Global Warming, A Good Thing?

[dalem]

Basically, the main objective is to reduce gas emissions by the industrialized countries but could affect the economy that's why US did not ratify..also, the main concern is that India and China considered as developing countries are exempted to follow but are now having increasing gas emissions..

The Kyoto Accords are nothing more than an attempt to cast a hex on the U.S. because anthro-driven global warming is the equivalent of a belief in magic.

There is no proof that Carbon emissions have anything to do with global temperature or climate. None. Yet many people insist it's true, just like many people insist magic is real. And they want to use this magic (or the belief in it if they themselves are not believers) to maximize their own power and put a hit on the most powerful economic engines on the planet, all for something that, even if it achieved what they wanted, would have a negligible effect on their biggest fear.

Fools.

-dale

[xrough]

There is no proof that Carbon emissions have anything to do with global temperature or climate. None. Yet many people insist it's true, just like many people insist magic is real.

dale,

what you are saying is some kind different from what are our teachers taught us from grade school to college..


try to look at these:
Green Facts
Working Group I: The Scientific Basis
Alcoa

[dalem]

dale,

what you are saying is some kind different from what are our teachers taught us from grade school to college..


try to look at these:
Green Facts
Working Group I: The Scientific Basis
Alcoa

Your teachers are also fools then.

-dale

[xrough]

Your teachers are also fools then.

-dale

You are saying that our scientists and professionals are fools?

[dalem]

You are saying that our scientists and professionals are fools?

If they reject the scientific method and embrace the magical fear of man-made global warming, yes.

-dale

[RedArmySurplus]

correct me if i am wrong, but i heard that if Kevin Rudd wins the upcoming Australian election, he will ratify the Kyoto protocol...........

[brokensickle]

A hotter sun creates more C02...

Study : Carbon emissions climbing at alarming rate

WASHINGTON (AFP) - Carbon emissions grew an alarming three times faster between 2000-2004 than in the 1990s worldwide, as wealthy and developing nations showed no progress in managing the greenhouse gas, a US study said Monday.

Carbon emissions grew at a 3.1 percent annual rate between 2000-2004, compared to 1.1 percent per year in the previous decade, according to the study published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences.

The rise is a reversal of a long-term trend toward greater energy efficiency and reduction in the use of carbon fuels, the researchers said.

"No region is decarbonizing its energy supply," said the study published in the scientific journal's May 21-25 edition.

"Despite the scientific consensus that carbon emissions are affecting the world's climate, we are not seeing evidence of progress in managing those emissions in either the developed or developing countries," said study co-author Chris Field.

"In many parts of the world, we are going backwards," said Field, director of the Carnegie Institution's global ecology department.

Moreover, the study said, the growth of global emissions in the 2000s was faster than in the highest scenarios by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), the United Nations' scientific authority on global warming.

The accelerating rate of carbon dioxide emissions is largely due to rising energy consumption and use of carbon to produce it, in tandem with increasing population and per-capita gross domestic product, the study said.

The acceleration of carbon emissions was biggest in developing nations with booming economies such as China, where the rise reflects the growth in per capita GDP, the study said.

Developing nations contribute about 40 percent of total emissions, but they were responsible for a large majority of the growth in carbon dioxide emissions between 2000-2004, the study said.

In 2004, nearly three-quarters of the growth in emissions arose from the world's developing and least developed economies, which make up 80 percent of the global population.

Developed nations, including the former Soviet Union, contributed some 60 percent to the total emissions, the study said. The world' wealthiest nations account for 77 percent of total emissions since the industrial revolution.

The study you quote seems a little questionable to me because of the dates sited. 2000-2004, sounds like politically motivated dates. In 2000 Al Gore lost to George Bush. It would seem the Democrats have crafted this article to fear monger the weak minded to believe things have got worst because of President Bush. But hey the price of fuel has went up world wide. You would think that these numbers would drop because people tend to drive less when fuel is high. I know I, and many people I know, have cut back on their driving to save money. Not to mention more people including myself are driving more fuel efficient cars since the price has risen.

