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  • Far left wins in Greece

    BBC News - Greece election: Exit polls signal big Syriza win

    Exit polling indicates a win for left wing Syriza. There is widespread disillusionment with the mainstream parties in Europe, which is causing this surge of support for populist parties on the left and the right. Greece being the worst hit, probably is the first to elect a non mainstream party to power.

    I am not too familiar with Syriza's platform, it is possible they could make things far far worse, especially if Greece has to leave the Euro. On the other hand if they play their cards well and renegotiate the loan settlements, things might just start looking up for Greece.

  • #2
    More on Syriza's platform

    What Syriza Stands For - Business Insider

    Some of things I can empathize with, like cutting down on tax evasion among the rich and partial bond default , or at least the threat to do so. But other things like free electricity and healthcare, food subsidies? That would be massively expensive even in times of economic prosperity. And expecting the EU to fund it? Ridiculous.

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    • #3
      So far we have only exit polls so will need to wait and see, but with those extra 50 seats that comes with being the most popular party, they may very well claim a majority.

      It will very interesting to see how this develops, surely the question is not will, but on how many and to what extent Syriza will backtrack on their policies, they will destabilise the euro further, this will take time to unfold.

      Other peripheral European countries like Ireland will be watching this one carefully, especially in regard to policies of haircuts to bondholders.

      If there is any money left in Greek banks that can be moved, I imagine it will be flowing out of the country as the votes are being counted.

      I am not sure how the quantitative easing project announced by the ECB will tie in with events in Greece. The main problem for the European Union and the various economic measures available too it, is the fact that we have one currency and a multitude of economies and tax systems that don't behave or measure in a singular fashion. Greece is the furthest outlier, and most erratic, and it just got worse.
      Last edited by tantalus; 25 Jan 15,, 20:41.

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      • #4
        There are basically two choices.Bussiness as usual,which sucks for Greeks but pleases the EU overlords who care only about keeping the status quo.Or fvcking things up.Experience shows that leftist parties are good at this.Either way,Syriza is a storm in a teacup.Another step towards discrediting ''gimme'' politics.
        Greece has a productive tourism sector,productive shipping and agriculture.These guys won't take abuses by lying low.And they don't care about politicians representing the ''gimme'' class,which means most of the parties,Syriza included.
        The markets may suffer a slight correction and that's all.Euro may go down a bit,which is anyway ECB policy.Nothing really changed.
        Those who know don't speak
        He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36

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        • #5
          In Spain people is watching closely how things develope in Greece.

          PODEMOS is a new political party with a lot in common with Syriza. Their agendas are focused on same issues (social welfare, fight against corruption, reject of privileges for the political class...)

          The question is till what extent will the rest of the countries in the European Union will allow them to go on with such measures. Especially regarding economy. Without any interference it could be a fantastic opportunity for Greeks and a waking call for many other nations. Will see.

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          • #6
            Not convinced about that far left thing.

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            • #7
              Looks like Merkel is playing Hardball

              BBC News - Greece economy: Merkel rules out more debt relief

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              • #8
                It seems for me that Syriza sold itself. Just after they were elected we were hearing everywhere about a "Greecexit", with Nigel Farage of the United Kingdom Independence Party predicting that:
                "By the end of the year Greece will probably leave the currency and quite possible the EU", and now it seems that they are just playing politics as usual instead of fighting for their ideals.
                Who will probably receive a very increased voting in the next Greek elections is the Third Position, the Golden Dawn party, because they are the only ones who haven't been tried yet.
                That is what happens when you rob people of their identity and the ability to govern themselves with this transnational organizations like the European Union.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Vargas View Post
                  That is what happens when you rob people of their identity and the ability to govern themselves with this transnational organizations like the European Union.
                  The problem is that since the foundation of the modern State Greece has always had the ability to Govern itself - it just that for various reason they appear to be very bad at it! It pays to remember that this whole problem arose not because Greece joined the E.U. but because it basically committed wholesale fraud to do so i.e. successive governments used falsified accounting to artificially reduce national debt levels to the point where they met the standards necessary for entering and remaining the Union. In other words the Greek Governments saw the benefits of joining, wanted in and lied to so. Complaining now that the E.U. is imposing harsh sanctions is bit like having Enron complain about sanctions imposed on it by the SEC. They really only have themselves to blame and unfortunately it's the average Greek citizen who suffers as a result not the political and industrial elites who orchestrated the whole debacle to begin with.
                  Last edited by Monash; 06 Apr 15,, 00:49.
                  If you are emotionally invested in 'believing' something is true you have lost the ability to tell if it is true.

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                  • #10
                    The EU also commited fraud in letting them in.
                    Those who know don't speak
                    He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36

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                    • #11
                      Hey, don't say the stiffen lips didn't warned ya ;)
                      No such thing as a good tax - Churchill

                      To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Monash View Post
                        The problem is that since the foundation of the modern State Greece has always had the ability to Govern itself - it just that for various reason they appear to be very bad at it! It pays to remember that this whole problem arose not because Greece joined the E.U. but because it basically committed wholesale fraud to do so i.e. successive governments used falsified accounting to artificially reduce national debt levels to the point where they met the standards necessary for entering and remaining the Union. In other words the Greek Governments saw the benefits of joining, wanted in and lied to so. Complaining now that the E.U. is imposing harsh sanctions is bit like having Enron complaining about the sanctions imposed by the SEC. They really only have themselves to blame and unfortunately it's the average Greek citizen who suffers as a result not the political and industrial elites who orchestrated the whole debacle to begin with.
                        I agree. But look at them, now they have no control above tariffs and all their products are of inferior quality than the rest of Europe, this broke their already frail industry and now that they have the Euro,
                        That is not a cheap currency, their attractiveness as a touristic place also dropped considerably. It was very stupid of their part to join the EU at the first place.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Mihais View Post
                          The EU also commited fraud in letting them in.
                          Oh the EU doesn't get of scott free. There were questions asked at the time about Greece's financial preparedness for membership of the EU but it suited the EU's senior bureaucrats and their political masters to overlook those questions - given their enthusiasm for making the 'grand project' as successful and as large as possible. You can bet all those nations who are applying to join now will have their financials subject to much more rigorous review than Greece ever did. That aside I don't believe 'fraud' is an apt descriptor for their conduct, negligence yes fraud no. Of course that would change if there was evidence to suggest EU officials explicitly knew the books were cooked at the time but as far as I am aware there is no evidence pointing to this being the case.
                          If you are emotionally invested in 'believing' something is true you have lost the ability to tell if it is true.

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                          • #14
                            Of course there is no evidence,yet.However,I have serious doubts the blue eyed boys never said anything.
                            Those who know don't speak
                            He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Vargas View Post
                              I agree. But look at them, now they have no control above tariffs and all their products are of inferior quality than the rest of Europe, this broke their already frail industry and now that they have the Euro,
                              That is not a cheap currency, their attractiveness as a touristic place also dropped considerably. It was very stupid of their part to join the EU at the first place.
                              Greece is cheaper to visit today then in 1999.
                              No such thing as a good tax - Churchill

                              To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.

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