fuel efficiency

[tlake]

It seems that whether by intention or design Japanese manufacturers have long had a fuel efficiency advantage over their American counterparts. Maybe it's because US car makers have just never wanted to sell a car with good gas mileage?



V8 gas guzzler

[TopHatter]

It seems that whether by intention or design Japanese manufacturers have long had a fuel efficiency advantage over their American counterparts. Maybe it's because US car makers have just never wanted to sell a car with good gas mileage?

I happen to fully agree with what you're saying but your two vintage advertisements used as proof are the worst case of apples and oranges I've seen in a long time

[omon]

ppl didn,t care about mpg before fuel crisis, than japan moved in, and ppl saw those tiny cars with good mpg advertised, and fell for it,it was really hard to belive that v8 boats are capable of good milage, yet today, v8 corvette, firebird, camaro, can acheve 30mpg hwy, v8 impala, grand prix, can deliver 27 and more mpg hwy, but ppl still under impression that v8 can,t be economical, my 06 2.4l 4 cyl accord gets 31 hwy, yet 7.0l v8 in corvette z06 gets the same. when vette cruises at 70mph, its engine idles, my accord needs 2500rpms at least to maintain 70mph.

ppl think that to get good milage they need something entirely different, yet, the solution is right before them, all it needs a little adjustment, like taller gearing, better combustion..ect.

[TopHatter]

Oh yeah and I love how history repeats itself:

Gas crunch? Make sure every vehicle advertisement says something - anything - about it's fuel efficiency....non-existant or not.

The Best Fuel Economy In It's Class!

Whatever the hell that means when you're talking about a gigantic pickup truck with a gas-guzzling 8 cylinder engine.

[gunnut]

It seems that whether by intention or design Japanese manufacturers have long had a fuel efficiency advantage over their American counterparts. Maybe it's because US car makers have just never wanted to sell a car with good gas mileage?

Both. Japanese are great at making small things. Ever been to Japan? Ever noticed everything is small there? They pay a lot of attention to details and comfort because things are small.

Japanese cars started out small because they had to fit Japan's crowded urban roads. Small cars have an inherent advantage in fuel economy.

Americans have the luxury of space. We like big things. Bigger is better. Bigness can mask lack of attention to details. Big cars are gas guzzlers. But they are inherently safer and can haul more cargo.

The sad thing is Japanese carried their attention to detail into their big cars. Big Lexus sedans and Toyota Trucks still retain high build quality and great ergonomics. American small cars are small, but the attention to detail is just not there so they never sold well. This was fine when gas was cheap. Sell big cars. They have better margin anyways.

Fast forward 2 years when gas hit $4/gal. Big cars don't sell and the Big 3 are caught with their pants down having never diversified into the small car market.

[JamesCash]

they are inherently safer

With the technical achievements lately safety has become almost completely dependant on the design of the car.
Euro NCAP - For safer cars | Small Off-Road 4x4

All the SUV's have about 4-5 stars but so do alot of the family cars. That's only for the new cars though. For example a 2003 Ford Fiesta is safer than a 1996 Range Rover.

Volkswagen has done some very nice things with their diesel engines, great technology and amazing efficiency.

[dalem]

I loved my little GLC. I was very sad when I wrapped it around a tree.

-dale

[glyn]

[QUOTE=dalem;534390]I loved my little GLC. I was very sad when I wrapped it around a tree.

I don't suppose the tree was all that happy with your creative driving style either!

[gunnut]

With the technical achievements lately safety has become almost completely dependant on the design of the car.
Euro NCAP - For safer cars | Small Off-Road 4x4

Of course, all else being equal, a large and heavy car is still safer. The advanced construction and structural design used to make small cars more survivable can equally make a large car even safer.

All the SUV's have about 4-5 stars but so do alot of the family cars. That's only for the new cars though. For example a 2003 Ford Fiesta is safer than a 1996 Range Rover.

Don't read too much into those "star" ratings. I'm sure somewhere there's a little disclaimer that says "for the class." A Fiesta might have 5 stars, but that's for the subcompact class. It's about as safe as you can get in that class. The Range Rover might only have 3 stars, but that's in the medium SUV class. It could be safer if the design was better.

Volkswagen has done some very nice things with their diesel engines, great technology and amazing efficiency.

Not sure why we don't like diesel here. Fuel efficiency was never a problem for us. People here would drive hybrids before diesel.

[omon]

diesels are overrated, thery are about 25% more economical, but diesel in us cost about 25% more, that is only price of the fuel, diesel cars are on avarige 2-3g more expencive than gas cars, not every gas station sells diesel, very few mechaniks, outside dealer's service center know how to work on diesels. so why bother?

[JamesCash]

Oh, I didn't know that the star ratings are relative. They showed some controlled crashes in Top Gear which were both entertaining and unsettling as we have a really cheap car and will probably die in any crash above 40 mph.

Diesel is actually cheaper in Europe. Although it's only for frequent drivers as diesel drivers need to pay more tax.

[tlake]

I happen to fully agree with what you're saying but your two vintage advertisements used as proof are the worst case of apples and oranges I've seen in a long time

True, but I think the relativities mean something, in that they are the sort of cars the automakers aim for. For today's scenario substitute a Toyota Prius and a Chevy Suburban, in that although Japanese automakers do make SUVs and American manufacturers have made and do make small cars (e.g. Chevette), their specialty of the day still revolves around small and large cars respectively. So we should show a small Japanese car and large US vehicle because they do share road space and are core business (although this might change as GM and Ford have promised recently) for their companies.

[TopHatter]

True, but I think the relativities mean something, in that they are the sort of cars the automakers aim for. For today's scenario substitute a Toyota Prius and a Chevy Suburban, in that although Japanese automakers do make SUVs and American manufacturers have made and do make small cars (e.g. Chevette), their specialty of the day still revolves around small and large cars respectively. So we should show a small Japanese car and large US vehicle because they do share road space and are core business (although this might change as GM and Ford have promised recently) for their companies.

Well, I think Gunnut answered it pretty well http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/534262-post5.html

A big part of it is, Space.

[tlake]

Well, I think Gunnut answered it pretty well http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/534262-post5.html

A big part of it is, Space.

Space is key, it's natural to go big when you have space, and that leads to the problem that in a fuel crisis big vehicles share road space with small vehicles with possible negative consequences. This happened in 1974 e.g. car below sharing the road with a two stroke Subaru R360 (remember entrepreneur Malcolm Bricklin?). When a Denali collides with a tiny Smart car...that's a crisis. With cars we have yet to reach the happy medium.:)