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  • Strong words but will they be like camoronoccios and crumble , sturgeon mouthing again , ahhhh well , wait n see .��

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    • I

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      • haha gorrit

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        • I cannot believe the threats coming from the government at the minute. Boris comparing the French president to a Nazi prison guard.

          Why is it our government, and particularly Boris, continually insult the Europeans and yet constantly reffer to them as 'our friends and partners'?

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          • Just listened to what he actually said and the context he said it in. Absolutely nothing wrong ......and like he said India gets more favourable treatment selling to the EU than we do. Thank god we're leaving this dreary club of self congratulatory dinosaurs....

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            • Just checking the trade figures with Italy, Germany, France, Spain and a few others and we buy a lot more from them than they do from us in manufactured goods.
              Especially Germany...We're talking thousands of German jobs here if they want to play rough.
              .

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              • Originally posted by Toby View Post
                Suppose we could dig Guy Fawkes up....upto press he's the only good man to enter parliament.
                Although a Catholic I cannot sympathise with a traitor who wanted to blow up democracy and the King (James l if I recall right).

                I have to say the more I consider 'Brexit' the more regressive I see it; societies that want to build walls, whether in actuality (such as the Berlin Wall) or by 'closing the channel' as it were - even the Romans with Hadrianic and Antonine walls or the Great Wall of China of the first Qin Emperor have effectively turned inward, no longer confident of their ability to overcome anything 'out there' and ultimately a symptom of decline. Of course the pro Brexit crew will say "but now we can sign trade deals with anyone" etc... Yes that may be true in time though the terms may not be so favourable as when Britain was part of the EU but you would be missing my point. You want your world to "stay the same" (or possibly go back a little) and I would certainly agree on some points - including on immigration and fox hunting etc - but the world is not going to stop moving forward and if Britain - and I mean Britain because I believe in the Union - doesn't feel it can engage in how it is moving forward because "I don't like it that way" and yet no longer believes in it's ability to change how the world does move forward then the decline is already set in and no wall will stop it.

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                • Originally posted by snapper View Post
                  Although a Catholic I cannot sympathise with a traitor who wanted to blow up democracy and the King (James l if I recall right).

                  I have to say the more I consider 'Brexit' the more regressive I see it; societies that want to build walls, whether in actuality (such as the Berlin Wall) or by 'closing the channel' as it were - even the Romans with Hadrianic and Antonine walls or the Great Wall of China of the first Qin Emperor have effectively turned inward, no longer confident of their ability to overcome anything 'out there' and ultimately a symptom of decline. Of course the pro Brexit crew will say "but now we can sign trade deals with anyone" etc... Yes that may be true in time though the terms may not be so favourable as when Britain was part of the EU but you would be missing my point. You want your world to "stay the same" (or possibly go back a little) and I would certainly agree on some points - including on immigration and fox hunting etc - but the world is not going to stop moving forward and if Britain - and I mean Britain because I believe in the Union - doesn't feel it can engage in how it is moving forward because "I don't like it that way" and yet no longer believes in it's ability to change how the world does move forward then the decline is already set in and no wall will stop it.
                  The EU is a protectionist closed shop looking inward. Since its inception the world has changed dramatically. If anybody is building walls it's the EU...Because they want to control all aspects of our lives....which is all socialism is. It's backward and regressive and stunts innovation while professing to do the opposite. Darwen would turn in his grave. Their arrogance in not listening and pretending to know what's best is what has led to Brexit. They have only themselves to blame.
                  To pretend Brexit is all about bashing foreigners is disgracefully misrepresenting the facts and totally incorrect
                  It's about our country and what we want for it. Yes it's nationalistic. It's not the bloody Nazi party though..nobodies going to start ethnically cleansing the place..

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                  • Originally posted by snapper View Post
                    Although a Catholic I cannot sympathise with a traitor who wanted to blow up democracy and the King (James l if I recall right).

                    I have to say the more I consider 'Brexit' the more regressive I see it; societies that want to build walls, whether in actuality (such as the Berlin Wall) or by 'closing the channel' as it were - even the Romans with Hadrianic and Antonine walls or the Great Wall of China of the first Qin Emperor have effectively turned inward, no longer confident of their ability to overcome anything 'out there' and ultimately a symptom of decline. Of course the pro Brexit crew will say "but now we can sign trade deals with anyone" etc... Yes that may be true in time though the terms may not be so favourable as when Britain was part of the EU but you would be missing my point. You want your world to "stay the same" (or possibly go back a little) and I would certainly agree on some points - including on immigration and fox hunting etc - but the world is not going to stop moving forward and if Britain - and I mean Britain because I believe in the Union - doesn't feel it can engage in how it is moving forward because "I don't like it that way" and yet no longer believes in it's ability to change how the world does move forward then the decline is already set in and no wall will stop it.
                    Completley agree.. it feels like we are being dragged back to the past. Hard borders in Ireland, demonisation of foreigners, our politicians comparing our neighbours with nazis, nationalistic chest beating.. it's just depressing.

