High price of oil

[tankie]

Sell the car and buy a horse and cart. It should blend in quite well in Barrow

Hahahahaaarrr V

[T_igger_cs_30]

Hahahahaaarrr V

:Dancing-Banana::Dancing-Banana::Dancing-Banana::Dancing-Banana:

[tankie]

Very droll , i see your pullin the cart tho ,,,,,,,,,,,,trigger

[T_igger_cs_30]

very droll , i see your pullin the cart tho ,,,,,,,,,,,,trigger

tw*t

[tankie]

tw*t

Yup heh heh , i think the horse was called Hercules in that series

[Double Edge]

Pffffffffffffffttttt back at ya m8y , im getting my motor converted to LPG , mercedes clk 3.2 LPG 60 PENCE a litre , but watch it get hammered for tax when lots of peeps do the same BASTARDS , used to be able to get a govt grant for going green but not now .

Are you serious ?

LPG works for simple engines, anything more and its not going to do too much. This will not stop some enthusiastic salesman trying to convince you otherwise.

CNG is better, but unless you got enough distributors around it won't be practical. You'll have to let her go.

[tankie]

Are you serious ?

LPG works for simple engines, anything more and its not going to do too much. This will not stop some enthusiastic salesman trying to convince you otherwise.

CNG is better, but unless you got enough distributors around it won't be practical. You'll have to let her go.

Very serious D/E, the Italian romano system , best there is , i will let you know if my simple engine has improved or not , below is a bit of info ;)




*
Unleaded Diesel Super LPG
Highest price: 133.9p 139.9p 143.9p 79.9p
Average price: 129.6p 135.6p 136.6p 73.9p
Lowest price: 126.9p 130.9p 129.9p 69.9p
Find your cheapest station on PetrolPrices.com

*

3-4 CYLINDERS FROM
6 CYLINERS FROM
8 CYLINDERS FROM
All prices include VAT



*
You leave Your Car 8AM and can pick it up afternoon time

*
We discuss with You what tank You want (toroidal, cylindic, size and placement) where You want the filling point and any of Your special requests

*






*

Greener and Cleaner
o Compared with petrol and diesel, LPG is the best environmental alternative
o LPG is a low carbon content fuel that can reduce your carbon footprint
o LPG produces fewer harmful emissions that impact on local air quality.
o Engine noise is low
o Less damage to soil and water in case of spills - LPG will quickly evaporate in the event of a fuel spill. Unlike petrol and diesel, there is no risk of ground or water contamination

Cheaper
o Savings of around 40% compared with petrol and over 20% compared with diesel on fuel costs on fuel savings
o Cheaper road tax for some vehicles
o Discounts on London Congestion Charges
o Discounts on some car parking schemes

Greener
Reduce your carbon footprint by running on LPG

Independent Pan-European tests were undertaken in 2003 which demonstrated the following results:

o Petrol CO2 is 20.3% more than LPG
o Diesel CO2 is 1.8% more than LPG
The 2005 report by CONCAWE found a small CO2 advantage of LPG over diesel increasing to 10% by 2010 as a result of the worsening CO2 emissions of diesels as those engines struggle to meet Euro V emission standards.


Cleaner
Air quality, particularly in urban areas, is a continuing issue for the nation’s health.

Department of Health statistics show that particulates are responsible for thousands of advanced deaths and thousands of instances of illness; also NOx emissions are a major element of low-level ozone, which causes smog and can worsen existing asthma conditions

Extensive independent tests showed that:
o One diesel vehicle emits 120 times the amount of fine particles as the equivalent LPG vehicle
o It takes 20 LPG vehicles to emit the same amount of NOx as one diesel vehicle.
The implementation of “Euro” emission limits is bringing about an improvement in the NOx and particulate emissions of new vehicles but this is only to a limited extent compared with LPG. Even Euro VI diesel vehicles will have many times more NOx emissions than those running on LPG.


Fuel Savings.
LPG vehicle users can save around 40% on fuel costs compared with petrol, and over 20% compared with the equivalent diesel. A typical example of a popular car is the 2005 Vauxhall Vectra for which the figures are:

Fuel Type

Model details

Euro Emission Level

MPG *

Fuel
Price **

Cost per 1000 miles
LPG

122ps 1.8i
5 speed saloon

IV

29.4

£2.64 per gal
58.1p per litre

£89.79
Diesel

120ps 1.9cdti
6 speed saloon

IV

49.5

£5.95 per gal
131.0p per litre

£120.20
Petrol

122ps 1.8i
5 speed saloon

IV

38.6

£5.34 per gal
117.5 p per litre

£138.34
* Source - Vehicle Certification Agency imperial combined mpg
**Source- Fleet News – 19/6/2008


Another way of looking at the massive savings by running on LPG autogas is by comparing the number of miles travelled for £10 for each fuel. The figures for the above example show:



The low price of LPG autogas is a result of the low level of fuel duty applied by the government. This government support is in recognition of LPG’s environmental benefits

In the 2010 Budget, Chancellor Alistair Darling signalled extended support for the LPG autogas industry.