I'll bet there is a DemocRAT behind the crafting of this article, if not Big Al himself.

Question the politics xrough lest people will manipulate you into voting for them base on the use of fear tactics in hopes you will not think the matter through.




IVAN

[xrough]

The study you quote seems a little questionable to me because of the dates sited. 2000-2004, sounds like politically motivated dates. In 2000 Al Gore lost to George Bush. It would seem the Democrats have crafted this article to fear monger the weak minded to believe things have got worst because of President Bush. But hey the price of fuel has went up world wide. You would think that these numbers would drop because people tend to drive less when fuel is high. I know I, and many people I know, have cut back on their driving to save money. Not to mention more people including myself are driving more fuel efficient cars since the price has risen.

I'll bet there is a DemocRAT behind the crafting of this article, if not Big Al himself.

Question the politics xrough lest people will manipulate you into voting for them base on the use of fear tactics in hopes you will not think the matter through.




IVAN

I wonder if you guys are experiencing hotter summer or some unusual weather?because we really have much hotter summer reaching as much as 36 degrees celsius..I think no Democrat or any politician could manipulate that..

[xrough]

Update:

US 'opposes' G8 climate proposals

The US appears to have rejected draft proposals by Germany for G8 members to agree tough measures in greenhouse gas emissions, leaked documents have shown.
Wide-ranging US amendments to a draft communique prepared ahead of June's G8 in Germany summit cite a "fundamental opposition" to the proposals.

Germany wants all G8 members to agree timetables and targets for major cuts.

Greenpeace, who leaked the document, said it showed UK PM Tony Blair failed to persuade the US to alter its stance.

In the document, US officials make major changes to the communique.

In comments printed in red ink, the US negotiators express disappointment that earlier concerns have not been taken on board.

The changes strike out entire sentences and significantly reduce the certainty with which the statement addresses climate change.

"The US still has serious, fundamental concerns about this draft statement," a red-inked note reads.

"The treatment of climate change runs counter to our overall position and crosses 'multiple red lines' in terms of what we simply cannot agree to," it continues.

"We have tried to 'tread lightly' but there is only so far we can go given our fundamental opposition to the German position."

However, in Washington, senior US lawmakers have written to President Bush expressing their dismay at the administration's position, the AFP news agency reports.

US 'isolated'

Correspondents say the document hints at a looming struggle over the issue of climate change at the G8 summit, to be held on 6-8 June in Heiligendamm, Germany.

Chancellor Angela Merkel wants to use Germany's presidency of the G8 to secure a major climate change deal, including:


Agreement to slow the rise in average temperatures this century to 2C

A cut in global emissions by 50% below 1990 levels by 2050

A rise in energy efficiency in power and transport by 20 percent by 2020.
Greenpeace Director John Sauven described the US position as "criminal".

"The US administration is clearly ignoring the global scientific consensus as well the groundswell of concern about climate change in the United States," he said.

Mrs Merkel should make it clear the US was isolated on the issue among G8 members, he added.

Speaking on 24 May, British Prime Minister Tony Blair suggested the US - could be on the verge of altering its climate policy.

The US has not signed the Kyoto Protocol, which sets out targets for lowering emissions until 2012.

"I can't think that there's going to be many people running for presidential office next time round in the US who aren't going to have climate change in their programme," said Mr Blair.

"I think it is possible that we will see action - and at least the beginnings of that action at the G8 - I hope so. That's what I'm arguing for."

[xrough]

Update:

Japan eyes 50% greenhouse gas cut

Japan's Prime Minister, Shinzo Abe, has said the world should halve emissions of greenhouse gases by 2050.
It is the first time Japan has set a firm target to replace the present Kyoto protocol, which expires in 2012.

The plan is believed to be less demanding than other proposals from European countries such as the UK.

But Mr Abe said it was important to come up with a scheme flexible enough to win over those countries which are among the world's biggest polluters.

"We must create a new framework which moves beyond the Kyoto Protocol, in which the entire world will participate in emissions reduction," Mr Abe said in a speech in Tokyo.

