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  • Anglicans 'reach consensus'

    Anglicans 'reach consensus'

    Anglican leaders have reached a consensus which will pave the way for homosexuals to participate in the church.
    A statement from the leaders after two days of talks at Lambeth Palace in London expressed "deep regret" about the actions of Anglicans in the US, who elected an openly gay cleric as bishop.

    The summit of Church leaders from around the world was called by the Archbishop of Canterbury Dr Rowan Williams in response to the anger caused by the election of Canon Gene Robinson as Bishop of New Hampshire.

    That infuriated many traditionalist Anglicans, particularly in countries like Nigeria.

    Click here for map of Anglican church membership worldwide
    The BBC's special correspondent Philippa Thomas said conservatives exiting the meeting on Thursday afternoon said they were "very satisfied with the outcome".

    After the first day at Lambeth Palace in London the Archbishop of Armagh, the Most Rev Robin Eames, told journalists church leaders were moving towards "a consensus situation".

    Conservative clergy had threatened to leave the worldwide church if his appointment was not overturned.

    Anglican leaders known as primates have been meeting in London all week to lobby for support.

    There is still fallout in the UK from the battle over moves to appoint an openly gay priest as Bishop of Reading this summer.

    The row over the nomination of Canon Jeffrey John led him to withdraw his candidacy amid fears his appointment would damage the "unity of the church".

    Also contributing to tensions within the church is the official church blessing of gay relationships by the Vancouver diocese in Canada.

    Liberal leaders want individual branches of the church to have the freedom to decide their own destiny, allowing them to put their stance in line with more reformist views among some national congregations.

    Conservatives - such as Reverend Peter Akinola, of the Church of Nigeria - say there can be no compromise over homosexuality because they say it is clearly outlawed by the Bible.

    The American Anglican Council, which represents US conservatives, contends the liberals are the ones who have departed from the communion by accepting non-celibate gays.


    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/3196004.stm
    "Every man has his weakness. Mine was always just cigarettes."

  • #2
    Re: Anglicans 'reach consensus'

    Originally posted by ironman420
    [B]it is clearly outlawed by the Bible.
    Thatís petty much the bottom line isn't it. These people are running a political party. They are running a church. So if the bible says it's wrong, there is really nothing to argue about. If you don't like it, go start your on church.

    Comment


    • #3
      One would be rather uncomfortabe to be touched by a homosexual priest even in a religious way, knowing that he is a homosexual.


      "Some have learnt many Tricks of sly Evasion, Instead of Truth they use Equivocation, And eke it out with mental Reservation, Which is to good Men an Abomination."

      I don't have to attend every argument I'm invited to.

      HAKUNA MATATA

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Ray
        One would be rather uncomfortabe to be touched by a homosexual priest even in a religious way, knowing that he is a homosexual.
        The point is that, if you want to be part of a private group, you must meet the requirements of that group. At the Pebble Beach Golf Club you have to be a man. In the Boy Scouts you have to believe in God and not be gay. In a church you have to follow the Bible. The conditions may be right or wrong, but people don't have the right to force these groups to change.

        Comment


        • #5
          'Huge crisis' over gay bishop

          The Archbishop of Canterbury has warned of a serious split looming in the Anglican Church, after US clerics insisted they would go ahead with consecrating a gay bishop.
          Dr Rowan Williams said there was a "huge crisis looming" over the forthcoming consecration of Reverend Gene Robinson as Bishop of New Hampshire.

          "We shall immediately have some responses from around the world," if the ceremony goes ahead, he told BBC Radio 4's Today programme.

          "Some provinces will declare outright that they're not in communion... others would want to continue in an impaired state of relation," he said.

          The diocese of New Hampshire said it would press on with next month's consecration after a two-day summit by 37 archbishops at Lambeth Palace in London, which warned of the consequences of such a move.

          In a statement it said Canon Robinson's sexuality should be seen as "incidental" to his ability as a church leader.

          "Canon Robinson was elected based on his nearly three decades of ministry in the diocese, his considerable pastoral skills, and his vision for ministry," it said.

          It continued: "We look forward to the consecration of Bishop-elect Robinson on 2 November, believing that God has called him to this ministry."


          Click here for map of Anglican church membership worldwide
          The primates meeting in London said the consecration "would tear at the fabric of the Anglican Communion at its deepest level".

          "If this consecration proceeds, we recognise that we have reached a crucial and critical point in the life of the Anglican communion and we have had to conclude that the future of the communion itself will be put in jeopardy," they said in an agreed statement.

          The leaders set up a commission to look into the whole issue, which they said should report back within a year.

          Dr Williams said this would allow 12 months' "thinking time" into how splits over homosexuality could be resolved.

          He added that the summit had shown it was possible "at least to find some way of talking through the crisis without instantly jumping into what appear to be quick solutions".

          But he said it had also displayed very clearly the anger of "a very, very large number of Anglican provinces who feel that a decision has been made which commits them, or involves them in some way, and yet in which they have had no part at all".

          There remained a paradox at the heart of the Church with two different groups feeling "squashed" and needing to be included, he said.

          "One group of course is the homosexual community, here and elsewhere.

