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  • Originally posted by astralis View Post
    JAD,



    oh, i know. it was not for nothing that mitt romney picked paul ryan for his VP. such a platform would be as revolutionary, if not more so, than the ACA. and my guess is that it would be substantially more unpopular.
    We shouldn't forget that not everyone has to like it. Just a majority.


    consider how unpopular the ACA has been even when majorities agree with its precepts
    .

    We all agree with certain precepts; it's the methodology that's unpopular.


    that would not be the same for revolutionizing medicare or SS; republican ideas for turning medicare into a voucher system and privatizing SS have been deeply unpopular, to say the least.
    Neither will be privatized IMO. Too many Tea Party members believe Medicare and SS are earned entitlements, and really don't want to mess with either, although they'll probably support means testing and revamping the CPI, and possibly raising FICA payments.



    it's quite possible that the establishment get some semblance of control, which in fact it's busy trying to do now. note how quiet Ted Cruz has been lately, or how the Republicans aren't champing at the bit for another round of government shutdown.

    (The thread I started on the GOP 'demise' is a better place to discuss this. So, I'll keep my replies to a minimum.)

    Cruz control. :) After he encouraged a couple of big name conservative PACs to attack his fellow senate conservative while he was filibustering, he was handed his head. Since then he's been mending fences. He's learning you can't have big ambitions and alienate your fellow Senate conservatives.

    No one wants another shutdown. Ryan and his Senate counterpart are making progress toward a compromise to avoid one and clear the way for raising the debt ceiling.


    yes, tactical in nature, but this combined with what some business groups are doing to eliminate the crazier ones, will cause some moderation.


    Part of the reason the Tea Party isn't getting its message out, is just what you say. Some of the Tea Party members in Congress sound a little nuts. If the Tea Party wants to have a referendum on its vision, it has to tone down them down.

    you simply can't negotiate if the other side doesn't have the authority or the discipline to impose that compromise.
    Bring back earmarks.:) But these guys are impervious to goodies. Without some carrot to entice them, the leadership has little to enforce discipline over them.


    the tide is not moving right in the electorate as a whole any more, but rather in the GOP...and even there i think we're bumping against the limits. but we've discussed this issue at length before.

    The tide has no where to go but right. The party will follow. For the Tea Party philosophy to make progress, the specter of increasing deficits and a growing debt has to loom large.

    The ACA will be impacted by a GOP hat trick, but I don't think it will ever be entirely scrapped. Everyone likes some parts of it.

    i think it's important to point out that the ACA will increase costs in some areas while lowering costs in others. over the long-term i expect the ACA to reduce overall healthcare spending as we saw in the case of switzerland.
    None of that really matter to conservatives. To them the ACA is an existential threat to the Constitution and their freedom. So, they're not going away.

    Switzerland? Didn't once tell me it's not a good example of the ACA?
    To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

    Comment


    • Originally posted by JAD_333 View Post

      Neither will be privatized IMO. Too many Tea Party members believe Medicare and SS are earned entitlements, and really don't want to mess with either, although they'll probably support means testing and revamping the CPI, and possibly raising FICA payments.
      Arkansas just privatized medicaid...

      Comment


      • Originally posted by JAD_333 View Post
        Come on. At least push the button to see what it is all about. :)
        Already did. As per my wife's insurance our deductibles would go up a small amount but out of pocket premiums would actually be lower as we are not smokers. After crunching the numbers against my wife's insurance I didn't bother comparing mine.
        Removing a single turd from the cesspool doesn't make any difference.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by bonehead View Post
          Already did. As per my wife's insurance our deductibles would go up a small amount but out of pocket premiums would actually be lower as we are not smokers. After crunching the numbers against my wife's insurance I didn't bother comparing mine.
          BH...lol...it wasn't a real portal...it's a joke. Push the big green button and see what happens.
          To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

          Comment


          • Alas I looked into the real thing. Whomever goes to your link must have the fastest mouse in the west or they are SOL.
            Removing a single turd from the cesspool doesn't make any difference.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by zraver View Post
              Arkansas just privatized medicaid...
              Z, I looked into it a bit and it seems to be just a proposal at this point. What they are proposing is not strictly 'privatization' but rather the use of Medicaid funds to buy insurance over the ACA exchange for Medicaid-eligible people. Under ACA, according to the article below, a person can't participate in both the exchange AND Medicaid. The proposal seems rather clever on the face of it.

