The US 2020 Presidential Election

[InExile]

evidence needed for Biden family doing that.

for that matter, evidence needed that Biden family did anything like what Ivanka did...like getting her trademarks all approved by China literally the day when Xi visited daddy dearest.

bottom-line, Trump is a billionaire with a LONG history of sordid deals and outright corruption. Biden is not. given that he was VP, if he were corrupt he'd certainly have billions in net worth by now. HRC and Bill Clinton easily made $200 million+ in speech fees alone, post-power.

I don't mind if you think Trump's policy choices are better than Biden's, misguided as I think that might be.

if you think Trump is LESS CORRUPT than Biden, then I'm surprised you're not in WWG1WGA territory.

There is reason to believe that Biden's 'decency' is somewhat exaggerated.

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/ar...ly-exaggerated

But using his possible few alleged failings over decades as a politician as a reason for voting for one of the most corrupt and unethical men to serve as President, that is just nuts!

[Bigfella]

There is reason to believe that Biden's 'decency' is somewhat exaggerated.

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/ar...ly-exaggerated

But using his possible few alleged failings over decades as a politician as a reason for voting for one of the most corrupt and unethical men to serve as President, that is just nuts!

That is correct, and also incorrect. No one is going to be using Biden's history as a reason to vote for Trump for the simlpe reason that no one could compare the two and choose Trump. However, people may use Biden's history as an excuse for doing something they know to be profoundly wrong. They were going to do it anyway, but they can pretend it is actually about Biden.

[snapper]

And stop pretending his handsyness with women and girls is not misread social cues, its a complete disregard for the body autonomy of women. Oh finally he appears to be hip deep in using

As opposed to a bunch of 'religious' people who wish to deny that autonomy if a Lady falls pregnant?

[zraver]

Tried to reply to Asty with links about Biden family corruption but keep getting a 406 denied message. Politico, NYPost and many other mainstream sites have a multitude of exposes on it.

[zraver]

That is correct, and also incorrect. No one is going to be using Biden's history as a reason to vote for Trump for the simlpe reason that no one could compare the two and choose Trump. However, people may use Biden's history as an excuse for doing something they know to be profoundly wrong. They were going to do it anyway, but they can pretend it is actually about Biden.

I think you are wrong. Been a major failing of the Left since 16 is to try and pigeon hole the Right without actually doing a deep dive. The Left's stated aims if they win in November is: pack SCOTUS, get rid of the fillibuster, ditch the EC, and legalize 3rd party ballot harvesting. Taken together those things would end American representative government. Somebody who can't stand Trump would be fully justified in voting for him to prevent that series of disasters. There is incredible diversity of thought on the right where the Left's increasingly authoritarian conformity has all but drowned out moderate voices. The attempt to appease the hard Left has seen Biden sign on to a manifesto that is decidedly red in color.

[astralis]

Tried to reply to Asty with links about Biden family corruption but keep getting a 406 denied message. Politico, NYPost and many other mainstream sites have a multitude of exposes on it.

which is, of course, why both Joe and Hunter Biden are both billionaires, and the Senate committee investigating Hunter Biden's ties to Burisma have discovered a whole series of crimes that justify his arrest.

for some reason all these Trump associates keep on getting arrested but Hunter Biden is walking free! must be deep-state.

/s

[astralis]

pack SCOTUS, get rid of the fillibuster, ditch the EC, and legalize 3rd party ballot harvesting. Taken together those things would end American representative government.

would love to see the first three, tho i'd be willing to wait on #1 and see what the Roberts court does with a Dem President before I really would be supportive.

the last one is not really a Dem thing; 26 states already allow it, including states like Nebraska, North Dakota, South Dakota, South Carolina...politically it doesn't really favor anyone, like mail-in voting.

taking all the things together, we'd finally have a government that would -do- something, instead of complete and utter paralysis. and if I could, I'd turn Puerto Rico/DC/Guam into states, and see how the GOP likes it when the Dems decide to play political hardball.

unfortunately, tho, I doubt Biden will do any of these, except MAYBE the filibuster if the GOP decides to continue from the 2010 Mitch McConnell playbook.

finally, regarding the EC, I guarantee you the GOP will be the noisiest proponent for the elimination of the EC if Texas alone transitions into a blue state.

