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The smug style in American liberalism

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  • The smug style in American liberalism

    As most of you here know well, I have very little use for the GOP and the hard conservative wing of this country. However ridiculous and stupid the things they might say, I have an even deeper disdain for the 'typical' American liberal. The reason for that isn't necessarily the positions they embrace.

    I was rather startled to come across an article on a deeply right-wing website Vox.com,

    It's a long article, very much worth reading, but summed up this way: "[Liberals have a] condescending, defensive sneer toward any person or movement outside of its consensus, dressed up as a monopoly on reason."

    The smug style in American liberalism
    Supporting or defending Donald Trump is such an unforgivable moral failing that it calls every bit of your judgement and character into question. Nothing about you should be trusted if you can look at this man and find redeemable value

  • #2
    it's a good article, albeit overly-long and tortured in writing.

    but hey look, I said the very same thing four years ago:

    http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/sho...l=1#post888286

    at its essence is simply the evolution of Democrats from a mixed populist party to a largely urban interest group coalition.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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    • #3
      Originally posted by astralis View Post
      it's a good article, albeit overly-long and tortured in writing.
      Agreed, as much as I was enjoying it, I started frowning when every push of the Page Down button revealed more and more article to be read...

      Originally posted by astralis View Post
      but hey look, I said the very same thing four years ago
      Indeed you did, and with the perfect counterpoint to conservatives:

      paranoia and conspiracy-theory is its counterpart with conservatives...
      Supporting or defending Donald Trump is such an unforgivable moral failing that it calls every bit of your judgement and character into question. Nothing about you should be trusted if you can look at this man and find redeemable value

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      • #4
        Let me sum it up for you: We're smart; you're dumb. Therefore freedom of speech applies as long as you agree with us.
        "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by gunnut View Post
          Let me sum it up for you: We're smart; you're dumb. Therefore freedom of speech applies as long as you agree with us.
          Perfect. Absolutely perfect. Also, "You're too stupid to wipe your own ass, the government should take care of you"
          Supporting or defending Donald Trump is such an unforgivable moral failing that it calls every bit of your judgement and character into question. Nothing about you should be trusted if you can look at this man and find redeemable value

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          • #6
            joe, come on, everyone knows that americans can't wipe their own ass right, they need to be more civilized and get one of those Japanese or European bidets...;-)

            on a somewhat less tongue in cheek note, Sanders supporters are really trying to win the Olympics of this, by showing they have got both smugness and conspiracy theory down. the only problem is, out-conspiracy theorying Trump supporters is an all but impossible feat...
            There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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            • #7
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              In the realm of spirit, seek clarity; in the material world, seek utility.

              Leibniz

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              • #8
                Originally posted by astralis View Post
                joe, come on, everyone knows that americans can't wipe their own ass right, they need to be more civilized and get one of those Japanese or European bidets...;-)
                Which, by the way, I am totally in favor of. Damn that attitude that it's European foppery :(

                Originally posted by astralis View Post
                on a somewhat less tongue in cheek note, Sanders supporters are really trying to win the Olympics of this, by showing they have got both smugness and conspiracy theory down. the only problem is, out-conspiracy theorying Trump supporters is an all but impossible feat...
                Poor Bernie supporters. I bet they feel like Hillary's supporters back in 2008 when they realized the DNC had long since chosen Obama and were tossing Clinton out with the bathwater.
                Supporting or defending Donald Trump is such an unforgivable moral failing that it calls every bit of your judgement and character into question. Nothing about you should be trusted if you can look at this man and find redeemable value

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                • #9
                  I have heard people in the real world describe people as "voting against their own interests", when it came to Obamacare..
                  To sit down with these men and deal with them as the representatives of an enlightened and civilized people is to deride ones own dignity and to invite the disaster of their treachery - General Matthew Ridgway

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                  • #10
                    Lol, well, definitely true. At least for a certain brand of liberal. You're talking a relatively small part of the overall nation, though. Think the "Mad Men" and "Downtown Abbey" crowd.

