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  • US will hand over Afghanistan to Pakistan

    On Sunday, US President Barack Obama suggested to The New York Times that hope in Afghanistan lay in reaching out to the “moderate Taliban”. For India’s Ministry of External Affairs (MEA), this is their worst nightmare coming true. After handing the “moderate Taliban” a share of the power in Kabul, say Indian officials, America will pull out troops, allowing the Pakistani army to run Afghanistan on its behalf.

    True, the US’ immediate plans are to boost its presence in Afghanistan by another 17,000 soldiers. But that is being seen as a temporary, Iraq-style surge, aimed at putting in place a suitable government before pulling out the forces.

    Top Indian policymakers tell Business Standard that the Obama administration’s goal is clear: rather than trying to win the war in Afghanistan, simply aim at bottling terrorism inside the Pakistan-Afghanistan area, and monitor the borders electronically to prevent any “leakage” of jehadis.

    An American “virtual cage” is already in place to keep the jehadis inside. Senior Indian officials point out that Pakistan’s immigration network has been entirely computerised with US help. When travellers’ passports are swiped at immigration, the information goes in real time to US intelligence agencies. The Container Security Initiative allows US Customs to monitor every cargo container that passes through a Pakistani port. It is no accident that, since 9/11, not a single terror attack has reached American soil.

    What worries Indian policymakers is that none of this protects India. The MEA has discovered, in its engagement with Pakistan over the 26/11 Mumbai terror strikes, that nobody is really in control in that country. Explains a senior official, “Pakistan’s government was ready to sign or say anything that we wanted them to. But having signed, they are completely unable to deliver.”

    Even if Islamabad wants to deliver, South Block officials say, the frightening reality is that it can’t. The government cannot rely on its police and investigative agencies; the army has discovered over the preceding year that it does not have the capability to control the tribal areas. And now, the recent attack on Sri Lanka’s cricketers in Lahore heralds a new menace: it is the first time the Lashkar-e-Toiba has struck within Pakistan.

    The Lashkar is easily Pakistan’s most formidable radical group. Musharraf cracked down on the Jaish-e-Mohammad in 2002 and 2003, leading to several foiled attempts on his life. But he dared not confront the Lashkar, with its far better organised military, political, civil and financial structure. After 26/11, General Kayani moved against the Lashkar. But he has quickly discovered that even the Pakistani army is unable to put the Lashkar down.

    MEA officials say, “The Pakistan army has been badly bloodied in the tribal areas; it is in no state to take on the Lashkar. Today, like a typical military hierarchy in the face of defeat, it has turned inward looking. The Pakistan army does not want to be a part of a big anti-terror push.”

    To deal with multiple agencies in Pakistan, which are no longer acting in unison, South Block is coming around to the belief that India needs multiple foreign policies. “We need a different Pakistan policy for the government; a different Pakistan policy for the army; different policies for the political parties, for business, for civil society.”

    The unpredictability within Pakistan is multiplied, say Indian officials, by the fragmentation within Pakistan’s radical fringe. During the anti-Soviet jehad in the 1980s and 1990s, Pakistan dealt with just one jehadi leader, Gulbuddin Hekmatyar. In 2005, when negotiating a ceasefire in Waziristan, Pakistan had 17 tribal Shoora (council) chiefs sitting at the table. Now there are dozens of shooras, often with competing demands.

    While physically moving out of this snake pit of ‘jehadism’, the US will continue to exercise influence by controlling the Pakistan army, as it has for decades, through the flow of arms and grants. In this, the US has little option; the Pakistan army controls a nuclear arsenal.
    http://ajaishukla.blogspot.com/2009/...nistan-to.html
    Its true that the US will eventually leave Astan. One wonders will it do so in the manner that the writer illustrates?
    sigpicAnd on the sixth day, God created the Field Artillery...

  • #2
    The taliban are slowly taking control of large swathes of Pak land...Talibanisation is slowly but surely happening in PAk.. if the US leaves, you'd see the Taliban take control of both Astan and Pak rather than the other way around

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Mercenary View Post
      The taliban are slowly taking control of large swathes of Pak land...Talibanisation is slowly but surely happening in PAk.. if the US leaves, you'd see the Taliban take control of both Astan and Pak rather than the other way around
      exactly.
      but one clarification: taliban is not alone. taliban, LeT......etc are under direct patronage of ISI. and ISI is and off shoot of Pak Army. so effectively pak army will rule over Astan and Pak. so back to 90's strategic depth.

