Why does China have the highest population?

[clyder]

Nigerian population

That sounds a bit right, power to the Kama Sutra!

I amazed by the result for the nigerian population, the first census in 1951 had about 35 million, in 1961 I think it had gone up to 53 million, and had reached the low seventies in 71, after which point having left the country I stopped following it, but this means that it has gone from a population like that of the UK to one like that of the USA in about 50 years.

[Ironduke]

I was just thinking of this.. What about China is it, that allowes it to have the highest population?? Even in ancient times, China (or the kingdoms that would eventually make up China) had populations higher than anywhere else in the world.

Is it Geography? Did china have more resources available than anywhere else in the world that allowed for steady growth? Or was it a culture of love:)) that made for china's demographic dominance?

Or perhaps, it has something to do with the out of Africa theory.

Ancient man wandered across the super landmass that makes up Europe/Africa/Asia.. And seeing as China is as far as you can go on that landmass while not freezing to death in Siberia, or going for a swim in the oceans...

Then naturally I would assume, that more and more of these wandering people would have ended up in China?

What say you?

The more harvests you can squeeze into a year, the more people you can squeeze into an area. There's only one growing season in Europe, perhaps something like two in populous areas of China and three in India.

[xinhui]

Here is my view


Actually, there are number of works out there to address this very question and the debate is petty settled down to this: The creation of a centralized bureaucracy with a self interest from the early days to see a growth of population as a tax base.

Having a strong cultural influence helps, for an example, Cantonese (Guangzhou area) were populated by large number of tribes until the Han dynasty, but overtime, they were assimilated. Manchurian is another example, in which they are currently numbered about 12 million, while ethnically speaking, they are not Han, but they do consider themselves Chinese. My point is that the growth of “Chinese” is not just by natural birth. There were a great deal of cultural assimilated during the past 5000 years, specially during the Tang, Song and Qing period. (Sounds horrible, I know)

[ahmet]

Here is my view


Actually, there are number of works out there to address this very question and the debate is petty settled down to this: The creation of a centralized bureaucracy with a self interest from the early days to see a growth of population as a tax base.

Having a strong cultural influence helps, for an example, Cantonese (Guangzhou area) were populated by large number of tribes until the Han dynasty, but overtime, they were assimilated. Manchurian is another example, in which they are currently numbered about 12 million, while ethnically speaking, they are not Han, but they do consider themselves Chinese. My point is that the growth of “Chinese” is not just by natural birth. There were a great deal of cultural assimilated during the past 5000 years, specially during the Tang, Song and Qing period. (Sounds horrible, I know)

The Great Wall of China may have had an effect on those mass assimilations. The wall was built to protect the cultivation land from nomads, and that land is today's China. And that protection may have encouraged the population growth too and maybe more migrants to the area, though I don't know if there'd been any after the wall.

[xinhui]

But the great wall only exists up north.

Put it this way, the founder of the Tang Dynasty, one of the greatest dynasty in Chinese history was a half Turk who lived outside of the Greatwall. Greatwall is a military installation, but it never stop migration nor trade, after all, the silk road goes beyond the great wall.


My point is that while most of the population growth is due to the nature growth. However, assimilation and migration are two elements that should not be discounted.

[ishbara]

Because farming needs too many agriculturist population.China has world's biggest and productive arable fields.

[Aniki]

I was just thinking of this.. What about China is it, that allowes it to have the highest population?? Even in ancient times, China (or the kingdoms that would eventually make up China) had populations higher than anywhere else in the world.

Is it Geography? Did china have more resources available than anywhere else in the world that allowed for steady growth? Or was it a culture of love:)) that made for china's demographic dominance?

Or perhaps, it has something to do with the out of Africa theory.

Ancient man wandered across the super landmass that makes up Europe/Africa/Asia.. And seeing as China is as far as you can go on that landmass while not freezing to death in Siberia, or going for a swim in the oceans...

Then naturally I would assume, that more and more of these wandering people would have ended up in China?

What say you?

a lot of reasons for this. on the surface, there are cultivation methods, tools etc. dwell deeper, its about ancient social ideology, tax systems etc. there were also external influences, like the introduction of corn, potato and other food 6 or 7 centuries ago.

the chinese learned systematic cultivation methods like 3000yrs back. they place seedings at careful intervals instead of just casually spreading them around. then they get to use iron tools pretty early, and also oxen and water buffaloes to increase productivity. there were also good irrigation systems.

chinese dont tax according to head counts in ancient times. they tax according to household. so if a household has more people, it is still taxed the same way as one with fewer members. even when it comes to serfdom, bigger families still have a slight advantage. this is also why we see chinese lived with their grandparents or even great grandparents in ancient times, and being filial to elders was one of the major virtues. wanting a household separation was usually considered as an selfish act.

the next thing is the rule for inheritance. unlike ancient european kingdom/states where the heir is the person, male or female, with the closest blood lineage, chinese heirs, either in the household or kingdom, is by default the eldest son. daughters usually have no right to inheritance. therefore the will to produce more sons is strong. if a family gave birth to a few daughters, its more likely the wife will try again and again for a son. also because of the nature of inheritence rule, elderly females can only secure the latter half of their life if they have sons, especial sons that inherit the household. so the motivation was there.

