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  • Originally posted by Double Edge View Post
    She isn't the only one saying they can find no evidence for systemic institutional bias against blacks when it comes to law enforcement.

    Already posted about Roland Fryers work
    Of course she can't find anything because she doesn't intend to find anything as she is bigoted to start with and far removed from objective. The fact that you post these things reminds me of Trump and his re-tweets which calls into question your character. Definitely calls into question your knowledge concerning anything in the United States having not lived your life here. Instead of pontificating why not simply read and ask questions. If, for example, I am interested in something about Germany then I ask Kato rather than presume to have any knowledge beforehand. That's just me...

    Comment


    • Coronavirus stimulus checks: President Trump calls for 'direct payments' to 'all Americans'

      President Trump called for additional stimulus checks to be sent to Americans amid stalled talks with Democrats over a new bill to address various issues related to the coronavirus pandemic.

      Both Republicans and Democrats agree that another round of stimulus checks should be included in any legislation, which is stalled after Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY) ceded the GOP-side of negotiations to the White House and Trump attempted to bypass negotiations with unilateral action on a looming eviction crisis, student loans, extra weekly unemployment benefits, and payroll taxes.

      The president tweeted that he had directed Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin “to get ready to send direct payments ($3,400 for family of four) to all Americans.” The tweet added that Democrats are holding up the stimulus payments, though there are several actual disagreements unrelated to stimulus checks.

      The president’s suggestion of $3,400 for a family of four implies that the economic payments would be similar to the first round, included in the CARES Act passed in March, which involved eligible Americans receiving $1,200 each and an additional $500 per dependent.

      However, Trump’s tweet expanded the proposed payment to “all Americans.” In the first round, single adults with income up to $75,000 were eligible for the full check, while reduced checks were available for single adults making between $75,001 and $99,000. Roughly 160 million Americans received stimulus checks in the first round of payments. Trump’s proposal would roughly double that number.

      Can the president issue an executive order on stimulus checks?
      According to experts, the president could not legally include this popular relief aid in executive orders or memoranda like he attempted to do with other issues.

      “Fundamentally, the president doesn't have the authority to do that,” Seth Hanlon, a tax policy expert at the Center for American Progress, told Yahoo Money. “It would be blatantly unconstitutional if he did.”


      The president cannot draw money out of the Treasury that Congress hasn't yet appropriated. For instance, the money he’s using for the unemployment insurance executive order is reprogrammed funds that Congress has already appropriated for disaster relief.

      That executive order directs the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) to create a new program for unemployment using $44 billion in disaster relief funds. But he couldn’t use that money for purposes such as stimulus checks which, in practice, are tax rebates, according to Hanlon.

      “The rules that Congress provided for the FEMA money do allow some flexibility on using it to provide aid to the unemployed,” Hanlon said. “It’s clearly in the domain of Congress — not the president — to authorize the direct payment of money out of the Treasury.”

      What do Republicans and Democrats say on stimulus checks?
      The HEROES Act — the Democratic stimulus proposal passed by the House in May but not taken by the Senate — and the HEALS Act — the Republicans’ plan proposed in late July but never voted on by the Senate — outline similar ideas of what the next round of stimulus checks would look like.

      The Republican plan would send a second wave of stimulus checks of up to $1,200 to Americans, plus an additional $500 for any dependent. The Democratic plan proposed that taxpayers would receive $1,200 per individual and an extra $1,200 dependent bonus for any dependent claimed on their tax return.

      Under the Republican proposal, those without a Social Security number and nonresident aliens — those who aren’t a U.S. citizen or U.S. national and don’t have a green card or have not passed the substantial presence test — would not be eligible for a payment.

      By contrast, the Democrats’ plan proposes sending payments to Individual Taxpayer Identification Number (ITIN) filers and their families. The change would mean that more than 4.3 million adults and 3.5 million children would be eligible for the payment, according to ITEP.
      _________

      Now, I'm not a constitutional law professor, but I've always thought that it was Congress that hold the power of the purse.