[surfgun]

A list of things that would die if the Donkey Party would win?
F-15EX
F/A-XX, F-35C will do, despite the Navy wants an Aircraft with long legs.
Any Columbia class SSGN’s
SSNX, just get by with new build Virginia’s
A dumbed down Bradley replacement
6.5mm small arms may or may not survive?
Get by with new build Blackhawks and kill off the high speed successor?
Kill the Ch-53K.
That is off the top of my head.

[surfgun]

Plagiarism (again)?
https://nationalpost.com/news/joe-bi...d3edcf221/amp/

[zraver]

would love to see the first three, tho i'd be willing to wait on #1 and see what the Roberts court does with a Dem President before I really would be supportive.

the last one is not really a Dem thing; 26 states already allow it, including states like Nebraska, North Dakota, South Dakota, South Carolina...politically it doesn't really favor anyone, like mail-in voting.

taking all the things together, we'd finally have a government that would -do- something, instead of complete and utter paralysis. and if I could, I'd turn Puerto Rico/DC/Guam into states, and see how the GOP likes it when the Dems decide to play political hardball.

unfortunately, tho, I doubt Biden will do any of these, except MAYBE the filibuster if the GOP decides to continue from the 2010 Mitch McConnell playbook.

finally, regarding the EC, I guarantee you the GOP will be the noisiest proponent for the elimination of the EC if Texas alone transitions into a blue state.

Packing the court is a way to bypass Congress, even FDR ultimately shied away from it.

The fillibuster is useful in slowing down government and preventing single party authoritarianism. It is a useful tool to force concensus. If the parties are so divided then the one who thinks its just such an important issue should go try and win an election. Ending the fillibuster is a way to disenfranchise voters once removed.

The EC protects minority voices. If you really wanted a fairer system then award EC votes based on who won the congressional district with popular vote winner getting the +2 senate votes. It by-passes the winner take all and hamstrings jerry mandering. Won't happen becuase doing that would restore an electoral voice to places like Up State NY, rural California and all of Illinois outside of Chicago. Given voters a voice isn't really whats behind the drive to nix the EC.

Third Party ballot harvesting is only legal in California and has already dubiously swung several elections there. Letting party activists collect votes or letting third parties handle ballots in general is a bad idea. It destroys integrity and opens the door for all sorts of mayhem.

Making Guam, PR and DC states is only a fad as a way to pack the senate. Especially DC where the concentration of money and power is already so concentrated that the area has more millionaires than even silicon valley.

They are all schemes that add up to an enabling act to establish 1 party rule by a party that has turned decidedly red.

[GVChamp]

The filibuster is already gone for appointments because it was so heavily abused, and reconciliation can be used to pass an annual budget to allow the government to operate business-as-usual.

[GVChamp]

I value this perspective. It gives me insight.

Biden isn't my politics but that doesnt mean you are wrong. Its a very difficult equation to solve for.

I would not take my perspective as the standard American perspective. Politics is extremely unhealthy in the US. People are paranoid, distrustful, uncharitable, and self-righteous. There's a long thread in my community forum started by a woman upset by her Trump signs getting ripped down with a majority of responses being "oh yeah, totally, screw Trump, and screw you too!" A smaller fraction are upset because their signs also have gotten torn down, and they see it as disrespectful, and then there's the "well, what can you do, there are idiots, and they like to tear up signs" group.

The GOP voters I know (and there are always some!) tend to just parrot whatever Fox News and talk radio have to say that day.

OK, so it's obvious you don't like female politicians.

But, what about the Democrats who are providing leadership this year? You know who I mean ...
Harria, Warren, and particularly Pelosi.

Forget their first names.
Forget their genders.

Look at what they've actually done.

I don't have an issue with Pelosi's leadership from a practical perspective. My point is that she is getting pushed out to make room for a gaggle of idiots, not that Pelosi is ineffective. I don't like her ideology or her brand of politics, but she strikes me as quite effective.

Harris ran an ineffective campaign that ultimately flamed out before the contest even started. She is possibly the biggest disappointment since the 2007 Patriots. Even Warren would be a better choice at VP, but there are a number of better VP options than Harris, even if you restrict yourself to just women. Her experience is as a State Attorney General with nothing of note in her Senate history, and her short foray into national politics saw her being outperformed by some random tech guy and an unpopular House representative from Hawaii.

Warren's problem is that she is extremely controversial and extremely Progressive and that she had to be elevated to vice-chair along with Warner shows the divisions in the party. Overall the Democrats are obviously in a transition stage with no clear idea of who should be in charge or what policies should be advanced going forward, with the only real unity right now being "Fuck Trump."

