Border face-off: China and India each deploy 3,000 troops

Oracle

Oracle

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NEW DELHI: The ongoing troop face-off between India and China on the Sikkim-Bhutan-Tibet tri-junction has emerged as the biggest such confrontation in the region in decades, with both sides continuing to pump in reinforcements to the remote border region.

Even as Army chief General Bipin Rawat reviewed the ground situation by visiting the headquarters of the 17 Mountain Division in Gangtok and 27 Mountain Division in Kalimpong on Thursday, sources said the two rival armies had strengthened their positions at the tri-junction by deploying around 3,000 troops each in a virtually eyeball-to-eyeball confrontation.

The Indian Army, on its part, refused to say anything. But sources said though there had been other troop standoffs at the tri-junction over the years, the latest one at the Doka La general area was clearly the most serious.

"Both sides are as yet not willing to budge from their positions. Flag meetings and other talks between the rival commanders have not worked till now," a source said.

During his visit, General Rawat especially concentrated on the deployments of the 17 Division, which is responsible for the defence of eastern Sikkim with four brigades (each with over 3,000 soldiers) under its command.

"All top officers, including the 33 Corps and 17 Division commanders, were present during the extensive discussions. The chief will return to New Delhi on Friday morning," the source said.

Undeterred by Beijing's aggressive posturing, India has made it clear that it will not allow China to construct a motorable road till the tri-junction through the Bhutanese territory of Doklam plateau, as earlier reported by TOI.

Bhutan, too, has issued a demarche to China over the construction of the road towards its army camp at Zomplri in the Doklam plateau, asking Beijing to restore status quo by stopping work immediately.

"China is trying to build a 'Class-40 road' in the Doklam plateau that can take the weight of military vehicles weighing up to 40 tonnes, which include light battle tanks, artillery guns and the like," the source said.

Interestingly, the People's Liberation Army declared in Beijing on Thursday that it had conducted trials of a new 35-tonne tank in the plains of Tibet, though it added that "it was not targeted against any country". The Indian defence establishment is concerned at the "creeping territorial aggression" by China, which aims to progressively swallow the 269 sq km Doklam plateau to add "strategic width" to its adjoining but narrow Chumbi Valley, which juts in between Sikkim and Bhutan.

China has also been pushing Bhutan hard for the last two decades to go in for a "package deal".

Under it, Beijing wants Thimphu to cede control over Doklam plateau, while it surrenders claims to the 495 sq km of territory in Jakurlung and Pasamlung valleys in northern Bhutan.

But India is militarily "very sensitive" about the Doklam plateau, especially the Zomplri Ridge area because it overlooks the strategically-vulnerable Siliguri corridor or the 'Chicken's Neck' area.

India has progressively strengthened its defences in the Siliguri corridor, the narrow strip of land that connects the rest of India with its north-eastern states, to stem any Chinese ingress. "But it remains a geographical vulnerability. China has constructed several feeder roads from Tibet to the border with Bhutan, and is also trying to extend its railway line in the region," the source said.
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Indo-China border in Sikkim is settled. This is happening in the Chumbi valley, where India-Bhutan-Chinese borders meet. For years China has been occupying this valley metres by metres violating Bhutan's sovereignty.

Road building a direct violation of pacts: Bhutan

This valley is strategically very important for India as PLA troops can cut off North-East India from mainland India by dominating Siliguri Corridor also known as Chicken's Neck, if they control it. And the best way to lay claim and control the area is to build a road(infrastructure), place artillery and SAM batteries, just what the Chinese did in SCS. The British occupied this territory alongwith Tibet in 1904 till 1908. And so, China is now also laying historical claims to this area. Didn't Japan control a part of China sometime before WWII?

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Has China miscalculated on the border? Or, is this a deliberate provocation?

I don't understand if the author is deliberately trolling. The Chinese know Bhutan's security is tied to India, and that India will come to their aid in Siliguri Corridor at the very least. This is a must. Indira should have asked for some land from Bangladesh during the 1971 war. That parcel of land should have been a pre-condition for the liberation war support. It seems, none of the Congress leaders had anything called 'strategic thinking' in their head. The good thing that has come out of this incident is that though the area has significant IA deployed, it would now be fortified by tanks, artillery and missile regiments etc. And I hope the learning is clear, that the Chinese can never be trusted. If the PLA wants to get the same thrashing as in 1967, they are more than welcome to fire first.
 
Oracle said:
India should shed 'strategic anxiety', join Belt and Road Initiative: Chinese media

The Chinese are stressing on it again and again, even amidst the border stand off.
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Am starting to wonder if the Chinese ever wanted India to join the BRI. Their actions prior to the meet did not suggest that. There was just this invitation and nothing more. Getting India on board would certainly be good for the BRI but not unless they address our concerns. Until that happens we provide an alternative in concert with the Russians and Japanese and interested others, a competing plan that promises to be consensual, transparent and rule of law abiding.
 