Fuel duty on petrol and diesel will go up by 2.76p per litre in the current year whilst the duty on LPG will go up by only 2.685p per litre.

As regards the differential in duty we have with petrol and diesel, the government headline commitment is that this differential would not decrease by more than 1p per litre per year. However, rather than seeing this decrease, we are seeing the differential increase to our advantage:

- Year beginning 1/4/2009 –
Petrol / diesel increase 3.84p whereas LPG increase only 3.45p
- Year beginning 1/4/2010 –
Petrol / diesel increase 2.76p whereas LPG increase only 2.685p
- This means that the differential will be at its highest ever amount at 42.43p in January 2011

The Chancellor also announced all fuel duty would rise by 1p per litre in real terms in April 2014, ensuring the 5 year commitment on fuel duty is continued.

Fuel duty increases in the coming year are being phased in as follows:

With effect from 1/4/2010 -
Fuel duty on petrol will go up 1p per litre to 57.19 p
Fuel duty on LPG will go up 1.43p per litre to 15.265p

With effect from 1/10/2010 –
Fuel duty on petrol will go up 1p per litre to 58.19 p
Fuel duty on LPG will go up 0.71p per litre to 15.975p

With effect from 1/1/2011 -
Fuel duty on petrol will go up 0.76p per litre to 58.95p
Fuel duty on LPG will go up 0.545p per litre to 16.52p

Mike Chapman, Autogas Manager of UKLPG said "This is really good news for motorists thinking of converting to LPG, as motorists are assured of savings for 5 years, it makes a worthwhile investment, even in these difficult economic times"




Did you know...?

o LPG stands for Liquefied Petroleum Gas
o LPG autogas in the UK is Propane. LPG is also available as Butane – for further information go to
o LPG autogas is by far the most widely available alternative fuel in the UK.
o There are over 1300 public access vehicle refuelling sites in the UK in addition to which many businesses have their own “bunkered” facilities.
o Research and testing conducted by Dutch research institute TNO concluded that the safety of modern autogas vehicles is in fact better than for petrol vehicles.
o Converting your car can increase the power and performance
o LPG autogas is well established worldwide as an environmentally friendly transport fuel in use in over 12 million vehicles.
o There are over 7 million in Europe and in the UK the market has developed over the last 10 years to around 150,000 LPG vehicles on our roads.
o The UK market is predominantly cars and light commercial vehicles up to 3.5 tonnes. Most petrol driven vehicles can be converted to run on LPG.
o Around 60% of the world supply of LPG comes from the separation of natural gas products, and 40% is a by-product from the refining of crude oil.
o The UK produces around 5.8 million tonnes of which over 2.5 million tonnes is exported. Increased use of LPG autogas will reduce our reliance on imported petrol and diesel.
o In addition to being an automotive fuel, LPG is widely used as an off mains gas fuel and is also available in bottles or cylinders. It is used in domestic, commercial and agricultural situations and for leisure heating and cooking

[zraver]

The rising price of oil futures has nothing to do with a supply shortfall. Lybia's output only amounts to 2% of the world's daily requirement.

The Saudis have increased their output on fears that a large spike in prices will further destabilize the world economy.

But it's not easy to calm markets when investors see a chance to profit from bad news. I expect supplies will soon reach glut levels, if they haven't already.

Traders looking to make a buck drive prices up and statiosn have t9o follow to make sure they have cash on hand to buy the gas when those contracts come due. Granted stations don't drop nearly as fast....

Also in the US the oil industry sidelines a lot of refinning capacity and has refused to build new capacity or agressively expand pipelines in order to create bottlenecks that create artificial shortages and thus maximize profits. US on hand oil reserves hit record levels in Janauary and haven't fallen.