there was also an early inderstanding of the importance of manpower in terms of national security. more people = more fighting men. we see chinese lords giving rewards or tax exemptions to families that give birth to more children. that was like 2500 yrs ago.

but chinese population usually peaked at about 50-60 mil in ancient times(probably 200BC up till 800AD), 100-150mil in medieval to modern times. in fact they only cross the 200mil line like 250-300 years ago. all were related to agriculture techniques, land area, variety of planted food, the level of healthcare, and most importantly the availability of transport.

so what happens when there is a relative overpopulation? famine will occur when production is usually around 80% of its peak. cos ancient modes of transport cannot provide a 100% flow. food will not reach disaster area in time, then rebellion will broke out, dynasties changed etc. the cycle is usually 250-300 years, and that is usually in line with the changes in the chinese dynasties.

[Aniki]

China has world's biggest and productive arable fields.

this is probably not true. the usual chinese description is that china has about 1/3 land in the form of mountains, deserts and permafrost. another 1/3 with pollution at different level and fresh water shortage. the rest of the 1/3 house the majority of the population and not all are arable land. if we compare china with US, both have approx. the same total land area but US has about 18% arable land, and china 14%. if we look at india, which has about 1/3 total land area of china, has around 49% arable land, probably the same size as the chinese, or maybe slightly more.

[Aniki]

But the great wall only exists up north.

Put it this way, the founder of the Tang Dynasty, one of the greatest dynasty in Chinese history was a half Turk who lived outside of the Greatwall.

i think he's a 3/4 Hun not a half Turk. his mom and grandma were both Huns. his wife was also a Hun so his son is probably reduced to only 1/8 Han Chinese.

[IDonT]

The Chinese population, as a percentage of the world population has actually dropped. 100 years ago, 25 percent of the world's population was Chinese.

[xinhui]

i think he's a 3/4 Hun not a half Turk. his mom and grandma were both Huns. his wife was also a Hun so his son is probably reduced to only 1/8 Han Chinese.

a wiki search....

The Sui stirred trouble and conflict amongst ethnic groups against the Turks.[59][60] As early as the Sui Dynasty, the Turks had become a major militarized force employed by the Chinese. When the Khitans began raiding northeast China in 605, a Chinese general led 20,000 Turks against them, distributing Khitan livestock and women to the Turks as a reward.[3] On two occasions between 635 to 636, Tang royal princesses were married to Turk mercenaries or generals in Chinese service.[60] Throughout the Tang Dynasty until the end of 755, there were approximately ten Turkic generals serving under the Tang.[61][62] While most of the Tang army was made of fubing Chinese conscripts, the majority of the troops led by Turkic generals were of non-Chinese origin, campaigning largely in the western frontier where the presence of fubing troops was low.[63]

[Aniki]

a wiki search....

The Sui stirred trouble and conflict amongst ethnic groups against the Turks.[59][60] As early as the Sui Dynasty, the Turks had become a major militarized force employed by the Chinese. When the Khitans began raiding northeast China in 605, a Chinese general led 20,000 Turks against them, distributing Khitan livestock and women to the Turks as a reward.[3] On two occasions between 635 to 636, Tang royal princesses were married to Turk mercenaries or generals in Chinese service.[60] Throughout the Tang Dynasty until the end of 755, there were approximately ten Turkic generals serving under the Tang.[61][62] While most of the Tang army was made of fubing Chinese conscripts, the majority of the troops led by Turkic generals were of non-Chinese origin, campaigning largely in the western frontier where the presence of fubing troops was low.[63]

this entry didnt state the origins of the tang empresses.

i made a mistake in the previous post classifying them under Huns. they are in fact, Xianbei, a Tungusic('Dong Hu' in chinese, meaning 'east of the Huns') tribe which land of origins can be traced to modern Oroqen in china. the Tungus were defeated by the Huns around 200BC, a part fled to 'Wuhuan mountains', which is around modern Hebei, Liaoning province, known as Wuhuan tribe, and a part fled to 'Xianbei mountains' along the Amur, known as Xianbei tribe.

according to chinese history records, the empresses of Sui dynasty and the first 3 empresses of Tang dynasty are all of 'XianBei' origin, a line of Tungusic clan which invaded northern china during the 5th-6th century and formed a number of successive dynasties (the 'south and north dynasties'), finally conquered by Sui dynasty. their surnames, Tuoba, Dugu and Zhangsun, are all of Tungusic origin, not Turkic (although modern linguists found some relations between the two, they are not identical).

the russian name of 'siberia' is very possibly an inaccurate phonetic translation of the term Xianbei.

[Kernow]

Because it has more people. lol.

[Is Real]

The Chinese showed excellent knowledge of medicine and an almost monk like attitude toward there diet, I believe the quality of there food along with natural medicines they took would influence there mortality rate and increase there fertility rate.