They had no victories.The Mongols started to lose in Europe 20 years after the great invasion.
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Originally posted by Mihais View PostThey had no victories.The Mongols started to lose in Europe 20 years after the great invasion.Last edited by Officer of Engineers; 22 Aug 16,, 14:15.Chimo
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Europe was saved because Europe got nothing of value; NOT BECAUSE THEY'VE GOT SUPERIOR MILITARY TECHNOLOGIES! Because they don't. The Turks had superior engineers!To sit down with these men and deal with them as the representatives of an enlightened and civilized people is to deride ones own dignity and to invite the disaster of their treachery - General Matthew Ridgway
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Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View PostThat's because the wars they cared about were a hell of a lot closer to home. Europe was what? A bunch of farms and castles? Rice, gold, silk, silver, spices were not in Europe. Technology and technique, the East was decades ahead of the West. To say the Chinese did not adapt is at the very least horse puckey. The Ming evicted the Mongols out of China with canon fire.
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Originally posted by Mihais View PostAnd what sort of troops were those?The troops that conquered Mongolia,China or Khwarzem were 50-70 years old(Subutai was 70 at the time).The troops were equally good .They had the same training and skill and came from the same lifestyle and culture.
The leaders afterwards were not Genghis or Subutai,but they also faced tougher opposition.The Europeans adapted,fast.The Chinese did not.
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Originally posted by zraver View PostThey were not the same. The follow on generations however hard, were softer than the men who carved the empire so explosively. They had wealth and urbanization which are not conducive to hardy and callous soldiers.Chimo
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I'm not sure what you mean by wealth. A foot soldier in both Genghis or Timur's time can't afford to own his own herd of goats. And most certainly, there was no such urbanization with the Golden Horde.To sit down with these men and deal with them as the representatives of an enlightened and civilized people is to deride ones own dignity and to invite the disaster of their treachery - General Matthew Ridgway
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Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View PostEurope was saved because Europe got nothing of value; NOT BECAUSE THEY'VE GOT SUPERIOR MILITARY TECHNOLOGIES! Because they don't. The Turks had superior engineers!
Artillery was first used in Europe at the same time as in China.
Thing is by 1265 the Mongols were no longer winning and by 1280 they were losing.Those who know don't speak
He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36
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Originally posted by Mihais View PostArtillery was first used in Europe at the same time as in China.
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Originally posted by Mihais View PostEurope's estimated GDP had caught up with China by 1200.
Originally posted by Mihais View PostWhile these are modern estimates,medieval Europe was not backward or poor.Last edited by Officer of Engineers; 25 Aug 16,, 12:28.Chimo
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Sir,
Are you saying the Chinese made a strategic mistake by letting Europe alone, seeing it as poor and underdeveloped (to be a threat or worth the fight)?No such thing as a good tax - Churchill
To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.
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