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COVID-2019 in America, effect on politics and economy

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  • Originally posted by Bigfella View Post
    I'm looking forward to DE quoting Dr Nick from the Simpsons. He's a doctor....sort of. About as credible as the AAPS and more entertaining.
    Found another one he can quote from:


    Trump Says Coronavirus Vaccine Possible Before Nov. 3

    WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. President Donald Trump said on Thursday it was possible the United States would have a coronavirus vaccine before the Nov. 3 election, a more optimistic forecast than timing put forth by his own White House health experts.

    Asked on the Geraldo Rivera radio program when a vaccine might be ready, Trump said, “Sooner than the end of the year, could be much sooner.”

    “Sooner than November 3?” he was asked.

    “I think in some cases, yes possible before, but right around that time,” Trump said.

    Trump, who is seeking re-election to a second term amid a U.S. economy crippled by coronavirus shutdowns, has pushed for schools to reopen and things to get “back to normal” as coronavirus deaths in the country average more than 1,000 per day.

    Top government health officials have said corners would not be cut in the race to secure a vaccine against the virus.

    Dr. Anthony Fauci, the top U.S. government infectious diseases official, offered a more conservative view in a Reuters interview on Wednesday, saying there might be an indication that at least one vaccine works and is safe by year end.

    Trump was upbeat on the U.S. economic recovery once a vaccine is available. “We’re going to have vaccines very soon, we’re gonna have therapeutics very soon,” he told the radio program.

    Asked if he believed China may have stolen a vaccine from the United States, Trump said, “I can’t say that with certainty, but it’s possible.”

    Chinese government-linked hackers targeted biotech company Moderna Inc, a U.S.-based coronavirus vaccine developer, this year in a bid to steal data, according to a U.S. security official tracking Chinese hacking.
    _________

    Ok, so Trump is either:

    1.) Completely losing touch with reality (that's a given, actually)

    2.) Going to blatantly lie and announce a vaccine that doesn't exist

    3.) Both are correct.


    Place your bets ladies and gentlemen....place your bets....
    TwentyFiveFortyFive

    Comment


    • Originally posted by TopHatter View Post
      Ok, so Trump is either:

      1.) Completely losing touch with reality (that's a given, actually)

      2.) Going to blatantly lie and announce a vaccine that doesn't exist

      3.) Both are correct.


      Place your bets ladies and gentlemen....place your bets....
      I always bet on black...

      Comment


      • HCQ shouldn't be a political battle, but in terms of the actual prescribing and treatment, it doesn't seem to be. Just ignore the media uproar around it, because that's more heat than light. It's getting restricted in all likelihood because it is not turning out to be effective in most cases. That is unfortunate, but the reality is, when you try a bunch of stuff on the basis of hunches and limited data based on desperation, most things aren't going to work very well.


        Top government health officials have said corners would not be cut in the race to secure a vaccine against the virus.
        I think people are going to be disappointed when they realize "vaccine" by FDA terms doesn't mean "prevent the disease," it means "prevents the disease or reduces the impact in 50% of the people who get it." I think even "normal" by summer 2021 is incredibly optimistic.
        "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

        Comment


        • Originally posted by GVChamp View Post
          I think people are going to be disappointed when they realize "vaccine" by FDA terms doesn't mean "prevent the disease," it means "prevents the disease or reduces the impact in 50% of the people who get it." I think even "normal" by summer 2021 is incredibly optimistic.
          100% agreed.
          TwentyFiveFortyFive

          Comment


          • Originally posted by GVChamp View Post
            HCQ shouldn't be a political battle, but in terms of the actual prescribing and treatment, it doesn't seem to be. Just ignore the media uproar around it, because that's more heat than light. It's getting restricted in all likelihood because it is not turning out to be effective in most cases. That is unfortunate, but the reality is, when you try a bunch of stuff on the basis of hunches and limited data based on desperation, most things aren't going to work very well.
            One of the reasons to restrict it is that there are conditions where it does actually work & people who do need it for proven clinical reasons. Lupus is one condition I know uses it, if those folk miss out it can have consequences. If there is a massive run on the drug for COVID patients others will either miss out or end up paying a fortune (which might lead to missing out anyway). Most of the HCQ boosters I encounter are diehard Trumpers whose motivations are far more political than humanitarian. They seem less concerned about people dying when they are asked to wear masks or socially distance.
            sigpic

            Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

            Comment


            • Originally posted by GVChamp View Post
              I think people are going to be disappointed when they realize "vaccine" by FDA terms doesn't mean "prevent the disease," it means "prevents the disease or reduces the impact in 50% of the people who get it." I think even "normal" by summer 2021 is incredibly optimistic.
              Translation: you've got about a year to lose weight. Reduce (NOT ELIMINATE) big time sugar, salt, and fats from your nutrition. Your BEST BET against COVID-19 is to get HEALTHY.

