Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Double standards by US.US firm found guilty of underpaying Indians at $1.22 an hour.

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #61
    Originally posted by Bigfella View Post
    Blademaster's Law: As an online discussion involving BigFella grows longer, the probability of a racist comment about non-white people or racist epithet directed at a non-white person approaches 1 —​ that is, if an online discussion involving BigFella(regardless of topic or scope) goes on long enough, sooner or later he will slip in a racist comment about non-white folk or racially abuse a board member. Once such a reference is made BigFella is deemed to have lost the argument.

    Always a matter of when, not if.
    Fixed it for you.

    Comment


    • #62
      :pop:
      "Draft beer, not people."

      Comment


      • #63
        Originally posted by Red Team View Post
        :pop:

        It's the same shit GIGO.

        Not even worthy of a popcorn emoticon anymore.

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by commander View Post
          1. Yes she was and it was still contended by the US authorities, about it's technicality on her being a grade below or whatever.
          No Z is right on this. At the time she was apprehended she had no immunity. So she had to be promoted post facto to get off the charge.

          Anyway, this is all water under the bridge, old news.

          What is going on with the main topic of the thread ? that seems to have been forgotten.

          No mention in my daily about this affair yet btw.
          Last edited by Double Edge; 28 Oct 14,, 18:03.

          Comment


          • #65
            The premise of this thread is ridiculous.

            In one case you had a woman hiding all over town and claiming to the authorities that her employer kept her in slave like conditions. In the second case you had civil regulators discovering after the fact that some workers who were here for a short period to help with an office move were underpaid.

            Had any of those workers in the later case did what the woman in the DK case did, that is, "escape" from the employers, hid all over town and claimed to the local authorities that he/she and compatriots were being kept in "slave like conditions", the local police might have mounted a SWAT raid on the office and arrested everyone there. If that had happened, BM would be writing a thread about how the outrageous treatment of Indians continue with police harassment of businesses employing Indian workers.

            Let's review. DK case: woman "escapes" from her employer and claimed that she was enslaved. Criminal authorities got involved. Criminal charges were filed. EFI case: civil regulators discovered underpayment through an anonymous tip. No claims of slavery from any party involved. No dramatic escapes real or feigned. Workers involved already back in India. No criminal charges filed.

            And we wasted 5 pages of posts on this....
            Last edited by citanon; 28 Oct 14,, 18:22.

            Comment


            • #66
              Originally posted by Double Edge View Post
              No Z is right on this. At the time she was apprehended she had no immunity. So she had to be promoted post facto to get off the charge.

              Well, this thread is all about splitting hairs so...

              Khobragade was a consular which could be technically called a diplomat but she did not enjoy full diplomatic immunity.

              It was only after the fact of the arrest (as you stated) that the Indian govt. requested her status be changed to UN Mission, WHICH THE U.S., AS THE HOST NATION, APPROVED, in order for her to be granted full immunity.

              So technically Khobragade was a diplomat (albeit a low level one with only consulate immunity).

              The charges against her were dropped because she enjoy diplomatic immunity AT THE TIME OF THE INDICTMENT.

              Although I have no idea why or how the charges were reinstated afterwards.

              Most likely to make sure she doesn't re-enter the country again with full immunity?
              Last edited by YellowFever; 28 Oct 14,, 18:30. Reason: Horrible spelling

              Comment


              • #67
                Blademaster,
                I think it would be a really good idea if I cleared the air and set all my cards on the table. So here it is:

                I don't question your loyalty or your patriotism. I never have, and neither was it ever my intention to do so implicitly. However you clearly believe that I have, so for that I do apologize.

                I do not and have never asked or expected you to stay silent on anything regarding the national events of any country. Nor have I ever, explicitly or implicitly, wanted you to "go along with whatever the US says and accept the position of the US" nor play the part of a pro-US cheerleader. That brand of blind herd-like ultra-nationalist mentality is utterly abhorrent to me personally and the thought of expecting or demanding it from somebody else is repugnant. If I have given you that perception as well, then I am again very sorry.

                I do not view the United States or it's foreign or domestic policies through rose-colored glasses. I never have.
                I will be the very first to say that the United States can and has made a mockery of its own democratic principles with its actions, at home and abroad.

                Regarding criticism or news reports of embarrassing events in India, it has been my own personal observation that your go-to response has typically been to highlight similar problems in the West, particularly the United States. In effect, a "you too" reply. In future I will avoid replying to your similar posts as we clearly have extremely divergent opinions on this and no good can come from publicly attacking each others motives and intentions.

