My new pack.

[zraver]

DonBelt, you've opened up whole new worlds for me in terms of getting an AED without breaking the bank.

[DonBelt]

The Gov't Liquidation requires the FDA endorsement on any and all medical items that you could buy elsewhere without one. An Epi-pen can be administered by anyone to someone with a prescription for it and the epi-pen. The EMT can administer it to someone without a prescription for it but who shows clinical signs and symptoms of anaphylaxis.
The reason it's sale is controlled is let's face it- this is America 2013- the stores would be stampeded with people buying them up to inject themselves for the speed effect of the epinephrine. They would be being used inappropriately by many people who imagined every sneeze or pimple is a sign of anaphylaxis and they would be used by people who think that you could use it just in case to prevent allergic reactions. Soon people who actually needed one would be unable to find one. So it's use is restricted to those with a prescription and those whose scope of practice allows them to determine the need for one. Unfortunate but in a society that fails to practice self control or common sense this is what happens (Among other ills). There are suppliers/vendors who will sell the other supplies like non-invasive medical equipment to people without a FDA form or medical endorsement, I can't say if they will sell wholesale to you but you could make inquiries- possibly explain your case to them. Some may voluntarily not sell to people or groups that have no medical directors or endorsements out of fear of liability lawsuits as well. As far as getting a medical director, many AED rental/lease companies have services like that available (for example:AED Consulting, LLC. ) You might also be able to get a doctor to volunteer his or services as a medical director.

[zraver]

That is stupid.

In Fl, a teacher, scout leader, tour guide ect can administer one. As can a EMT. They do have to go through a short training class on how and where to administer them. A Paramedic can give shots of Epi from a vial and syringe.

I think they should be much more widely available.

I don't know why you are having a problem with this stuff. I've ordered like gear, in bulk quantities and never had them ask for a doctor signature.

Government Surplus Auctions at Government Liquidation

Is a site I've been hunting.

Try ordering from Granger[/QUOTE]

[Gun Grape]

In Arkansas until next year epi-pens are still a paramedic med not EMT-B.

That is stupid.

In Fl, a teacher, scout leader, tour guide ect can administer one. As can a EMT. They do have to go through a short training class on how and where to administer them. A Paramedic can give shots of Epi from a vial and syringe.

But our EMT/Paramedic standards go above National ones.

I can't even buy surplus medical gear other than general first aid kits from surplus sites because I do not have a medical director. Simple things like stretchers, medical tape, instant ice packs.... all require a doctor to buy in bulk. It adds significantly to the cost I have to bear.

I don't know why you are having a problem with this stuff. I've ordered like gear, in bulk quantities and never had them ask for a doctor signature.

Try ordering from Granger

[chanjyj]

Anyway bravo CPT, you're doing the best you can within the confines of the crap frameworks you have to adhere to.

[zraver]

Stretchers? Bemuses me why you would need medical endorsement for that, it is ridiculous. Strange you can have a rescue inhaler (I am assuming it contains a glucocorticosteriod for bronchodilation) but not a stretcher. Ah, the way things are.

I've got a stretcher, those I can buy one at a time at retail. But like instant ice packs- controlled medical equipment. To get one i have to buy a complete home first aid kit, local stores do not sell them individually.

Also my kit is MY kit so you see some co-mingling. It doesn't make any sense to have to complete but separate kits divided only by field and home. That is why I have OTC meds packed for example. That being said, in a disaster zone you do what you have to do. During Isaac the glucometer (lancets and test strips) I carried were the only way several diabetics at the shelter had to check blood sugar, and the OTC's were all we had for various ills and ows during the storm.

[chanjyj]

Stretchers? Bemuses me why you would need medical endorsement for that, it is ridiculous. Strange you can have a rescue inhaler (I am assuming it contains a glucocorticosteriod for bronchodilation) but not a stretcher. Ah, the way things are.

[zraver]

What? An EMT-B for an epi-pen?

