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Excitement in Macedonia

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  • Doktor
    replied
    Originally posted by kato View Post
    Nah, straight from SWP.
    Not surprised, lol

    Sounds like a neofascist alright. Especially with minimum wage laws, given that is just a tool of the capitalists to artificially introduce an entry salary for jobs.
    So, that's why the lefties push this idea. Roger.

    51 is not even remotely a majority of 120. VMRO could always form a majority coalition to rule with the BDI, like they used to.
    Alleged, they had it, but a call came at 5 minutes before midnight to cancel it. My point was that VMRO-DPMNE is the party with most MPs

    Of course they monitor themselves first and foremost. Isn't that what anyone does?
    Makes sense. Doesn't make sense to only monitor themselves and noone else. The narative was that Zoran Zaev was the most taped man in the country, yet we heard exactly 1 tape with his daughter where she asks him to bring her home few notebooks from the municipality he was mayor at the time. Cynics might say it was recorded post-festum.

    Eh, that just means that VMRO has been taking lessons from PiS on how to handle opposition.
    Nope, more likely straight from Erdo's main strategist (no sarcasm here).

    It's about preventing it.
    Preventing what? You said " instead it broke over the majority of parliament (read: the social democrats and the Albanians) signing off an act preparing the country to become a NATO membership candidate." I am asking you again who signed, what act? Nothing was announced.

    There's a considerable number of countries in NATO and the EU where conservatives have recently been moving politically towards a near-future of simply shutting down the border to the non-member states of the West Balkan, and this action is a targeted move to further that,
    Still not following you. Are you talking Schengen or you talking refugees?

    coming only weeks after Merkel and Gruevski last held talks
    Merkel's and Gruevski's loveaffair ended years ago.

    (in Malta, where the EPP was meeting and Gruevski was apparently - despite not in the EPP - trying to gauge things behind the scenes).
    VMRO-DPMNE is associative member of the EPP since 2007. Trying to gauge things behind the scenes? Aint that why they are all there?

    Leave a comment:


  • kato
    replied
    Originally posted by Doktor View Post
    I guess you get your narrative and in-depth analysis from DW (sounds a lot like it).
    Nah, straight from SWP.

    Originally posted by Doktor View Post
    Gruevski is not alt-right, he is more of a leftie acting as a right. He introduced subsidies, minimum wage...
    Sounds like a neofascist alright. Especially with minimum wage laws, given that is just a tool of the capitalists to artificially introduce an entry salary for jobs.

    Originally posted by Doktor View Post
    Not even remotely a majority? We have 120 MPs, his party has 51, 10 short for forming a government. Social-Democrats have 49.
    51 is not even remotely a majority of 120. VMRO could always form a majority coalition to rule with the BDI, like they used to.

    Originally posted by Doktor View Post
    You are aware that all we got from those tapes is leading people from VMRO-DPMNE? So, they monitor themselves?
    Of course they monitor themselves first and foremost. Isn't that what anyone does?

    Originally posted by Doktor View Post
    The election of Mr. Xhaferi is not lawful BTW. It was not on a called session, the votes were not counted, the session was not aired on the parliamentary TV.
    Eh, that just means that VMRO has been taking lessons from PiS on how to handle opposition.

    Originally posted by Doktor View Post
    Please elaborate. Especially the NATO part. Nothing was signed in the past 2,5 months. At least in public.
    It's about preventing it. There's a considerable number of countries in NATO and the EU where conservatives have recently been moving politically towards a near-future of simply shutting down the border to the non-member states of the West Balkan, and this action is a targeted move to further that, coming only weeks after Merkel and Gruevski last held talks (in Malta, where the EPP was meeting and Gruevski was apparently - despite not in the EPP - trying to gauge things behind the scenes).

    Leave a comment:


  • Doktor
    replied
    Well, sorry to interrupt, but it's not quite like that. I guess you get your narrative and in-depth analysis from DW (sounds a lot like it).

    Gruevski is not alt-right, he is more of a leftie acting as a right. He introduced subsidies, minimum wage...

    Not even remotely a majority? We have 120 MPs, his party has 51, 10 short for forming a government. Social-Democrats have 49.

    "a police state keeping over one percent of the population under constant surveillance"?
    You are aware that all we got from those tapes is leading people from VMRO-DPMNE? So, they monitor themselves?