[1979]

Did you know...?

o LPG stands for Liquefied Petroleum Gas
o LPG autogas in the UK is Propane. LPG is also available as Butane – for further information go to
o LPG autogas is by far the most widely available alternative fuel in the UK.
o There are over 1300 public access vehicle refuelling sites in the UK in addition to which many businesses have their own “bunkered” facilities.
o Research and testing conducted by Dutch research institute TNO concluded that the safety of modern autogas vehicles is in fact better than for petrol vehicles.
o Converting your car can increase the power and performance
o LPG autogas is well established worldwide as an environmentally friendly transport fuel in use in over 12 million vehicles.
o There are over 7 million in Europe and in the UK the market has developed over the last 10 years to around 150,000 LPG vehicles on our roads.
o The UK market is predominantly cars and light commercial vehicles up to 3.5 tonnes. Most petrol driven vehicles can be converted to run on LPG.
o Around 60% of the world supply of LPG comes from the separation of natural gas products, and 40% is a by-product from the refining of crude oil.
o The UK produces around 5.8 million tonnes of which over 2.5 million tonnes is exported. Increased use of LPG autogas will reduce our reliance on imported petrol and diesel.
o In addition to being an automotive fuel, LPG is widely used as an off mains gas fuel and is also available in bottles or cylinders. It is used in domestic, commercial and agricultural situations and for leisure heating and cooking

Yes I know that but LPG is still made out of ..well petroleum.
Besides Renault Fluence ZE is anounced to be in the 23.000 euro price range ( not sure if it includes VAT)
hoWEVER that car might not be a solution for Jad who seams to drive 200 miles each day ( or maybe his car eats a lot of fuel I do not know ).

[gunnut]

It's all part of the master plan. Buy their oil now (and yes the $$ flowing out hurts), but when they run out, that's the time to give them the finger and start using our fields again.

That is my conspiracy theory as well.

[gunnut]

Anyone noticed that oil was around $40 a barrel when Obama took over? It has climbed over $100 this past week. Where is the media firestorm questioning Obama's role in pushing oil prices? I seem to remember the media questioning Bush's role in pushing oil prices higher.

[astralis]

gunnut,

Anyone noticed that oil was around $40 a barrel when Obama took over? It has climbed over $100 this past week. Where is the media firestorm questioning Obama's role in pushing oil prices? I seem to remember the media questioning Bush's role in pushing oil prices higher.

i suppose there'd be a firestorm had obama proclaimed a revolutionary democratic agenda while invading a middle eastern country which itself could threaten its oil-rich neighbors...

[JAD_333]

Yes I know that but LPG is still made out of ..well petroleum.
Besides Renault Fluence ZE is anounced to be in the 23.000 euro price range ( not sure if it includes VAT)
hoWEVER that car might not be a solution for Jad who seams to drive 200 miles each day ( or maybe his car eats a lot of fuel I do not know ).

I get 20 mpg (32km)--Toyota medium size truck--drive about 200 to 300 miles a week on average, not a day. A diesel VW is appealing--43 mpg (69km), but just wouldn't do with a load of plywood.

[gunnut]

gunnut,



i suppose there'd be a firestorm had obama proclaimed a revolutionary democratic agenda while invading a middle eastern country which itself could threaten its oil-rich neighbors...

Bush invaded Iraq not for oil, but for the analysis of various intelligence agencies that concluded he had WMD.

Libya has oil. Obama is thinking about a no-fly zone. I hope we stay out of that one. It's an internal problem and poses no threat to us.

[Double Edge]

Very serious D/E, the Italian romano system , best there is , i will let you know if my simple engine has improved or not , below is a bit of info

You seem very confident, so do you have friends that have confirmed savings of 30-40% ?

LPG vehicle users can save around 40% on fuel costs compared with petrol, and over 20% compared with the equivalent diesel.

What i'm not seeing in these claims is what the expected average speed your car should be doing to make these savings. Motorway speeds is where the engine is most efficient, if that's what you're doing most-of-the-time then you may see savings. However stuck in traffic jams and not going over 30mph very often and the picture might not be very different to petrol. This graph assumes you are doing motoroway speeds all of the time and its a nice flat (no hills) motorway.

In the ideal scenario you spend 10 pound and get 111 miles with LPG vs only 72 miles with petrol.



The only thing i see going for LPG, is that its more green. And AFAICT this isn't the MAIN reason you're going for it given your penchant for piloting behemouths of steel

Cousin of mine converted his van to LPG for a bit then switched back because the savings weren't very different. I'm not sure whether avg speed played any role here or not.

How long is the break even period btw ? time for the cost of the conversion kit to be amortised by the savings you make. Or another way of looking at it is how many more miles have you got to put on the clock to break even and ONLY THEN start to see savings ?