      Surfgun, you're our resident Trump apologist....any thoughts on this? How does one say L'État, c'est moi in Trumpese?
      Supporting or defending Donald Trump is such an unforgivable moral failing that it calls every bit of your judgement and character into question. Nothing about you should be trusted if you can look at this man and find redeemable value

      Comment


      • Why everyone should get a stimulus check is beyond me. I interact with three clear groups of people in my office. One group are those who work for big firms and are able to work from home. Examples being Oracle, IBM, Microsoft, Google, Facebook, PeopleSoft, and Salesforce to name a few. They have seen zero hit to their wallet. Then there are the self-employed, like me, who can't work from home. Either their business has declined because of mandates to close, or because of fear, if open. Last, the service sector where you can also throw the working poor. They are all on Medi-Cal in just the last four months since losing their normal insurance. If one wants to know where stimulus checks should be sent then start with the unemployment rolls rather than giving someone still making their $140K a year.

        Sheesh, I better write fast as I get timed out in under three minutes.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by tbm3fan View Post
          Why everyone should get a stimulus check is beyond me.
          I agree. I'm still working. I have no need of another check from Uncle Sam. If I was out of work, it would be a different story.

          As it is, I'll do what I did with the last one: Send it to my parents. They're the ones that need it.
          Supporting or defending Donald Trump is such an unforgivable moral failing that it calls every bit of your judgement and character into question. Nothing about you should be trusted if you can look at this man and find redeemable value

          Comment


          • Originally posted by DOR View Post
            Here are the ratios from this story, just the Black/Total numbers.

            235/1004=23.4%
            9/28=32.1%
            38/70=54.3%

            Remember, African Americans make up 13.8% of the US population ...
            If you read further you find this

            In 2018 there were 7,407 black homicide victims. Assuming a comparable number of victims last year, those nine unarmed black victims of police shootings represent 0.1% of all African-Americans killed in 2019.
            0.1% !?! and the whole drama over George Floyd and any other isolated incident that will happen in the future.

            Why not talking about black on black crime ? making those neighbourhoods safer.

            Can't do it. Where will the funding come from. Low tax revenue means these places aren't going to get better.

            That's the real problem isn't it. Nobody wants to talk about that.

            When people do these drive bys there is no where to hide, that children and innocents will be killed.

            On Memorial Day weekend in Chicago alone, 10 African-Americans were killed in drive-by shootings.

            Such routine violence has continued—a 72-year-old Chicago man shot in the face on May 29 by a gunman who fired about a dozen shots into a residence;

            two 19-year-old women on the South Side shot to death as they sat in a parked car a few hours earlier;

            a 16-year-old boy fatally stabbed with his own knife that same day.

            This past weekend, 80 Chicagoans were shot in drive-by shootings, 21 fatally, the victims overwhelmingly black.

            Police shootings are not the reason that blacks die of homicide at eight times the rate of whites and Hispanics combined; criminal violence is.
            That fraction of blacks killed by police is takeaway #1. Yet see how things got portrayed after Floyd. Obvious agenda being pushed.

            This charge of systemic police bias was wrong during the Obama years and remains so today. However sickening the video of Floyd’s arrest, it isn’t representative of the 375 million annual contacts that police officers have with civilians. A solid body of evidence finds no structural bias in the criminal-justice system with regard to arrests, prosecution or sentencing.

            Crime and suspect behavior, not race, determine most police actions.
            Behaviour not race determines police action. Which is what you expect. Cops aren't looking at colour they're trained to react to signs & actions as their lives depend on it.

            Takeaway #2

            The false narrative of systemic police bias resulted in targeted killings of officers during the Obama presidency. The pattern may be repeating itself. Officers are being assaulted and shot at while they try to arrest gun suspects or respond to the growing riots. Police precincts and courthouses have been destroyed with impunity, which will encourage more civilization-destroying violence. If the Ferguson effect of officers backing off law enforcement in minority neighborhoods is reborn as the Minneapolis effect, the thousands of law-abiding African-Americans who depend on the police for basic safety will once again be the victims.
            That bolded bit is the chilling part. I see this happening from time to time in my country. I saw this happen after Floyd and astralis said the riots were not even 10% of what happened after Rodney King.

            I don't know if this is progress but its not good.
            Last edited by Double Edge; 15 Aug 20,, 09:31.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by tbm3fan View Post
              Of course she can't find anything because she doesn't intend to find anything as she is bigoted to start with and far removed from objective.
              How about Roland Fryer ? does he count when he says he finds no systemic race bias in policing actions. He did admit to being surprised by his findings.