    Now with regard to the election of Talat Xhaferi.

    VMRO-DPNE used everything they have as a possibility to postpone it, not because he is Albanian, but because the newly formed coalition is about to implement a dozen points platform, written and signed in Tirana, orchestrated by Edi Rama. It is something Mr. Xhaferi was doing himself in the past (the filibustering part), too.

    The filibustering is also because the Tirana platform and SDSM - DUI coalition was arranged after the elections. VMRO essentially calls for new elections and if they get the majority to rule the country to sit in and fulfill the platform or to step back for now. Finally, yesterday, we had the Albanian anthem sang in the parliament.

    The election of Mr. Xhaferi is not lawful BTW. It was not on a called session, the votes were not counted, the session was not aired on the parliamentary TV, and almost forgot, he was not proposed by the Commission for elections.


    About 20 months after news of that broke the Macedonian people finally forced Gruevski out of his office as prime minister; he tapped his connection to president Ivanov who has since December been preventing the social democrats from forming a majority government in parliament with the albanian minority party. The reason why the VRMO is so vehemently clinging to it is that most of its crooks are fearing that under a new government they'd be facing courts over the surveillance scandal.
    It began last year. The people got pissed on how they govern, the hints of corruption, some unscrupulous actions by the Ministry of Interior and frankly, the fatigue of being governed for over a decade. The then opposition is still so weak on delivering in the field of improving lives of the people - they have no sound plans. If it is the fear of the courts, the President will give them a pardon and they will vanish with vast amounts of money.

    Please elaborate. Especially the NATO part. Nothing was signed in the past 2,5 months. At least in public.
    Last edited by Doktor; 28 Apr 17,, 20:12.

    Leave a comment:


  • kato
    replied
    Originally posted by Mihais View Post
    The social-democrat looks sooo fine.Way to go!
    For explanation to those who only read the BBC article which doesn't really give any background - and who can't tell which side's the one that's right from Mihais' comment:

    This is simply the latest step in Gruevski's alt-right national-conservative VRMO clinging illegally to power despite not having even remotely a majority and having been found to have installed a police state keeping over one percent of the population under constant surveillance. About 20 months after news of that broke the Macedonian people finally forced Gruevski out of his office as prime minister; he tapped his connection to president Ivanov who has since December been preventing the social democrats from forming a majority government in parliament with the albanian minority party. The reason why the VRMO is so vehemently clinging to it is that most of its crooks are fearing that under a new government they'd be facing courts over the surveillance scandal.

    The current more violent affair broke not over the election of Xhaferi, that's just a smokescreen - instead it broke over the majority of parliament (read: the social democrats and the Albanians) signing off an act preparing the country to become a NATO membership candidate. The Gruevski mafia prefers a pro-Russian leaning, even if otherwise they align themselves with the rest of European right-wing conservatives (read: Merkel and her bunch).

    The whole thing shouldn't be underestimated - the "shock" reactions in the BBC article are the tame ones. German conservatives and government think tanks mention the possibility of war. Beyond just Macedonia too.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mihais
    replied
    The social-democrat looks sooo fine.Way to go!
    Not that there is any real doctrinal difference in the area.Crooks and thieves the entire lot.

    Leave a comment:


  • SteveDaPirate
    replied
    Originally posted by Doktor View Post
    All good, bud.
    Glad to hear it :)

    Stay safe!

    Leave a comment:


  • Doktor
    replied
    Originally posted by SteveDaPirate View Post
    All good, bud.

    Leave a comment:


  • SteveDaPirate
    started a topic Excitement in Macedonia

    Excitement in Macedonia

    Protesters stormed into Macedonia's parliament on Thursday after an ethnic Albanian was elected as speaker.

    The people who stormed parliament were angered by the coalition's decision to elect Talat Xhaferi as speaker.

    They fear moves to improve the status of Albanians threaten Macedonian unity.

    Some of the 200 protesters were masked. Witnesses saw broken glass on the floor and traces of blood in hallways.

    Police fired stun grenades to disperse protesters and allow politicians to exit the parliament building.

    On Friday, the interior ministry said 102 people had been treated in hospital, including 10 MPs and police officers, AFP news agency reported.
    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-39738865

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