In Arkansas until next year epi-pens are still a paramedic med not EMT-B. I agree it is stupid, but so it goes. Just about everything associated with medical care is regulated in the US. I can't even buy surplus medical gear other than general first aid kits from surplus sites because I do not have a medical director. Simple things like stretchers, medical tape, instant ice packs.... all require a doctor to buy in bulk. It adds significantly to the cost I have to bear.

[chanjyj]

I have a cpr mask that can be hooked up to o2 carried by responding emt/ambulance. With an ambu bag and AED 1 person can perform extended cpr/operations giving ambulances more time to respond. Only cardiac med I carry is small does chewable aspirin. Stimulants or any type other than caffeine is highly regulated in the US. To the point the government would rather people die of anaphylactic shock then let epi-pens be easily available. Also I think only 1 type of nurse (DNP???) is authorized to administer anything but OTC meds.

I hear there is a new national standard coming for EMT-B's that will allow them to administer epi-pens. fingers crossed.

What? An EMT-B for an epi-pen? In Australia AFAIK any, ANY person can do it if the situation is life threatening. I personally know of a school teacher (untrained) who gave it to a student. Of course, the epi-pen was the student's personal one.

[Doktor]

There was no disrespect given. We have too many lawyers here and those who love to sue at a drop of a hat. As a result there are a litany of regulations about the use of first aid and the tools/drugs that can be administered by whom. For instance when in the outdoor program in my university the leaders had to carry the first aid kit... a 9 pound monstrosity. Everything in the kit was color coded. As a leader and with some first aid qualifications I could use the green but not anything marked yellow or red. If I did not only did I open up myself to liability the school could terminate the program if any lawsuits resulted in me doing so. Only the teacher and a very few select volunteers who were qualified could use the items in yellow and red. As a leader I was one of the mules that had to carry the kit...such were the rules.

My apologies. I have misunderstood the initial reply.

[zraver]

Grants are a volunteer squad's best friend. Have you thought about approaching a larger dept to see if they might have surplus equipment available? Maybe when they order supplies they will let you piggyback an order on theirs.

We are private and most departments are public.... The rescue squad might be able to donate something at some point in the future, haven't asked, not even really on my radar. Most grants are denied to us until we get our IRS determination later and have 3 years of existence and the fee the IRS charges is a big church of change for us.

1. we are really spread out from Arkansas to Kansas, 2. shoestring budget and limited donor base 3. young organization and no IRS determination letter. All that said we are making progress.

[DonBelt]

Grants are a volunteer squad's best friend. Have you thought about approaching a larger dept to see if they might have surplus equipment available? Maybe when they order supplies they will let you piggyback an order on theirs.

[zraver]

I understand. but since I helped found the group and given the lack of sponsors a lot of the cost of providing the minimum amount of gear needed to make us credible has fallen on my head to provide. I'm in this deep and its about wiped me out... Keep driving forward though success isn't supposed to be easy.

[bonehead]

Now, now... this comment made from to in 2 seconds.

While Z might not be qualified yet, he is one hell of a stubborn prick and I believe he will make it from a "mule" to a "nurse" in record time.
Reading my response again before posting, made me go again.

There was no disrespect given. We have too many lawyers here and those who love to sue at a drop of a hat. As a result there are a litany of regulations about the use of first aid and the tools/drugs that can be administered by whom. For instance when in the outdoor program in my university the leaders had to carry the first aid kit... a 9 pound monstrosity. Everything in the kit was color coded. As a leader and with some first aid qualifications I could use the green but not anything marked yellow or red. If I did not only did I open up myself to liability the school could terminate the program if any lawsuits resulted in me doing so. Only the teacher and a very few select volunteers who were qualified could use the items in yellow and red. As a leader I was one of the mules that had to carry the kit...such were the rules.

[Doktor]

Z,

No matter the regulation, I would strongly advise you to take course in nursing, in particular for what your interest is.