                That's all I have.
                Supporting or defending Donald Trump is such an unforgivable moral failing that it calls every bit of your judgement and character into question. Nothing about you should be trusted if you can look at this man and find redeemable value

                Comment


                • #68
                  Replying to you in PM. This is my last post on this.

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Pretty disappointing set of posts here

                    Originally posted by TopHatter View Post
                    If I thought for one second that was Blademaster's motivation for these threads, I'd say you have a point. But because it's blindingly obvious what his motivation is, I'd say you don't.

                    News reports posts here in threads that demonstrate systemic and highly embarrassing problems with India are a festering source of rage to him. As I said before, it practically pours out of him like steam from a teakettle.
                    He can't dismiss those posts as false propaganda so he has to resort to Tu Quoque retorts, attacking Western countries when similarly embarrassing examples pop up in there as well.

                    Otherwise known as the "And You Are Lynching Negroes" defense.
                    I know very well what BM's intentions are. I do not subscribe to his views most of the time and am not well known about my
                    "hatred for the West, personified in the United States and to a lesser extent Great Britain (bonus points for Commonwealth countries)"
                    However, does that lessen his point? What is true, is true, be it in India or the US.

                    It is also highly disappointing (and disgusting) to see some of the respected member of the forum make is a white skin vs. brown skin issue.

                    On the other hand, I am surprised at Blade's surprise that there is: UNDERPAYMENT ISSUES IN THE USA

                    One only has to go to the Home Depot parking lots; the guys standing there are not being paid minimum wage. I have little sympathy for Khobragade, her maid or the guys in Blade's article. Its capitalism. Everyone knew what they were going to get paid, or were going to pay and went ahead with their actions anyway. In this particular case, I suspect there is some visa fraud going on.

                    The workers were being paid in India Rupees. That probably means that they were being paid their salaries back in India and an allowance in the US. However, people brought in Business visas are NOT allowed to work, so there may be a clear violation of visa rules here rather than underpayment.
                    "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" ~ Epicurus

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Originally posted by antimony View Post

                      On the other hand, I am surprised at Blade's surprise that there is: UNDERPAYMENT ISSUES IN THE USA
                      I am not surprised that there is underpayment issues. You mistake and mischaracterize my objection to double standards as surprise that there is underpayment issues. I deal with them on a monthly basis.

                      One only has to go to the Home Depot parking lots; the guys standing there are not being paid minimum wage. I have little sympathy for Khobragade, her maid or the guys in Blade's article. Its capitalism. Everyone knew what they were going to get paid, or were going to pay and went ahead with their actions anyway. In this particular case, I suspect there is some visa fraud going on.
                      See the highlighted bold part. That was the part that got DK arrested. Why were the EFI executives not arrested? That is what I am referring to and my main point. If there was visa fraud going on, I would like to see the EFI executives be subjected to the same treatment that DK got.

                      The workers were being paid in India Rupees. That probably means that they were being paid their salaries back in India and an allowance in the US. However, people brought in Business visas are NOT allowed to work, so there may be a clear violation of visa rules here rather than underpayment.
                      Then where are the indictment charges as it has been done in the DK case? Where are the arrest warrants as it has been done in the DK case?

                      One of the biggest points that was made in the DK case was that US authorities would have done the same for anybody else. Now comes the proof in the pudding. Here we got a company with executives engaging in visa fraud as you have alluded to and the only treatment we have seen is no indictment charges, no arrest warrants for visa fraud, only slaps of fines and monetary damages.

                      And by the way, I neither subscribe to most of your views but that goes without saying.
                      Last edited by Blademaster; 28 Oct 14,, 19:41.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Originally posted by Blademaster View Post
                        I am not surprised that there is underpayment issues. You mistake and mischaracterize my objection to double standards as surprise that there is underpayment issues. I deal with them on a monthly basis.



                        See the highlighted bold part. That was the part that got DK arrested. Why were the EFI executives not arrested? That is what I am referring to and my main point. If there was visa fraud going on, I would like to see the EFI executives be subjected to the same treatment that DK got.


                        Then where are the indictment charges as it has been done in the DK case? Where are the arrest warrants as it has been done in the DK case?

                        One of the biggest points that was made in the DK case was that US authorities would have done the same for anybody else. Now comes the proof in the pudding. Here we got a company with executives engaging in visa fraud as you have alluded to and the only treatment we have seen is no indictment charges, no arrest warrants for visa fraud, only slaps of fines and monetary damages.

