Belarus: Fraud+

[Minskaya]

Belarus elects entirely pro-government parliament
By Yuras Karmanau on September 24, 2012

MINSK, Belarus (AP) — Not a single opposition politician won a seat in the Belarus parliament in a weekend vote that was roundly condemned by international observers and looks set to deepen the former Soviet nation's diplomatic isolation. The election resulted in representatives of three parties that have backed the policy agenda of President Alexander Lukashenko securing slots in parliament. The main opposition parties had boycotted the election to protest the detention of political prisoners and opportunities for election fraud. Belarus' parliament has long been considered a rubber-stamp body for Lukashenko's policies. He has ruled the former Soviet nation since 1994 and Western observers have criticized all recent elections in Belarus as undemocratic. At least 20 independent election observers were detained, according to rights activists. "Belarus gets ever closer to the worst standards of Soviet elections," said Valentin Stefanovich, coordinator of the Rights Activists for Free Elections group.

Source: AP News

Shades of the Belorussian SSR. I'm still trying to figure out why they even bothered to change the name.

[omon]

you should really talk to ppl that live in belarus. corruption sure exsists there, just like it does in usa, and israel. but it has very little to do with opposition total fail. again, dry articles like this, ( really no news to anyone) doesn't remotely show real world situation on the streets. i personaly don't care how corrupt the gvmnt is, (it is corrupt everywhere), i look at how ppl live in the country, and from very reliable multiple sources, orbinary persons life there is in most cases aren't bad at all, as long as you stay away from politics, you can do pretty much anything, with no fear, once you get into politics, ...as saying goes, you play with fire, expect to get burned.
oh, btw, what did they change the country's name into?

[Minskaya]

oh, btw, what did they change the country's name into?

It morphed in 1991 from the Belorussian SSR to the Republic of Belarus. My father was born in the Minsk Oblast.

[BD1]

you should really talk to ppl that live in belarus. corruption sure exsists there, just like it does in usa, and israel. but it has very little to do with opposition total fail. again, dry articles like this, ( really no news to anyone) doesn't remotely show real world situation on the streets. i personaly don't care how corrupt the gvmnt is, (it is corrupt everywhere), i look at how ppl live in the country, and from very reliable multiple sources, orbinary persons life there is in most cases aren't bad at all, as long as you stay away from politics, you can do pretty much anything, with no fear, once you get into politics, ...as saying goes, you play with fire, expect to get burned.
oh, btw, what did they change the country's name into?

omon, i had a co-worker, a belorussian girl. she told me that every time she visited her relatives, they always offered her (and her family) to stay there, since they really believed that they are in one firm island in a sea of madness around them.

then again, there´s another story , from the same girl - relative got visa, the boy then took his girlfriend and her sister and they went to usa. there the guy had car accident that punctured his lung, making it impossible to return to belarus when his visa run out (could not fly in airplane). the belarus goverment told them they were traitors and that they were not welcome to come back ( i heard it around 2008, so can´t remember, wheter their passports were voided or not). finally guy made it to europe, but was not allowed back to homeland. so he stayed in berlin, where he hoped his parents could meet him. but the goverment did not issue permit to his father to travel to germany, instead demanding from the parents every single expense the state had ever spent on the guy (somehow they added together expenses of education, vaccines and so forth)

now, as i wrote, i heard it several years ago, so there might be some mistakes i made, but the main storyline is as my coworker told me. i thought she was adding a bit to it, but she swore that it´s the truth, and she was not of exagerrating kind of person

[BD1]

also, worth watching the parade from 2006 the best parts start from 11.00

inauguration from 2006

too bad this clip here leves out the best part, as the guys standing on stage, right side take turns,. almost falling on their collective knees to beg lukashenka to take the burden, to serve the people of belarus. amongst them a orthodox priest etc. i remember how i had a day off and was just switching channels on tv, when i happened to see it live. jaw dropped on the floor.
what one might expect from some oriental tyrant in say 19th century,or more like the court of peter the great, but in 21st cent. europe, in a land where everybody at least theoretically should have some sense of self-dignity and self-respect.......

[omon]

omon, i had a co-worker, a belorussian girl. she told me that every time she visited her relatives, they always offered her (and her family) to stay there, since they really believed that they are in one firm island in a sea of madness around them.

then again, there´s another story , from the same girl - relative got visa, the boy then took his girlfriend and her sister and they went to usa. there the guy had car accident that punctured his lung, making it impossible to return to belarus when his visa run out (could not fly in airplane). the belarus government told them they were traitors and that they were not welcome to come back ( i heard it around 2008, so can´t remember, wheter their passports were voided or not). finally guy made it to europe, but was not allowed back to homeland. so he stayed in berlin, where he hoped his parents could meet him. but the goverment did not issue permit to his father to travel to germany, instead demanding from the parents every single expense the state had ever spent on the guy (somehow they added together expenses of education, vaccines and so forth)

now, as i wrote, i heard it several years ago, so there might be some mistakes i made, but the main storyline is as my coworker told me. i thought she was adding a bit to it, but she swore that it´s the truth, and she was not of exagerrating kind of person

i'm sure such scary sories, can be found in any country, even usa. but they don't reflect country as a whole.

now the topic is corrupt gvmnt, (no doubt it is so), but has it been a factor why opposition lost?? ask ppl that live there now, they will tell you, there was nobody worth voting for last election. the opposition didn't know much what to do, except being opposition. at least batko, runs the country, and actually does it quite well compared even to democratic ulkraine, (its gdp per capita is 2x of ukraine.).
there is no gvmnt without corruption, never was, never will be.

you do realize that lucashenko cabinet and his party, do have connections, that will be broken if someone else takes the wheel, lots of things will be dysfunctional.
we see it happened before, rise of ussr\fall of ussr. you know only in a song they can destroy entire old world to the last brick, and build new one, where nobody becomes somebody. well in real world it doesn't work. we sure are fast to destroy, but than nothing is being build. pretty much reality. lots of ppl in russia think of ussr times as of good old days time, where things worked, factories worked, farms worked...... not dark times they don't want to comeback to.
i say belaruss ppl got the best option this election they had available.