              Originally posted by tbm3fan View Post
              The fact that you post these things reminds me of Trump and his re-tweets which calls into question your character.

              Definitely calls into question your knowledge concerning anything in the United States having not lived your life here.
              Calling out the obvious agenda at play.

              I've stated i hang out in the echo chamber of those that either support or do not have a problem with the current govt. No need to live in the country in that case.

              Besides what i've said is par for the course on this board. Nothing remarkable.

              Originally posted by tbm3fan View Post
              Instead of pontificating why not simply read and ask questions. If, for example, I am interested in something about Germany then I ask Kato rather than presume to have any knowledge beforehand. That's just me...
              I aspire to do more. Ten years in this place you'd think you can do more than that.

              Let me give you an example from a different context. Product reviewers.

              I frequently challenge them about their knowledge of the product they are reviewing. Some of the dimwitted ones and they are plenty of these glorified sales people question whether i own the product to which i say i do not. Then how can i say anything ?

              Because i have an idea of these products and know others that do have them. Simple.

              How long does one need to live in your country to talk about it ?

              On this board you will meet people from different countries and you think they will talk about different things. What always surprises me is how similar their stories sound. Pretty sure it works both ways : )

              People identifying patterns and making observations that do not readily come to a home crowd. Pointing out things that are right in front of you but for some reason cannot be seen.

              I do have a vested interest here. If i'm to counter what the western liberal press says about my country then i start with what they say about your country : )

              Gameplan, bias & agendas are the same.
              Last edited by Double Edge; 15 Aug 20,, 11:51.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by TopHatter View Post
                Coronavirus stimulus checks: President Trump calls for 'direct payments' to 'all Americans'

                President Trump called for additional stimulus checks to be sent to Americans amid stalled talks with Democrats over a new bill to address various issues related to the coronavirus pandemic.

                Both Republicans and Democrats agree that another round of stimulus checks should be included in any legislation, which is stalled after Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY) ceded the GOP-side of negotiations to the White House and Trump attempted to bypass negotiations with unilateral action on a looming eviction crisis, student loans, extra weekly unemployment benefits, and payroll taxes.

                The president tweeted that he had directed Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin “to get ready to send direct payments ($3,400 for family of four) to all Americans.” The tweet added that Democrats are holding up the stimulus payments, though there are several actual disagreements unrelated to stimulus checks.

                The president’s suggestion of $3,400 for a family of four implies that the economic payments would be similar to the first round, included in the CARES Act passed in March, which involved eligible Americans receiving $1,200 each and an additional $500 per dependent.

                However, Trump’s tweet expanded the proposed payment to “all Americans.” In the first round, single adults with income up to $75,000 were eligible for the full check, while reduced checks were available for single adults making between $75,001 and $99,000. Roughly 160 million Americans received stimulus checks in the first round of payments. Trump’s proposal would roughly double that number.

                Can the president issue an executive order on stimulus checks?
                According to experts, the president could not legally include this popular relief aid in executive orders or memoranda like he attempted to do with other issues.

                “Fundamentally, the president doesn't have the authority to do that,” Seth Hanlon, a tax policy expert at the Center for American Progress, told Yahoo Money. “It would be blatantly unconstitutional if he did.”


                The president cannot draw money out of the Treasury that Congress hasn't yet appropriated. For instance, the money he’s using for the unemployment insurance executive order is reprogrammed funds that Congress has already appropriated for disaster relief.

                That executive order directs the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) to create a new program for unemployment using $44 billion in disaster relief funds. But he couldn’t use that money for purposes such as stimulus checks which, in practice, are tax rebates, according to Hanlon.

                “The rules that Congress provided for the FEMA money do allow some flexibility on using it to provide aid to the unemployed,” Hanlon said. “It’s clearly in the domain of Congress — not the president — to authorize the direct payment of money out of the Treasury.”

                What do Republicans and Democrats say on stimulus checks?
                The HEROES Act — the Democratic stimulus proposal passed by the House in May but not taken by the Senate — and the HEALS Act — the Republicans’ plan proposed in late July but never voted on by the Senate — outline similar ideas of what the next round of stimulus checks would look like.

