What is the best battlefield to do a staff ride at?

[Ucar]

And how to do a staff ride in a battlefield that has been almost completely razed, distorted, misplaced ? The trench systems are no more, weapon emplacements are used as picnic areas, the bunkers have benches on them for sightseeing. Also add to the equation that the Gallipoli battles are not a major part of the Cirriculum at the Turkish Staff College expect for mentions of Atatuk's successes on the defensive.

The Turkish Military and Historical education is full of myths which are taught and presented as facts to all both officers and civilians alike.

I doubt if you could find more than 10 officers in the whole Turkish Army who could give you an extremely detailed overview of Turkish dispositions, tactics and unit dispositions in the Gallipoli theatre. In fact the achievements of the 19th Infantry Division are studied as a primary focus of the battle, whereas the fiercest fighting was carried by the units of 9th Infantry Division.

You can go and discuss the battle of Yusufcuk Tepe (Scimitar Hill) because a bus parking lot now rests over the axis of advance. I could provide more examples but this simply saddens me ever more.

Once again, it is better to prepare yourself as a tourist, take your maps and go to Gallipoli to tour the battlefield. Gallipoli, Sarikamis, Kut-el Amara...are only myths to ordinary Turkish officers and general puublic. You will not be able to get any detailed and specific information from fellow officers in the TuAF.

[Albany Rifles]

What Shek said.

Staff Ride
About Staff Rides


Here are some good sites with an explanation.

I have participated in staff rides and have lead many. And I can tell you they take a lot of preparation. I would say that for every hour I spend on a battlefield I spend 8 - 10 hours preparing.

That said they are excellent ways to combine history, lessons learned and and ways to improve on your own TTPs.

Just an FYI, the towers on the Gettysburg battlefield were emplaced by the US Army at the turn of the last century for students from the Army War College at Carlisle Barracks could come and conduct staff rides.

Hope these help

[lazybastard]

So what's the oldest battlefield possible for the purpose of staff rides? Would it be possible to do staff rides on some of the battles of 30 Years War? Or even earlier? How about Cannae?

[Big K]

Once again, it is better to prepare yourself as a tourist, take your maps and go to Gallipoli to tour the battlefield.

i totally agree with you....such a shame on us!!!...

[Shek]

So what's the oldest battlefield possible for the purpose of staff rides? Would it be possible to do staff rides on some of the battles of 30 Years War? Or even earlier? How about Cannae?

Any battlefield will work as long as you know where it's at, have a knowledge of the battlefield, and decide that it is appropriate for what you want to get out of it (i.e. what lessons do you want to demonstrate? decision making? reading terrain? shaping the battle? command and control? etc.).

Just for a feel of a staff ride and the preparation necessary, here's a glance at one potential staff ride at Antietam.

http://www.sais-jhu.edu/programs/ir/...rary_Final.pdf

[JAD_333]

Just for a feel of a staff ride and the preparation necessary, here's a glance at one potential staff ride at Antietam.

http://www.sais-jhu.edu/programs/ir/...rary_Final.pdf

I was enthralled by the methodology and penetrating questions that lay out the staff ride. Thanks for sharing them.

[Shek]

I was entralled by the methodology and penetrating questions that lay out the staff ride. Thanks for sharing them.

No problem - my pleasure.

:PAID ADVERTISEMENT ON:

The above staff ride was organized under Professor Eliot Cohen, author of Amazon.com: Supreme Command: Soldiers, Statesmen, and Leadership in Wartime: Books: Eliot A. Cohen, which is the first book to be featured for the book of the month club here

:PAID ADVERTISEMENT OFF:

[JAD_333]

No problem - my pleasure.

:PAID ADVERTISEMENT ON: The above staff ride was organized under Professor Eliot Cohen, author of Amazon.com: Supreme Command: Soldiers, Statesmen, and Leadership in Wartime: Books: Eliot A. Cohen, which is the first book to be featured for the book of the month club here :PAID ADVERTISEMENT OFF:

Just now ordered the book. Sampled a few pages. Looks like a good read...Amazon $2.99...can't go wrong. Thanks.

[cape_royds]

No staff rides, here, I'm a civilian.

But I've seen parts of the battlefield near Alamein (near Tel El Eisa), and walking the landscape firsthand made a strong impression. What particularly struck me was the shallowness of the relief. The Mitiyeira Ridge is almost unnoticeable, yet the reverse slope it offered was crucial for the Germans. There was also a complete absence of any kind of cover. No wonder the assault took place at night, and in the darkness and dust, no wonder it was easy for columns to lose their way to their assembly areas.

The other thing I found striking was the fertility of the soil. Just add some water and it blooms. No wonder the Egyptians today complain about the hundreds of thousands of hectares of land still ridden with mines and unexploded ordnance.

[Bigfella]

There is an obvious problem with a lot of modern battlefields - their scale. I visited Verdun as a child. We only saw a fraction of the battlefield, but a short time inside one of those forts was very informative.

Along the same lines as Shek's tour of the Casbah in Algiers, I can recommend a trip around the citadel in Hue, Vietnam. I was unprepared for its scale & gained a much clearer appreciation of the difficulties of the fight from just a morning wandering about. I would love to do it with a clearer account of the battle, and may do so in the future.

It also has the advantage that you can stay in a hotel within the citadel, and break for lunch at one of the excellent Vietnamese restaurants there.

I'd like to see some of Napoleon's battlefields. He was a master of terrain, and I can only imagine that actually seeing Waterloo or Austerlitz would add to any understanding of the battle.

I can also recommend shows such as 'Battlefield Detectives' & especially the British 'Two men in a Trench' for a look at some famous & not so famous battlefields.

[Dreadnought]

IMO the ocean. Its natural occurances make it diffacult for either side to hold an upper hand from the beginning and skill must come into play. Not that it doesnt on land but there is far less consealment in the open sea.;)

[Shek]

I've got a thread on the Gettysburg staff ride that I just finished, but I figured I'd drag this thread back to the top in case newer members have some experiences to contribute.

I still enjoyed the Antietam staff ride better, but I think that probably had to do with 1) not visiting the cemetery at Gettysburg (the new visitors center is no longer right next to the cemetery) and 2) having been less familiar with Antietam and so I learned more during the course of the staff ride (I am not implying that I know a lot, just giving a relative comparison).

[Albany Rifles]

Antietam

One of the other good points about Antietam from a staff ride point of view is you can stand right outside the visitors center and pretty much see the entire battlefield (except for Snavely's Ford and Burnsides Bridge) from that one spot. I always felt that it gave an excellent vantage point to set the stage.

[Kernow]

Operation Goodwood for the Tank Soldiers on here.

[Silent Hunter]

As a civilian, I don't do these sort of things.

I have seen some of the D-Day areas, such as Pointe du Hoc (lot of craters).

This topic reminds me of that scene from Patton.