[Doktor]

Can someone tell me why it is a fraud?

Rating of the opposition was 20% (or so someone said) and they decided to boycott the elections. What should have been done the elections not to be "fraud"?

As for the life there, can't comment, but I have read somewhere that the unemployment is low (and faked) and that's all that matters to me atm, coming from a country with 30% rate.

I bet that anyone who will now leave Belarus, stay elsewhere for 5 years and come back home will have a cultural shock. Twice ;)

[omon]

I bet that anyone who will now leave Belarus, stay elsewhere for 5 years and come back home will have a cultural shock. Twice ;)

i doubt it. plenty of Belarus ppl travel all over the world, and plenty of ppl come visit Belarus from all over the world, my old friend does business with Belarus, he buys doors there. goes there every year almost, and ppl that he does business with in Belarus come here to visit as well. that is how i know about Belarus. it isn't really nearly as bad as msm paints it.

[Minskaya]

i doubt it. plenty of Belarus ppl travel all over the world, and plenty of ppl come visit Belarus from all over the world, my old friend does business with Belarus, he buys doors there. goes there every year almost, and ppl that he does business with in Belarus come here to visit as well. that is how i know about Belarus. it isn't really nearly as bad as msm paints it.

Belarus is effectively a dictatorship in the Soviet mold, and is considered a pariah state by the European Union and westernized democracies. Sanctions have been imposed.

The Freedom Index classifies Belarus as a "repressed" economic state

Transparancy International classifies Belarus as "very corrupt"

Reporters Without Borders (press freedoms) classifies Belarus as a "very serious situation"

Universal Human Rights Index
"The political system of Belarus seems to be incompatible with the concept of human rights as enshrined in the charter of the United Nations and in the international human rights instruments to which Belarus remains a party, consequently, the [UN] Human Rights Council should either call for the democratization of the political regime and a change in the political behaviour of the government or admit that Belarus' human rights record cannot be improved because the human rights violations are consistent with the political nature of the regime."

In addition, Belarus is complicit in human trafficking (primarily the sex-slave trade).

[omon]

Belarus is effectively a dictatorship in the Soviet mold, and is considered a pariah state by the European Union and westernized democracies. Sanctions have been imposed.

In addition, Belarus is complicit in human trafficking (primarily the sex-slave trade).

lol, so what? do ppl that live there care? i doesn't matter 1 bit to them what eu or westernized democracies think. go there see thing for yourself. you'll be surprised.
actually the leader in exporting sex slaves is democratic ukraine. ask ppl there, what good did their orange revolution brought them. not a damn thing.

as for corrupion, show me where it doesn't exist.

[Minskaya]

actually the leader in exporting sex slaves is democratic ukraine.

Population demographics. The Russian mafia sex-slave-trade encompasses Belarus, Ukraine, and Transnistria.

as for corrupion, show me where it doesn't exist.

This is a cop-out. Corruption can be quantified. Simply because vice exists everywhere does not mean that degree is superfluous and unimportant.

[Officer of Engineers]

What's the context, Captain?

My RSM (who also left the CF and is now a consultant for an IT firm) went to China to help set the IT firm's head office. They found an official who helped them out with all the paperwork, streamline the application processes, got the proper permits, all told, avoided the dreaded bureaucratic nightmare that was legendary in China.

Just about when they were to sign the papers, that official asked, what's in it for him. He did not do all this work for nothing.

Then it dawned on my RSM. What was called a bribe is actually a commission. That official essentially acted as the company's consultant. Here, we would have paid lawyer and consultant fees.

Was the official corrupt? Legally, yes, he was but as he said, he did not do all that work for nothing.

[S2]

"...Was the official corrupt? Legally, yes, he was but as he said, he did not do all that work for nothing."

Was not the official compensated by his government for the exact purpose of facilitating and expediting the bureaucratic process required to do business in the PRC?

[Officer of Engineers]

Was not the official compensated by his government for the exact purpose of facilitating and expediting the bureaucratic process required to do business in the PRC?

According to my RSM, the man did a hell of a lot more work than what's demanded by the job, often meeting with them late into the night and days off just so that the proper papers were signed.

As far as my RSM and the IT Firm was concerned, the man earned every penny they paid him and they saw it as a bargain in how fast they were set up.

[Minskaya]

What's the context, Captain?

Pervasive and extensive Colonel. Getting anything done in virtually any sector requires bribe payments. The state owns the major media, the major industrial concerns, and the agricultural cooperatives. The non-state-run media is continuously harassed and journalists arrested. Seven out of nine opposition presidential candidates were arrested. International election observers were arrested/detained. Belarus still officially calls its security service the KGB, and Russian military forces still remain within its borders. By any modern metric, this is an extremely corrupt and authoritarian dictatorship.