              And if you're taking pills for high blood pressure, heart condition, diabetes, etc. The for Pete sakes, get yourselves a stock of N95 masks. Not the cloth masks but the N95 types.

              Comment


              • Op-Ed: The MAGA President Remade America as a Shithole Country

                If COVID-19 is a war against the “China Virus,” as Trump insists, America lost miserably.

                The nation is quarantined, fearful of a virus raging uncontrollably because the president surrendered. The 160,000 lost souls so far have already surpassed American deaths in every overseas war save World War II.

                This is, as Nancy Pelosi has said, the “Trump Virus” because this administration actually facilitated its spread. Authoritarian tweets aren’t the only third-world reality of his presidency; a deliberate anti-science policy begat a festering illiteracy and evisceration of our public health. We are now the shithole country in the toilet—not the shining city on the hill—thanks to the president’s disinterest in protecting Americans. Our passports are a red flag to the world because of the failure to mitigate the infection rate here.

                As Katherine Eban’s reporting crystallized, Trump, Jared Kushner and company wilfully denied vital health care and equipment to Democratic-majority states and cities. By refusing to activate a genuine national emergency plan, Trump immobilized America at the initial epicenters of the crisis, and quickly left us with the world’s worst pandemic response. At every turn, Trump incited civil unrest rather than encourage a disciplined and united approach to social distancing.

                There is more to blame than Trump alone. Gov. Andrew Cuomo likewise ignored the body counts in China and Europe to initially downplay the pandemic’s deadliness. But Cuomo eventually followed the science instead of gaslighting, and a governor is not a president.

                After I called out Trump’s genocidal negligence on cable television last weekend, his cultists trolled my inbox. There is nothing that makes them more madly defensive than the guilt of supporting a treasonous wartime president, under whose watch there have been scores of thousands of preventable deaths, and whose day of reckoning awaits on November 3.

                What upsets them most is direct and truthful language. They know but won’t admit Trump is responsible for the greatest homeland insecurity in U.S. history. First attacking disproportionately Black Americans in metropolises, the virus has now spread all across rural and suburban parts.

                Public health and the survival of our democracy are not supposed to be partisan issues. They are in 2020. Since Trump’s Postmaster General Louis DeJoy, a GOP super-donor, began defunding the USPS and instituting new rules to end overtime and curtail delivery hours, Americans have reported extreme delays and suspensions in Democratic-voting cities. As The Philadelphia Inquirer reported, many people in majority-Black zip codes can no longer rely on getting paychecks, medication, and other essentials delivered; their votes are similarly endangered.

                There’s no need for Democrats on the Hill to invite DeJoy to deliver song-and-dance testimony. It’s self-evident that he is attempting to ratfuck, on Trump’s behalf, the postal service and to cripple the franchise for Democrats specifically this fall.

                All those challenging Trump this November can’t be afraid to say so. We are all witness to his failings, and potential victims of them. If Trump is re-elected, there is no trust we can place in the scientific soundness of a rushed government show-vaccine.

                COVID-19 has terrorized the nation because of Trump’s genocidal negligence, which now is increasingly a pretext for manipulating the vote.
                ______________

                But at least he's the "anti-lefty"
                TwentyFiveFortyFive

                Comment


                • I really hate the term "preventable deaths." Death has never been nor will it ever be preventable. The best we can do is delay it.

                  Our medical science has gotten to the point where we can allow people to live with really unhealthy habbits. People with high blood pressure continues to take in loads of salt because of medication. You can make a living without ever having to get your heart rate up to a healthy beat. You can earn enough money to hoard your food inside your body. COVID-19 has killed a lot of unhealthy people who has relied on medical science to avoid getting healthy.

                  As I can continually stated, your best bet against COVID-19 is to get healthy. Unfortunately, I do not see that happening anytime soon.

                  Comment


                  • Two interesting data points, which do not necessarily make a trend:


                    Financial institutions' average weekly borrowings from the Fed – a key early indicator of liquidity troubles – fell below $4 billion in the latest (Aug 5) data for the first time in 21 weeks. (The number has tended to be around $500 million over the 100+ years.)

                    Initial unemployment claims fell below one million in figures to Aug 8, the first below that benchmark in 20 weeks. (300,000 is a more normal figure.) Claims fell to less than 0.9% of the labor force, from a high of 3.2% in April (and a norm of less than 0.15%)
                    Trust me?
                    I'm an economist!

