career.

What a coincidence that we both have Powell memories. My job and his intersected, so I have a lot of Powell stories.

However, that was in a conference room at FT Stewart in peacetime.

Sheridan was on the field of battle with the opportunity to end an 11 month long siege and possibly end a brutal 4 year war.

The mentoring form of leadership was not what was called for.

Was Phil Sheridan a horrible human being? Without a doubt. But by late 1864-1865 he had evolved into a hell of a combat commander.

Point taken, although had Sheridan taken the middle route from the beginning, he might have gotten the same results. It's impossible to say now, but I defer to your superior knowledge of the actors and events of the time.

[Stitch]

What a coincidence that we both have Powell memories. My job and his intersected, so I have a lot of Powell stories.

By all means, share them! Or would this be a better place to share them?

[JAD_333]

By all means, share them! Or would this be a better place to share them?

I definitely will when there is context. :)

[Albany Rifles]

1861 A "test vote" in the Virginia convention shows a 2-1 margin against secession

April 3, 1864 1864 Battle of Elkin's Ferry, AR Battle of Elkin's Ferry - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

1865 Union troops occupy Petersburg and Richmond.

Battle of Namozine Church Battle of Namozine Church - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Albany Rifles]

By all means, share them! Or would this be a better place to share them?

The War Stories Thread under The Field MessSection would be the most appropriate.