                The Republican plan would send a second wave of stimulus checks of up to $1,200 to Americans, plus an additional $500 for any dependent. The Democratic plan proposed that taxpayers would receive $1,200 per individual and an extra $1,200 dependent bonus for any dependent claimed on their tax return.

                Under the Republican proposal, those without a Social Security number and nonresident aliens — those who aren’t a U.S. citizen or U.S. national and don’t have a green card or have not passed the substantial presence test — would not be eligible for a payment.

                By contrast, the Democrats’ plan proposes sending payments to Individual Taxpayer Identification Number (ITIN) filers and their families. The change would mean that more than 4.3 million adults and 3.5 million children would be eligible for the payment, according to ITEP.
                _________

                Now, I'm not a constitutional law professor, but I've always thought that it was Congress that hold the power of the purse.

                Surfgun, you're our resident Trump apologist....any thoughts on this? How does one say L'État, c'est moi in Trumpese?
                I remember a check from the IRS after Bush was elected. It came with his blessings and instructions to go blow it on something.

                That was your then president's idea of stimulating the economy out of a recession.

                Same idea at play here, DOR ?

                This idea is more cunning, its before the election : )
                Last edited by Double Edge; 15 Aug 20,, 11:41.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Albany Rifles View Post
                  DE,

                  I am an adjunct professor of American History. I know my country's sordid history and embedded racism. To deny it is to

                  I see it on a daily basis. I have numerous Black friends who get pulled over repeatedly for the crime of "driving while black"...I have been in the car with them on 3 occasions. Oh, and on one occasion everyone in the car was a serving United States Army officer.

                  I can name you towns where this happens regularly....Colonial Heights, VA, Prince William County, VA, Montgomery County, MD, and on and on and on.
                  Do you deny the tremendous strides your country has made to address this issue ?

                  Two term black President, they said it would never happen and when it did there was this fear he would end up like Kennedy. Hah!

                  I watched his inauguration because it was historic. How quickly people forgot that.

                  Numerous black cabinet officers. Military. Sports & Culture.

                  How is all of this possible if your country still has embedded racism ?

                  What further convinces me of this progress is how well people in my community fare in your country.

                  How far they go and how high they rise up the food chain.

                  I never hear of this subject from them and they are all US citizens.

                  It's the exact opposite, land of opportunity where the only limits are how far you want to go.

                  History. That's the word isn't it. All in the past. How about leaving what happened in the 60s back there and look ahead.

                  If i hung onto what the Brits did in my country i'd never be able to interact with any one from that country.

                  Why would i hold the present generation responsible for the actions of their forefathers. I'm not going to do that.

                  I did live in your country for over five years and i sure as hell never experienced racism on a daily basis.

                  I've lived in the UK for longer where harassment is more prevalent and spent some time in France. I grew up in the middle east where its even more blatant on the street. But my parents saw none of it in the office, they interacted with a different class of people.

                  I'm white collar. Blue collar is different and pretty much the same in many places.

                  Your cops are intimidating & mean, demand total compliance or they draw, that I will grant you. But my experiences with them weren't anything to write about.

                  There's bad areas every where. Places where non-whites are not welcome or no go areas for cops.

                  Older generations are less tolerant, they lived in a different world.

                  Wish it could be different but that's how it is.

                  Originally posted by Albany Rifles View Post
                  There are plenty of reports of systemic racist issues in American policing...see the the attached article.

                  So, how many American police officers do you know? What first hand knowledge do you have on the topic here in America?

                  https://www.washingtonpost.com/graph...ustice-system/
                  Roland Fryer is a professor with such experience. I don't remember you replying to his findings.

                  From the WSJ article..

                  Assuming a comparable number of victims last year, those nine unarmed black victims of police shootings represent 0.1% of all African-Americans killed in 2019.

                  By contrast, a police officer is 18˝ times more likely to be killed by a black male than an unarmed black male is to be killed by a police officer.
                  Who is the more afraid here, the cop or the subject ?

                  The data says the cop, the rhetoric says its the subject and especially if they're black.

                  That is the mismatch i'm highlighting here.
                  Last edited by Double Edge; 15 Aug 20,, 12:14.