[tbm3fan]

"Fuck Trump" works for me. Right now that is the only thing on my mind is to get that moron so totally devoid of ethics, principles, morals, dignity, and honor out of that office. End of story.

[surfgun]

TBM, Intellectually eloquent.
Do you have any words for the violent and malicious anarchists raging in some cities that appear to be aligned with you politically?

[astralis]

z,

Packing the court is a way to bypass Congress, even FDR ultimately shied away from it.

he did, but only after he got an understanding from the judges to really take a good hard look at what to oppose...because opposition for opposition's sake would result in said packing.

right now, the Roberts court has done a pretty good job of not enflaming liberal opinion to the point where packing the court is a must do. as far as I'm concerned, it's a "nice to do", because of the stupid games that McConnell played with Garland...and it would be sweet revenge. but, for the time being it's not worth the flame of doing so.

The fillibuster is useful in slowing down government and preventing single party authoritarianism. It is a useful tool to force concensus. If the parties are so divided then the one who thinks its just such an important issue should go try and win an election. Ending the fillibuster is a way to disenfranchise voters once removed.

"forcing consensus" my @$$. when was the last time the filibuster -promoted- bipartisanship? when did the filibuster force the parties to come to a moderate consensus?

the filibuster was DESIGNED as an emergency mechanism to force consensus; then it became used as a cudgel against civil rights; and the modern day incarnation is that it's used on a routine basis to stop anything that doesn't have 60 votes, and in this hyper-polarized environment, that's almost never. it forces the US into a Polish Parliament situation where things turn into utter crises before any action can be taken.

i'd much, much rather see the filibuster destroyed and a later Republican Party using 50 votes to say, pass a capital gains tax cut. because if the people don't like it, they can vote that party out of power.

experimentation, instead of paralysis.

The EC protects minority voices. If you really wanted a fairer system then award EC votes based on who won the congressional district with popular vote winner getting the +2 senate votes. It by-passes the winner take all and hamstrings jerry mandering. Won't happen becuase doing that would restore an electoral voice to places like Up State NY, rural California and all of Illinois outside of Chicago. Given voters a voice isn't really whats behind the drive to nix the EC.

the EC is designed to protect small states, but in our environment where Party is king, it protects a certain party, not states. when was the last time anyone gave a damn about Hawaii, or Rhode Island, or Mississippi?

but, I'm not too concerned about the EC given current trends.

as I wrote earlier, North Carolina is 4 years behind Virginia and is on the cusp of flipping blue. Georgia 4 years behind that; Texas, another 4 years. once Texas goes, the GOP will be -desperate- to change the EC.

Third Party ballot harvesting is only legal in California and has already dubiously swung several elections there. Letting party activists collect votes or letting third parties handle ballots in general is a bad idea. It destroys integrity and opens the door for all sorts of mayhem.

uh, no, in 26 states, a third party collecting ballots is perfectly legal. and the few times where there's actually evidence of fraud...it's been on the GOP, like in North Carolina's 2018 elections.

again, though, this is not a "Democratic" or a "Republican" issue. like mail-in voting, the actual party gain is fairly even.

Making Guam, PR and DC states is only a fad as a way to pack the senate. Especially DC where the concentration of money and power is already so concentrated that the area has more millionaires than even silicon valley.

so what? taxation without representation still applies.

I certainly agree it would benefit the Dems, which is why I'm all for it.

but that's on the GOP. if the GOP refuses to even so much as compete for urban or minority votes, then they deserve what's coming to them.

there's absolutely no reason why the GOP cannot successfully compete in those three areas but for the fact that they refuse to change their own unpopular policies.

They are all schemes that add up to an enabling act to establish 1 party rule by a party that has turned decidedly red.

and REDMAP? and McConnell purposefully holding up confirmation of Obama judges so he could have an empty slate when a GOP President came in, what about that as well?

bottom-line is the GOP has been aggressive about using "hardball" political tactics that smash norms, because the GOP knows their popularity trendline is fundamentally going down. that's precisely why they called 2016 a "flight 93 election".

these things are terrible for a democratic society. I would much rather have Congress be able to negotiate instead of ramming through things on a party-line vote. however, there is NO incentive for the GOP to stop wrecking norms for political gain...until they get a nice big glass of reciprocity.