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Double Edge said:
Am starting to wonder if the Chinese ever wanted India to join the BRI. Their actions prior to the meet did not suggest that. There was just this invitation and nothing more. Getting India on board would certainly be good for the BRI but not unless they address our concerns. Until that happens we provide an alternative in concert with the Russians and Japanese and interested others, a competing plan that promises to be consensual, transparent and rule of law abiding.
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Exactly. Getting India into BRI is not in Chinese interests as they have to address India's concerns, a rival.

But this article suggests otherwise, Beijing using Doklam to arm-twist Delhi on OBOR?

Is it fair to assume that Chinese commentators lie through their teeth to test Indian response?
 
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China’s maximalist position aimed at cramping India’s strategic space

China’s maximalist position aimed at cramping India’s strategic space

NEW DELHI: China's attempts to lay claim over areas south of the India-China-Bhutan tri-junction, as made obvious through a map released by Beijing a few days ago, could worsen the ongoing stand-off in the Doklam area. Indian authorities see this as not just intended to take a maximalist position in the dispute, but also to obfuscate the main issue of PLA's violation of the status quo in the region.

This fits in nicely with China's almost habitual strategy to create a smokescreen of victimhood, even as it itself encroaches upon disputed territory. The stand-off in the Doklam area continues with Indian forces blocking the road construction by the Chinese towards where Beijing believes the tri-junction (the place where borders of the 3 countries meet meet) is located.

According to reports from Beijing, the map released by China on Friday night to highlight `trespassing' by Indian forces shows disputed Doklam, not far from the tri-junction, as belonging to China.

According to strategic affairs expert Brahma Chellaney, China is deliberately conflating 2 separate issues - the delineation of the tri-junction points and PLA's forcible attempt to change the status quo by building a strategic highway through the Doklam plateau.

"The PLA's violation of the Doklam status quo is the central issue that has triggered the current troop standoff but Beijing is seeking to mask this by spotlighting the issue relating to the tri-junction points,'' said Chellaney.

All three countries have a different take on where exactly the tri-junction is located and the dispute awaits a negotiated settlement among the 3 parties. Beijing believes it is located 20 km south of Doka La, the place Bhutan believes to be the tri-junction.

However, to mount pressure on India and stake a maximalist position, Beijing has released, as Chellaney said, dubious maps laying claim to areas that are south of the tri-junction points as determined and perceived by India. It is through such a maximalist position that Beijing is alleging that Indian troops crossed over to the Chinese side.

There's also a third issue - that of the Sikkim-Tibet boundary - which Beijing has raised to deflect attention from its attempt to build a road through Doklam for military purposes.On the Sikkim sector, as New Delhi pointed out last week, India and China reached an understanding in 2012 to discuss and finalize that boundary's demarcation under the Special Representatives framework.

"In this context, for Beijing to cite an 1890 colonial-era agreement on Sikkim makes little sense other than to confound the real issue at stake. That colonial-era accord is of no direct relevance to China's road building through Doklam,'' said Chellaney.

The citing of the 1890 Sikkim-Tibet agreement is interesting as it coincides with the disdain expressed by Beijing for the 1984 Sino-British accord, which paved the way for Hong Kong's handover in 1997, saying that it no longer had binding power. In the case of South China Sea too, where again Beijing took a maximalist position by claiming close to 85 per cent of its waters, Beijing cited "historical rights'' for political purposes.
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Oracle said:
Is it fair to assume that Chinese commentators lie through their teeth to test Indian response?
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They are testing our border at different points to see what happens. Testing the India Bhutan connection. Re-opening previous agreements to gain leverage. So trumpian

https://scroll.in/article/842246/ex...n-and-what-a-road-in-bhutan-has-to-do-with-it

Mea statement, Jun 30
http://www.mea.gov.in/press-releases.htm?dtl/28572/Recent+Developments+in+Doklam+Area

Unless I see something more concrete this has nothing to do with OBOR.
 
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The chinese are clueless about indias casus belli. While they still don't understand how India will respond, they have been able to spot lies.
 
Oracle said:
China's ministry of warning says, China will resolutely safeguard its sovereignty: Chinese experts, i.e. they are prepared for a war.
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War? really ? I've seen more dangerous drunken brawls than this.


Can't tell anything about the authencity of this video and when it was taken but i cant see any rifles. I see cameras. So both sides are unarmed.

What to call it ? Disciplined, stage managed playacting?

Contrast with the Pak border that sees more action.When's the last time we went to war with Pakistan. Too bad we don't get any visuals from there. All hush hush.