                  Comment




                  • This is asking alot of peoples time but I believe is a good reflection of the side of the discussion that is not happening in america.

                    Comment


                    • I would suggest the trend in america over a decades time scale is clearly positive on systematic racism. There are clearly still racists and racist cops.

                      American gun culture is dramatically different to other western nations which alters the calculus on policing it. While you gave black people freedom, you kept the wealth you accrued from slavery and further discriminatory patterns/laws over centuries. That meant black people are disproportinately poor and poor people are more likely to commit crime. That places black people in the firing line and at the mercy of feedback loops which causes more racism, stereotypes, which festers further.

                      The number one issue is an economic class issue but the ideology that america holds makes that difficult to fix on, so america is stuck focusing on identity politics. The unfortunate reality is that black people are far more likely to be murdered by a black person than a cop. Overfocusing on this issue will probably lead to less policing of poor neighbourhoods, which will be bad, and a level in breakdown in trust that is not proportional to the problem, which is bad. Not to mention the opportunity cost of failing to focus on the more powerful trends at play.

                      Speculatively, I would guess europe has a smaller class issue, which makes the racism piece bigger proportionately. We might actually benefit more from the Black Lives Matter Movement, as I think we have more to gain and are at less risk of falling foul of large opportunity costs.
                      Last edited by tantalus; 15 Aug 20,, 11:07.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by tbm3fan View Post
                        Why everyone should get a stimulus check is beyond me. I interact with three clear groups of people in my office. One group are those who work for big firms and are able to work from home. Examples being Oracle, IBM, Microsoft, Google, Facebook, PeopleSoft, and Salesforce to name a few. They have seen zero hit to their wallet. Then there are the self-employed, like me, who can't work from home. Either their business has declined because of mandates to close, or because of fear, if open. Last, the service sector where you can also throw the working poor. They are all on Medi-Cal in just the last four months since losing their normal insurance. If one wants to know where stimulus checks should be sent then start with the unemployment rolls rather than giving someone still making their $140K a year.

                        Sheesh, I better write fast as I get timed out in under three minutes.
                        Originally posted by TopHatter View Post
                        I agree. I'm still working. I have no need of another check from Uncle Sam. If I was out of work, it would be a different story.

                        As it is, I'll do what I did with the last one: Send it to my parents. They're the ones that need it.
                        Two things to consider are speed and effect.

                        If it slows the process of figuring it out, then perhaps its better to give it to everyone and look at ways of taxing it back later when the system has more time to focus on the problem. Perhaps this only applied to the first cheques when the istuation was truly desperate during the first lockdowns. Speed was critical then.

                        the second is the effect you seek. If you are not just trying to help the poor but stoke demand in the economy through consumer spending and the multiplier effect which in turn helps everyone than it is important to remember than the majority of spening is done up the food chain. Pyschology is powerful, and america needs to alter the dynamic of the pandemic effects, away from saving and towards spening. The cheques can help alter that dynamic. Admitedly the most bang for your buck is by giving it to the poor who will spend the bulk of it, but there are wider, desperate macro ecomonic forces at play here.

                        Normally I would suggest a third being political obstacles and the value of the illusion of fairness by giving it to everyone but because the situation is so desperate, and surveys indicate that the majority of voters on both sides support the cheques, it can largely be discounted, although this may still be a reason to compromise and give it to 100%.
                        Last edited by tantalus; 15 Aug 20,, 11:33.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Double Edge View Post
                          If you read further you find this



                          0.1% !?! and the whole drama over George Floyd and any other isolated incident that will happen in the future.

                          Why not talking about black on black crime ? making those neighbourhoods safer.

                          Can't do it. Where will the funding come from. Low tax revenue means these places aren't going to get better.

                          That's the real problem isn't it. Nobody wants to talk about that.

                          When people do these drive bys there is no where to hide, that children and innocents will be killed.



                          That fraction of blacks killed by police is takeaway #1. Yet see how things got portrayed after Floyd. Obvious agenda being pushed.



                          Behaviour not race determines police action. Which is what you expect. Cops aren't looking at colour they're trained to react to signs & actions as their lives depend on it.

                          Takeaway #2



                          That bolded bit is the chilling part. I see this happening from time to time in my country. I saw this happen after Floyd and astralis said the riots were not even 10% of what happened after Rodney King.