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by DOR View Post
                      2012.

                      Economic growth in the six quarters to Q-3 2012 was 2.0%, inflation 2.8%, unemployment 8.5%, real wages falling 1.7% p.a.

                      Barack Hussein Obama II was reelected.
                      And how does that compare with now ?

                      Originally posted by DOR View Post
                      The COVID Economy, US Q-2 2020 Edition

                      Real US GDP fell 32.9% from the first quarter to the second, or by 9.5% when measured year-on-year. Both figures are adjusted for inflation and seasonality. In real terms, more than three-quarters (78%) of the $1.92 - $2.15 trillion nominal decline (depending on YoY or QQ measures, respectively) was from depressed private consumption, particularly services (68.6% of the whole).

                      Capital investment added another third to the fiall, collapsing 17.8% YoY. That's more than 100% because of positive contributions from government spending (up 2.1% from Q-2 2019). Domestic demand, which is the same as GDP except exports are deducted and imports are added to the total, fell 11.9% from a year ago.

                      Sales of vehicles and auto parts fell 6% from a year earlier (and gasoline by 22.6%), clothing and footwear by 23.1%, household furnishings 17.7%, transportation services by 40.2% and recreational spending by 54.1%. Food service consumed away from home fell 39.7%.

                      A 4.9% surge in food prices helped keep the private consumption deflator – a broad inflation measures favored by the Fed – in positive territory, by 0.6%. Prices for recreational goods fell 5.2%, clothes and shoes 7.3%, and gas 28.7%. If food and energy are excluded (i.e., “core” price changes), the overall deflator fell 16.0% from April-June 2019.

                      Thanks to depressed earnings, massive government spending and postponed tax collection the federal budget deficit in the first six months of 2020 totaled $2.39 trillion, up 457.6% from a year earlier. Revenues fell 20.9% while spending rose 69.5%.
                      2% growth vs. 9.5% drop in real GDP !!

                      Unemployment likely higher now than back then. Forget falling wages and think no wages.

                      The only positive (can we call it that) is no inflation instead there is deflation.
                      Last edited by Double Edge; 14 Aug 20,, 12:31.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Double Edge View Post
                        And how does that compare with now ?



                        2% growth vs. 9.5% drop in real GDP !!

                        Unemployment likely higher now than back then. Forget falling wages and think no wages.

                        The only positive (can we call it that) is no inflation instead there is deflation.

                        DE,

                        I don't know where you're going with this.
                        The economy is far, far worse today than in 2012.
                        Anyone who believes the economy determines the outcome of the election can only believe The Trumpet will lose.
                        However, to assert that it is impossible to win in a down economy is simply wrong.
                        It has happened before.

                        Oh, and we haven't seen two consecutive months of falling (YoY) prices since early 2015.
                        Trust me?
                        I'm an economist!

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by DOR View Post
                          DE,

                          I don't know where you're going with this.
                          The economy is far, far worse today than in 2012.
                          Anyone who believes the economy determines the outcome of the election can only believe The Trumpet will lose.
                          However, to assert that it is impossible to win in a down economy is simply wrong.
                          It has happened before.

                          Oh, and we haven't seen two consecutive months of falling (YoY) prices since early 2015.
                          It's entirely possible that he will win, but only via voter suppression. Hence the wholesale kneecapping of the USPS, among other things. He's not even trying to hide it.
                          TwentyFiveFortyFive

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                            Translation: you've got about a year to lose weight.
                            A year? We're about to start the second wave over here...

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by kato View Post
                              A year? We're about to start the second wave over here...
                              Sadly, we haven't finished Wave 1 here.

                              Some states may be sniffing Wave 2 (NY & New England....maybe) but the country as whole is still wallowing in Wave 1.
                              “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
                              Mark Twain

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Albany Rifles View Post
                                Sadly, we haven't finished Wave 1 here.
                                Nah, you did end wave 1 in most states. You just immediately relaxed rules again to where the reproduction rate shot above 1.0 within a few weeks, thus keeping up infection numbers.
                                See
                                https://rt.live/

                                Once Wave 2 starts the reproduction rates will shoot up above about 3.0 per day pretty fast.


                                For scale of relaxation of rules in comparison, i've been wearing a mask when on public transport, shopping, working etc since April 27th (legal requirement). And i don't expect that to be relaxed before circa March to April next year (end of next flu season) unless we get like three months with zero cases at least in my province.
                                Last edited by kato; 17 Aug 20,, 18:57.

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