          "The other group is those from small and struggling churches, often in the developing world, who feel excluded, overruled and ignored."

          UK bishop

          When asked whether he personally believed Canon Robinson should become a bishop, he said: "No, I don't".

          That was because the church had to make a decision together on such major issues, he said.

          US Presiding Bishop Frank Griswold said he was certain the consecration of Canon Robinson would go ahead - unless there was a "second coming".

          He has no power to force Canon Robinson to step aside.

          Dr Williams said Gene Robinson would not be licensed to work in the UK, under its current rules.

          In the UK the appointment of the openly gay priest Canon Jeffrey John as Bishop of Reading this summer led to a furious row with him finally withdrawing his candidacy.


          http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/3199156.stm
          "Every man has his weakness. Mine was always just cigarettes."

          Comment


          • #6
            Gay bishop-elect reacts to schism warning

            MANCHESTER, New Hampshire (AP) -- The Rev. V. Gene Robinson told parishioners Sunday he agonizes over the turmoil that has surrounded his election as the Episcopal church's first openly gay bishop-elect, but he believes he has been called by God to go forward.

            "I agonize about this all the time. This is one of the hardest things I'll ever do," Robinson told about 40 people during religious education hour at Grace Church. "I do have this sense I'm supposed to go forward, and I do feel that's coming from God and not my own ego. But I don't know."

            Robinson was elected by New Hampshire clergy and parishioners in June and confirmed by the national Episcopal Church in August. He is scheduled to be consecrated as bishop of New Hampshire in two weeks.

            The election and confirmation outraged conservatives in the church, who have threatened to divide the Episcopal Church in the United States. The church is part of the worldwide Anglican Communion, but the national Anglican churches are self-governing.

            The leaders of Anglican churches worldwide said at an emergency meeting last week that the consecration jeopardizes the worldwide Anglican Communion. The leaders affirmed their position that homosexuality is contrary to Scripture, but they also agreed to appoint a commission to begin "urgent and deep theological and legal reflection" on ways out of the impasse.

            Parishioner Paul Apple of Mont Vernon asked Robinson on Sunday to consider stepping aside in the interests of preserving the larger church.

            "I personally think it's not worth losing the family," Apple said.

            Conservatives, a majority of the Anglican Communion's 77 million members worldwide, believe homosexuality is contrary to Scripture. Robinson and his supporters say that is outweighed by the Scripture's call for love and acceptance of all.

            "We've always had gay bishops," Robinson said at one point. "The difference is I'm being honest about it."

            Robinson, 56, has lived openly with his partner since 1989. He is widely known and admired in the state, where he has been assistant to the retiring bishop for years.

            He said the vigorous and sometimes bitter church debate over homosexuality will continue even if he leaves the stage.

            "It's not all going to go back to being nice and pretty again. It's going to be messy for a while," he said. He added: "This is not our church to win or lose. It's God's church."

            Robinson predicted the church ultimately will survive the turmoil.

            "I've been here an hour and look! The roof's still on. I think it will calm down when people see not a lot has changed," he said.

            http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/Northeast....ap/index.html
            "Every man has his weakness. Mine was always just cigarettes."

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Re: Anglicans 'reach consensus'

              Originally posted by Leader
              Thatís petty much the bottom line isn't it. These people are running a political party. They are running a church. So if the bible says it's wrong, there is really nothing to argue about. If you don't like it, go start your on church.
              While not disagreeing with your sensible position, I do wonder about that particular section of the Bible where homosexuality is condemned. The condemnation of homosexuality is found in Leviticus.

              Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.
              But it is within this book that the dietary laws that the Jews follow today are established:
              Whatsoever parteth the hoof, and is clovenfooted, and cheweth the cud, among the beasts, that shall ye eat.
              Nevertheless these shall ye not eat of them that chew the cud, or of them that divide the hoof: as the camel, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.
              And the coney, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.
              And the hare, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.
              And the swine, though he divide the hoof, and be clovenfooted, yet he cheweth not the cud; he is unclean to you.
              Of their flesh shall ye not eat, and their carcase shall ye not touch; they are unclean to you.
              And we also seem to be ignoring some grooming tips
              Ye shall not round the corners of your heads, neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard.
              There also seems to be some pretty specific rules regarding the tending of fields and the setting of prices on slaves.

              How do Christian churches define what laws they follow and what ones they don't?

              No answer which endangers my right to eat sausage will be well receieved.

              MMmmmm sausage.

              Comment


              • #8
                "This is one of the hardest things I'll ever do," Robinson told about 40 people during religious education hour at Grace Church."

                Funny, i would think getting butt-slammed by his boyfriend would be a much 'harder' thing to endure.

                Read shit like this, and you'll know why yours truly has absolutely ZERO use of religion, of any form.

                If god didn't want me to eat rabbits, he wouldn't have made them edible...as it is with pigs, and yep, even camels.

                What a bunch of dumbasses religious types are, more as a rule than as an exception.

                I cannot for the life of me fathom why someone would need a book to tell them what is right, and what is wrong- what to eat, and what not to.

                A just man is just because in his very soul that is what he is.
                He need not be told to be so, he is just because it is in his nature to be just.

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