                          I don't know if this is progress but its not good.

                          DE,
                          Please stop changing the subject.

                          The topic is police killing Black people.
                          Not all killings of Black people.
                          Not non-police killings of Black people.

                          Police killing Black people.

                          Got it?
                          Trust me?
                          I'm an economist!

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Double Edge View Post
                            I remember a check from the IRS after Bush was elected. It came with his blessings and instructions to go blow it on something.

                            That was your then president's idea of stimulating the economy out of a recession.

                            Same idea at play here, DOR ?

                            This idea is more cunning, its before the election : )
                            I'm always amazed at how GOPers get away with claiming to (a) believe in fiscal conservatism; and (b) prefer supply side solutions.

                            Here's how Keynes saw the problem:

                            Case 1: Recession/Depression.

                            Demand is inadequate to keep employment sufficiently high to maintain standards of living and general civic peace.
                            The private sector -- consumers and investors both -- are unwilling or unable to supply sufficient demand.
                            Therefore, and only in that special case, the government should step in and temporarily replace that lack of demand, by increasing spending, reducing taxation, or otherwise running a budget deficit.
                            When demand once again returns to an acceptable level, government should back off, and let the private sector do its thing.

                            Case 2: Boom/Inflation.
                            Demand is excessive to the needs of employment, and driving up prices which lowers standards of living and threatens civic peace.
                            The private sector -- consumers and investors both -- are unwilling or unable to increase supply sufficiently to meet demand.
                            Therefore, and only in that special case, the government should step in and temporarily rebalance demand, either by supplying stock from its own reserves or by removing liquidity from the money supply (increasing taxes, cutting spending, or otherwise running a budget surplus).
                            When demand once again returns to an acceptable level, government should back off, and let the private sector do its thing.

                            History
                            In the latter half of the 1990s, the federal government finally got a grip on the massive Reagan-Bush era budget blowout, and -- at a time of strong economic fundamentals -- ran a federal budget surplus for four years in a row.

                            In the Dubious case of GW Bush, the justification for giving away billions to corporations and wealthy households (and a pittance to those in actual need) was that the federal budget was "your money." It was his ideological objection to the government using its fiscal power to manage the economy, not any desire to put food on the tables of the needy.

                            The mechanism was reduced income tax rates, reduced capital gains tax rates, increased child tax credit, and other bits and pieces. The price was 1.5-2.0% of GDP, per year, to 2010. There was nothing about the 2001 recession in the rationale, since no one knew there was a recession when the plan was drafted. Later, it was added as a fig leaf of an excuse.

                            The government hand-out to most Americans was zero, since the mechanism was a tax rebate and most people don't pay federal income taxes (that's true in just about every country on earth, by the way). If you didn't qualify to pay at least $300 in taxes, you got less than that. If you didn't qualify to pay any federal income tax, you got nothing, zip, zilch, nada.
                            Trust me?
                            I'm an economist!

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by DOR View Post
                              DE,
                              Please stop changing the subject.

                              The topic is police killing Black people.
                              Not all killings of Black people.
                              Not non-police killings of Black people.

                              Police killing Black people.

                              Got it?
                              THAT IS THE FREAKING SUBJECT! The POLICE is TASKED WITH PROTECTING THE PEOPLE! Guess who is killing Blacks. Guess who the POLICE TARGETS in ORDER TO PROTECT BLACKS!

                              Do you get it?
                              Chimo

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by DOR View Post
                                DE,
                                Please stop changing the subject.

                                The topic is police killing Black people.
                                Not all killings of Black people.
                                Not non-police killings of Black people.

                                Police killing Black people.

                                Got it?
                                All 5 per year.Sure.What is your opinion?While you think on it,let’ consider how many of the handful killed by the pooolice studied this documentary

                                https://youtu.be/OEvMc-K8XHY

                                Btw,Saint George the Riot Maker had his angel wings clipped a bit.Turns out he was a counterfeiter junkie.You can’t pay the dealer in counterfeit currency,they find it good reason to increase black on black crime.
                                Not sure if HE still counts as killed by the poooulice.
                                Those who know don't speak
                                He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36

                                Comment

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