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      • #4
        With the Barak Obama regime hinting towards talks to seclude the moderate Talibs from the jingoistic onces...Bad Taliban vs Good Taliban, I don't think that the US has any plans to vacate the place anytime soon. The reinforcement of some 17K troops also don't indicate to the same.
        sigpicAnd on the sixth day, God created the Field Artillery...

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        • #5
          Honestly what on earth is the ISI and islamibad thinking? Having militrant hardline religious idiots in charge of the government isn't good for pakistan militarily or economically. It hasn't worked out well of Iran or afgahnistan and it has only sorta worked out for saudi arabia? Why do they think it'll work any better for pakistan?
          Oh and even better pakistan has Bombs and some decent missiles this isn't a good thing.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Maxor View Post
            Honestly what on earth is the ISI and islamibad thinking? Having militrant hardline religious idiots in charge of the government isn't good for pakistan militarily or economically. It hasn't worked out well of Iran or afgahnistan and it has only sorta worked out for saudi arabia? Why do they think it'll work any better for pakistan?
            Oh and even better pakistan has Bombs and some decent missiles this isn't a good thing.
            Well they are probably thinking "yes they may be idiots but at least they're our idiots."
            For Gallifrey! For Victory! For the end of time itself!!

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            • #7
              Bolo, they really should think of them as their own idiots though, it seems that a fair ammount of the pakistani population isn't extremely violent agressive repressive religous reactionaries. I kinda get sending them out of your country to have them go cause trouble in places where you don't want to be seen as a destablizing force and even providing them with minimal support while doing that. Send them into Kasmir to keep india busy, (yeah I'm going to get jumped on by indian posters here) send them to the various other stans to spread insanity and keep your neighbors busy, heck even ship them across the middleeast as forgien contract workers to do the whole bring in forgien currency see whats up be sleeper agents and disenters there but really this just seems like the NSA supporting the Branch Davidians to use an annology of american groups.

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              • #8
                They should just get off it already. Pakistan can't even protect their citizens much less convoys headed to our troops in Afghanistan. I hate to admit it, but Pakistan is slowly losing the war against the Taliban. Even the Bulloch separatists are popping their heads up. If this economic crises persists, Pakistan will go into severe disorder. Just remember what happened when Bhutto was assassinated.

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                • #9
                  One problem:
                  The entire sane world is perturbed and troubled thinking about their problems, minus the Pakistanis themselves.
                  sigpicAnd on the sixth day, God created the Field Artillery...

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Deltacamelately View Post
                    One problem:
                    The entire sane world is perturbed and troubled thinking about their problems, minus the Pakistanis themselves.
                    When the Taliban are shooting up Sri Lankan team and blowing up Sufi shrines, mosques and burning girl's schools I would hope Pakistanis would be thinking about their problems because they have many.

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                    • #11
                      But Kron thats the next village over and they were questionable people anyways, The upright elders of my village are good people.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Maxor View Post
                        But Kron thats the next village over and they were questionable people anyways, The upright elders of my village are good people.
                        I would hope there is more nationalism than that. If they are really so non-chalant about it then maybe the country should be broken up.

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                        • #13
                          There was an article in the Telegraph last week written by a European . I never considered posting it on this website until after reader your views on the Taliban. but now I cant find it. British readers of the Telegraph on line must have noticed it.

                          The long and short of it all , the writer suggested that the Taliban were never interested in spreading their beliefs to other countries. Having won the civil war, they were quite content to mind their own business, and get down to running their country.Yes they gave elements of Al Qaeda shelter, but they didnt have a lot in common with them in terms of spreading fundamental Islamism. It wasn't until after intrusion of the West into Afghanistan that saw a mass inbound of all the various religious crazies from other parts of the Arab world to lend a hand to fight that intrusion, a change, saw a gradual change in attitude by the Taliban. as an example The Taliban were never into suicide bombing, until taught it by foreign fundamentalists.

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                          • #14
                            Things have gone downhill since women have been emancipated
                            The Taliban idea of

                            Keeping women at home to

                            Sweep the Floors
                            Cook Tea
                            Make Babies

                            Cant be that bad can it? (How do you add smiley face?)
                            Come to think of it How many leaders in Asia and the Middle east where women play the submissive role, will take to being told what to do by a women?
                            Last edited by Optimus; 23 Mar 09,, 02:22.

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                            • #15
                              Those faces option don't always show up when i post?
                              Last edited by Optimus; 23 Mar 09,, 02:14.

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