                    The beating for the UK is being delivered by Madame May and the Brexiteers. The EU is a despairing and unwilling accomplice.

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                    • Originally posted by Toby View Post
                      The EU is a protectionist closed shop looking inward. Since its inception the world has changed dramatically. If anybody is building walls it's the EU...Because they want to control all aspects of our lives....which is all socialism is.
                      I fully agree with you. Nobody has been more critical of EU policy on this forum than I; I still cannot quite believe the Cypriot bank raid - though I am glad it hurt alot of illegal Muscovite money. It is a shame that the EU's institutions and practices have not managed to evolve to deal with differing needs of constituent parts and I much regret this. My point though is that Britain's 'pulling up the drawbridge' is a form of psychological defeatism; you can't win in Europe, you can't change it to how you want so you don't like and want out! I refuse to accept this myself as a foster daughter of Britain and being proud to have served HMG. I believe Britain can and that is the difference between us.

                      Originally posted by Toby View Post
                      Darwen would turn in his grave.
                      Darwin? Not sure what he's got to do with it... Interesting note Farage lives in Downe - where Darwin's old house is.

                      Originally posted by Toby View Post
                      Their arrogance in not listening and pretending to know what's best is what has led to Brexit. They have only themselves to blame.
                      Moan to the Greeks and Cypriots. They have really suffered.

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                      • Originally posted by zara View Post
                        Completley agree.. it feels like we are being dragged back to the past. Hard borders in Ireland, demonisation of foreigners, our politicians comparing our neighbours with nazis, nationalistic chest beating.. it's just depressing.

                        The beating for the UK is being delivered by Madame May and the Brexiteers. The EU is a despairing and unwilling accomplice.
                        If I didn't have a brain and the ability to think past primitive thoughts, Pinochet would seem like a fair minded guy. As it is I reckon the UK's biggest problem is liberal facism from the left. A clique of text book fed half wits with narrow minded views perpetuated by the echo chamber they inhabit.

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                        • Originally posted by zara View Post
                          The EU is a despairing and unwilling accomplice.
                          Of course this is not altogether true; some of the Germans are jubilant about Brexit (our friend kato - the much younger - I suspect being one) because this allows them a 'free-er hand' in Europe with 'British interference'. This in itself should be enough to put all British people on their guard.

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                          • Originally posted by snapper View Post
                            I fully agree with you. Nobody has been more critical of EU policy on this forum than I; I still cannot quite believe the Cypriot bank raid - though I am glad it hurt alot of illegal Muscovite money. It is a shame that the EU's institutions and practices have not managed to evolve to deal with differing needs of constituent parts and I much regret this. My point though is that Britain's 'pulling up the drawbridge' is a form of psychological defeatism; you can't win in Europe, you can't change it to how you want so you don't like and want out! I refuse to accept this myself as a foster daughter of Britain and being proud to have served HMG. I believe Britain can and that is the difference between us.



                            Darwin? Not sure what he's got to do with it... Interesting note Farage lives in Downe - where Darwin's old house is.



                            Moan to the Greeks and Cypriots. They have really suffered.
                            moaning??? about as likely as me digging Guido up... ;-) Cyprus ...Greece keep going ...how about imposing a new leader upon the Italians? And the end of German Austerity being no where in site?

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                            • Snapper. I was referring to natural selection. Something socialism thinks it can alter

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                              • Originally posted by snapper View Post
                                Of course this is not altogether true; some of the Germans are jubilant about Brexit (our friend kato - the much younger - I suspect being one) because this allows them a 'free-er hand' in Europe with 'British interference'. This in itself should be enough to put all British people on their guard.
                                I can imagine the federalists thinking Brexit is great, but the EU leaders and heads of state seem to be behaving far more grown up than our government. I don't get the sense from any of them that they want to punish the UK, other than make sure that any deal they give us isn't as good as full membership which is a totally reasonable stance. Perhaps when election season kicks off they may grow more teeth. We'll have to see.

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