He made it clear that his country wanted to take a leading role in efforts to reduce greenhouse gases.

But Mr Abe said he believed those efforts would fail unless the countries which are among the biggest polluters, China, India and the United States, could be persuaded to take part.

Energy efficient

He said that any new post-Kyoto framework to try to reduce CO2 emissions must be flexible enough to be acceptable to every country in the world.

Different countries might need to take different kinds of measures, he said, adding that Japan would help by sharing the knowledge that has allowed it to become the most energy efficient country in the world.

"Japan, as a country with advanced technologies, can make a significant contribution," he said.

Mr Abe said Japan would work with the World Bank and the United Nations, to find extra money to help fund assistance for poorer countries who find it difficult to improve energy efficiency, he said.

According to the BBC correspondent in Tokyo, Chris Hogg, Japan is still struggling to meet its current obligations to reduce greenhouse gases by 6% by 2012.

To some extent that is because Japanese firms were already very energy efficient when the targets were set, our correspondent says.

Mr Abe said he would work harder to make sure Japanese public bodies and big companies cut emissions further, and added that he would encourage ordinary Japanese people to do their part too.

The Kyoto Protocol, which was signed in Japan in 1997, requires the 35 nations that signed up to the pact to cut their greenhouse gas emissions by 5% from 1990 levels, by 2012.

[dalem]

I wonder if you guys are experiencing hotter summer or some unusual weather?because we really have much hotter summer reaching as much as 36 degrees celsius..I think no Democrat or any politician could manipulate that..

Weather is not climate.

Even if we are getting hotter summers, what is causing it?

-dale

[brokensickle]

I don't doubt that there is global warming......

I wonder if you guys are experiencing hotter summer or some unusual weather?because we really have much hotter summer reaching as much as 36 degrees celsius..I think no Democrat or any politician could manipulate that..

But lack luster politicians who have nothing that they really want to say about their agendas adopt a snake oil salesman approach to the latest eco-hype such as the C02 issue to sidetrack from their unpopular agendas of say, 'increasing the size and scope of government.'

Al Gore wants to get elected. When he and Bill Clinton were in office the warming globe was not such an issue, neither was bombing Yugoslavia. When the republicans are in office the democrats turn on the political machine saying that everything the conservatives do is racsist, causes pollution, takes food from old folks and babies...you name it they've blamed it on the republicans. And yet were we and nature not putting C02 into the air just as much as when Al and Bill were in office? They say that they hate the war in Iraq, but were willing to go to Yugoslavia with virtually no media out cry. Note: the media is the the big weapon in the political machine.

The truth is that the Sun heats up and the Earth gets hot. Did you know that C02 spikes up when the sun gets hot? Did you know that the Earths heat has risen many times in history well before cars and industrialization? Did you know that the heat on the Moon and Mars have increased at the same % rate as Earth because the Sun's solar radiation has increased? Did you know that the Earth has benefited from warming to a much greater temperatures in the past by making frozen Northern land masses warmer and agriculturally more productive while increasing rains in dryer lands?

So the big questions are ignored by a bias media and snake oil salesmen (politicians) who have nothing good to offer the general public but a bloated government and 3rd world economy.



Ivan

[dalem]

For nightsoil.

-dale

[Parihaka]

"None of the models used by IPCC is initialised to the observed state and none of the climate states in the models corresponds even remotely to the current observed climate.

"The state of the oceans, sea ice and soil moisture has no relationship to the observed state at any recent time in any of the IPCC models.

"There is neither an El Nino sequence nor any Pacific Decadal Oscillation that replicates the recent past; yet these are critical modes of variability that affect Pacific rim countries and beyond . . . the starting climate state in several of the models may depart significantly from the real climate owing to model errors" and "regional climate change is impossible to deal with properly unless the models are initialised".

GCMs "assume linearity" which "works for global forced variations, but it cannot work for many aspects of climate, especially those related to the water cycle . . . the science is not done because we do not have reliable or regional predictions of climate".

KEVIN Trenberth is head of the large US National Centre for Atmospheric Research and one of the advisory high priests of the UN's Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC).

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