                        And by the way, I neither subscribe to most of your views but that goes without saying.
                        I'm not in position to cite US Law, but I would have expected that Visa Fraud charges can only be directly applied to the passport/visa holder

                        anyone else involved in promoting that activity would need to be prosecuted and pursued at the country where that activity was initiated, at some point there would be persons at the arrival/delivery end who could be gathered up under the umbrella of being accessories etc.....
                        Linkeden:
                        http://au.linkedin.com/pub/gary-fairlie/1/28a/2a2
                        http://cofda.wordpress.com/

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Originally posted by citanon View Post
                          The premise of this thread is ridiculous.

                          In one case you had a woman hiding all over town and claiming to the authorities that her employer kept her in slave like conditions. In the second case you had civil regulators discovering after the fact that some workers who were here for a short period to help with an office move were underpaid.

                          Had any of those workers in the later case did what the woman in the DK case did, that is, "escape" from the employers, hid all over town and claimed to the local authorities that he/she and compatriots were being kept in "slave like conditions", the local police might have mounted a SWAT raid on the office and arrested everyone there. If that had happened, BM would be writing a thread about how the outrageous treatment of Indians continue with police harassment of businesses employing Indian workers.

                          Let's review. DK case: woman "escapes" from her employer and claimed that she was enslaved. Criminal authorities got involved. Criminal charges were filed. EFI case: civil regulators discovered underpayment through an anonymous tip. No claims of slavery from any party involved. No dramatic escapes real or feigned. Workers involved already back in India. No criminal charges filed.

                          And we wasted 5 pages of posts on this....
                          Well not to drag this further, here are the similarities in both the cases and that's not,

                          DK:

                          1. Domestic help hired in India with an agreement that salary will be paid in Indian rupees (whatever the sum maybe) + accommodation + food + her regular week off's.
                          2. The maid understood she was being ripped off after getting to know the minimum wage and the technicality that if a domestic worker is hired for one's house that doesn't come under Indian jurisdiction rather US laws are applicable, so the contract she had with DK in India is not applicable.
                          3. The maid filed a case on DK with the help of PB the prosecutor and with his help deports her entire family from India to the US.
                          4. Charges are on the basis of the visa fraud and some here even accused that of being a human trafficking. Fair enough.
                          5. US authorities contended even though she is a consular her immunity doesn't apply outside the consulate (?)
                          6. She gets arrested in public and a strip search and allegedly cavity search was carried out.

                          EFI:

                          1.The firm hired a few Indian professionals with an agreement made in India that promised them a certain salary in rupees + allowances to take care of their accommodation and food.
                          2. The employees understood they are being ripped off and one of them complains to the authorities.
                          3. The authorities slap charges against the company and it's directors and were asked to pay a fine and were let go.


                          THIS is what we were complaining about. Why is one more serious than the other ?

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Originally posted by Double Edge View Post
                            No Z is right on this. At the time she was apprehended she had no immunity. So she had to be promoted post facto to get off the charge.

                            Anyway, this is all water under the bridge, old news.

                            What is going on with the main topic of the thread ? that seems to have been forgotten.

                            No mention in my daily about this affair yet btw.
                            No she was considered a junior consulate which according to the US authorities is not enough to provide her immunity. But India was contending that she was a consulate no matter what position she was in and is automatically eligible for immunity. When the US didn't budge we promoted her to a UN mission which by default provided her the immunity the US authorities said she didn't have and they had to let her go. There was misunderstanding on both sides on this part on who was right.

                            Probably was deliberately clogged or just wasn't juicy enough for the daily's ;)

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Originally posted by gf0012-aust View Post
                              I'm not in position to cite US Law, but I would have expected that Visa Fraud charges can only be directly applied to the passport/visa holder

                              anyone else involved in promoting that activity would need to be prosecuted and pursued at the country where that activity was initiated, at some point there would be persons at the arrival/delivery end who could be gathered up under the umbrella of being accessories etc.....
                              If that was so, then DK could not have been charged or arrested. She was not the visa holder or passport holder. The maid was.

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Originally posted by commander View Post
                                EFI:

                                1.The firm hired a few Indian professionals with an agreement made in India that promised them a certain salary in rupees + allowances to take care of their accommodation and food.
                                2. The employees understood they are being ripped off and one of them complains to the authorities.
                                3. The authorities slap charges against the company and it's directors and were asked to pay a fine and were let go.
                                This part is not correct. The Indian professionals were already working for EFI in India. They were tasked with a project that had some dealings within the US. They were not hired specifically for this project.

                                Just because I was tasked to the US does not mean I get paid in US wages
                                Chimo

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X