Clash between Chinese and Indian border troops sparks calls for tough response online | Global Times | Jul 03 2017

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Double Edge said:
War? really ? I've seen more dangerous drunken brawls than this.


Can't tell anything about the authencity of this video and when it was taken but i cant see any rifles. I see cameras. So both sides are unarmed.

What to call it ? Disciplined, stage managed playacting?

Contrast with the Pak border that sees more action.When's the last time we went to war with Pakistan. Too bad we don't get any visuals from there. All hush hush.

Clash between Chinese and Indian border troops sparks calls for tough response online | Global Times | Jul 03 2017

uQYubz5.jpg
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According to Lt Gen Prakash Katoch, these face-offs occur once in 6 months. He says it's the normal PLA way to acclimatize (get to know) its soldiers to the front with India. And also when Indian leaders meet leaders of western countries who are seen to be inimical to Chinese interests. This is a routine scripted play by the PLA.

China: Breach of Agreement of Kailash Mansarovar pilgrimage confirms Chinese Cussedness
 
Double Edge said:
They are testing our border at different points to see what happens. Testing the India Bhutan connection. Re-opening previous agreements to gain leverage. So trumpian

https://scroll.in/article/842246/ex...n-and-what-a-road-in-bhutan-has-to-do-with-it

Mea statement, Jun 30
http://www.mea.gov.in/press-releases.htm?dtl/28572/Recent+Developments+in+Doklam+Area

Unless I see something more concrete this has nothing to do with OBOR.
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The MEA press release is corroborated by this - No bulldozers used by China for destroying Indian army bunkers: India

Is India playing it down?
 
n21 said:
The bunkers are generally temporary. Made of rocks and stone found nearby. You don't need bulldozers to remove them.

There has not troop withdrawals. And with the Chinese Ambassador giving out threats, India will not back down.

This will be standoff, unless one of them decides to shoot.
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That area is rocky, nothing grows there. And the Chinese ambassador should be kicked out of India. He can't be in Indian soil and use undiplomatic language.

What if the Chinese shoot first? The Indian Army and the Defence Minister is very silent about things. It's mostly Chinese media which is over-reacting and the source of my news. -:)

One thing to wonder is Mr. Modi was in US when things started appearing in the press, and Mr. Modi is again on a trip to Israel. He doesn't seem to give a jack about threats from China. Something is brewing.

Btw, a hilarious but true incident on how the Chinese grab sovereign territory of other countries.

When Atal Bihari Vajpayee exposed China's designs with a flock of sheep

No incident can better explain China's permanent belligerant stance towards India than what happened on the Sikkim border in 1965.

An interesting exchange of letters between the two countries reveals that China accused Indian troops of stealing a flock of 800 sheep and 59 yaks from Tibetan herdsmen near the Sikkim border. China demanded the animals back from India, warning it of dire consequences.

To protest against this ludicrous allegation, former prime minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee, who was then just a Member of Parliament, drove a herd of sheep to the Chinese embassy in Delhi. They protestors said China would start a world war over sheep and yaks. They carried placards, saying, "Eat me but save the world."

China got incensed that its bullying had come out in the open with the protest. It shot off an angry letter to the Indian embassy in China, complaining that Vajpayee's protest was actually backed by the Indian government. The letter also accused Indian troops of incursion into and building military structures in the Chinese territory.

The Indian government replied in a note to the Chinese embassy in Delhi: "About the four Tibetan inhabitants allegedly kidnapped by Indian troops, an adequate reply has been given in the Indian notes of September 17 and 21. Like other Tibetan refugees these four people had come into India on their own volition and without our permission and taken refuge in India. They are free to go back to Tibet at any time if they desire to do so. Apropos the 800 sheep and 59 yaks the Government of India have already given a reply in the clearest terms possible. We know nothing of the yaks and as regards the sheep it is up to the two herdsmen concerned to take them to Tibet if and when they choose to go back to their homeland."

On Vajpayee's 'sheep protest', India wrote: "In its note of September 26, China has protested against the peaceful demonstration which was held near the Chinese Embassy in New Delhi on September 24 when some of the citizens of Delhi took in procession about 800 sheeps. The Government of India had nothing to do with this demonstration. It was a spontaneous, peaceful and good-humoured expression of the resentment of the citizens of Delhi against the Chinese ultimatum and the threat of war against India on trumped-up and trivial issues."

It was clear that China was itching for a fight and inventing flimsy reasons for it. These allegation by China were part of a campaign that finally led to the Sikkim border conflict between India and China in 1967. India emerged a winner in this conflict. India lost nearly 80 Indian soldiers while 300 to 400 Chinese soldiers were killed.
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