                    They have a disproportionate voice. Fortunately, out of the political zealots you can get, they're pretty tame. Overall, they're value-add, too, even if they are freakin' crazy in some aspects.
                    "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by GVChamp View Post
                      Lol, well, definitely true. At least for a certain brand of liberal. You're talking a relatively small part of the overall nation, though. Think the "Mad Men" and "Downtown Abbey" crowd.
                      Hey, I happen to think both series perfectly good TV dramas. That said just because I watch them doesn't mean I want to bureaucratize 'wiping of asses' on a national basis. I'm perfectly willing to leave everyone's backsides in there own hands - so to speak.
                      If you are emotionally invested in 'believing' something is true you have lost the ability to tell if it is true.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Monash View Post
                        Hey, I happen to think both series perfectly good TV dramas. That said just because I watch them doesn't mean I want to bureaucratize 'wiping of asses' on a national basis. I'm perfectly willing to leave everyone's backsides in there own hands - so to speak.
                        Don't worry, I'm part of that demographic cohort, too. Not EVERYONE in our group is an asshole.
                        "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by astralis View Post
                          on a somewhat less tongue in cheek note, Sanders supporters are really trying to win the Olympics of this, by showing they have got both smugness and conspiracy theory down. the only problem is, out-conspiracy theorying Trump supporters is an all but impossible feat...
                          Most of the Sanders supporters I encounter online or in person are some shade of insufferable. There's this 'I want it so it has to happen NOW' attitude that comes across like an over educated 10 year old. This impression is reinforced by the fact that they clearly just discovered how primaries work and they are outraged that the process doesn't just make their wishes come true because they say so. ITS A CONSPIRACY!!!!! As they have just realised that Bernie can't win (the grownups twigged after Super Tuesday) the online tantrums are starting up. I'm sort of enjoying it. ;-)

                          On the OP, I haven't read the article for the simple reason that I've been observing this phenomenon close up for a fair chunk of my life. The article would just depress me. It sounds like the folk we are talking about are what I refer to as the 'activist left' or in my nastier moods 'Chomskybots' ('activist' is really an attitudinal description, as few of them ever do more than take STRONG positions). Having spent a fair bit of time around University campuses & ten years as treasurer of a Communist cricket club (apparently we were the Maoists, having split from the Trotskyists a decade before I joined) I know whereof I speak. Until my mid-20s I was even of them, then I got serious about history and realised how poorly based their worldview was. Don't get me started on Chomsky, I start ranting like a drunk Tea Party member watching an Obama speech. Some of these folk are even friends of mine'. Lovely folk, but irritating at times.

                          From my POV these folk are the left wing equivalent of the sort of conservatives TH hates. They get all hopped up with righteous indignation about their given issue & then decide that the world needs to do what they want it to. They spend most of their time in a closed informational loop and tend to chain their intellectual faculties (such as they are) to defending their prejudices rather than challenging them.

                          This would matter less to me if we didn't share some of the same causes - only some. These clowns are so obsessed with being right that they actually resent the people who are more interested in getting results. As Hillary commented, it is easier to describe a problem than it is to solve it. Because cheap propaganda, sloganeering and posturing are WAY more fun than doing shit, people like this are the ones who get all the attention. As a result ideas I think are important get represented by lying pieces of shit like Chomsky or third rate Goebbels wannabes like Michael Moore & John Pilger along with an army of smug, self righteous fanbois. If I was trying to discredit those ideas I couldn't think of a better way to do it.

                          Dickheads.
                          sigpic

                          Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by troung View Post
                            I have heard people in the real world describe people as "voting against their own interests", when it came to Obamacare..
                            You get the same whenever conservatives are asked to explain why non-whites don't vote GOP - some combination of 'they are stupid and/or lazy'. The possibility that people may have perfectly good reasons that they are happy with doesn't seem to occour.
                            sigpic

                            Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Bigfella View Post


                              From my POV these folk are the left wing equivalent of the sort of conservatives TH hates. They get all hopped up with righteous indignation about their given issue & then decide that the world needs to do what they want it to. They spend most of their time in a closed informational loop and tend to chain their intellectual faculties (such as they are) to defending their prejudices rather than challenging them.
                              Yep, that seems to be the best analogy. This particular malady is not left-specific. I don't run across too many of those: I live in a Democratic bubble, so the few Republicans I run across are well aware of the Democratic POV and have at least SOME respect for it.

                              But at a national level, there seem to be plenty of....well...crazies. So I know damn well they're out there.



                              Some additional thoughts:
                              http://fredrikdeboer.com/2016/04/21/...eral-smugness/
                              Last edited by GVChamp; 23 Apr 16,, 15:44.
                              "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

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