              IdahoReporter.com
              To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

              Comment


              • Originally posted by JAD_333 View Post
                Z, I looked into it a bit and it seems to be just a proposal at this point. What they are proposing is not strictly 'privatization' but rather the use of Medicaid funds to buy insurance over the ACA exchange for Medicaid-eligible people. Under ACA, according to the article below, a person can't participate in both the exchange AND Medicaid. The proposal seems rather clever on the face of it.

                IdahoReporter.com
                Not a proposal, signed into law after getting a federal waiver.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by zraver View Post
                  Not a proposal, signed into law after getting a federal waiver.
                  Got my states wrong. U.S. clears Arkansas Medicaid expansion proposal | Reuters
                  To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

                  Comment


                  • looks like the ACA is here to stay. no death spiral, and an amazing comeback since the debacle a few months back. the numbers would have been higher yet if not for certain governors doing their hardest to retard (in every sense of the word) implementation.

                    ====

                    Enrollments Exceed Obama’s Target for Health Care Act

                    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/18/us...e-targets.html

                    WASHINGTON — President Obama announced Thursday that eight million people have signed up for health insurance under the Affordable Care Act, including what the White House said were a sufficient number of young, healthy adults, a critical milestone that might counter election-year attacks by Republicans on the law’s success and viability.

                    The total number of enrollees exceeds by a million the target set by the administration for people to buy insurance through government-run health care exchanges. In particular, the number of young people signing up appears to have surged during the final weeks of enrollment.

                    “This thing is working,” Mr. Obama told reporters in the White House briefing room, in what amounted to a second victory lap after he announced two weeks ago that 7.1 million people had signed up for insurance during an initial enrollment period. “The Affordable Care Act is covering more people at less cost than most people would have predicted a few months ago.”

                    Still, critics of the law cautioned that promising top-line numbers were not by themselves proof of success.

                    Kathy Santana helped Ruben Torres, 27, during a health care enrollment event on March 31 in Commerce, Calif.Credit Ringo H.W. Chiu/Associated Press
                    Although more young people signed up for health insurance, for example, the number remained below the level that some analysts believe is optimal for keeping premiums low in the insurance marketplaces. The administration said Thursday that 28 percent of those who bought policies were between the ages of 18 and 34, but some analysts said the optimum level would be 40 percent.

                    “In an ideal world, you’d want to get as close to that as possible,” said Larry Levitt, a senior vice president at the Kaiser Family Foundation. “But what is important is what the insurance companies expected, and this is what they expected.”

                    The administration did not release two other crucial statistics that would help determine the success of the law: the number of people among the eight million who bought insurance for the first time and the number who paid their initial premiums.

                    The number of those who were previously uninsured is important, since many people could simply have been moved from plans that were canceled by the law. Administration officials have promised to release that information when they have it, but they have said it is not data that is collected by the government.

                    Administration officials have said previously that they could not tell how many people have paid premiums because those payments are between individuals and their insurance companies. In February, however, industry experts and insurance companies said that one in five people who signed up failed to pay their premiums on time and therefore did not receive coverage when it began in January.

                    Mr. Obama nonetheless seized on the numbers to make his case that the law is a success and to challenge his opponents to drop their opposition to it. “I find it strange that the Republican position on this law is still stuck,” the president said. “They still can’t bring themselves to admit that the Affordable Care Act is working.”

                    Mr. Obama’s remarks came a week after he announced the resignation of Kathleen Sebelius, his health and human services secretary, at an orchestrated White House event that sought to put a positive light on a tenure marred by the disastrous rollout of the HealthCare.gov website that Ms. Sebelius oversaw last year. On Thursday, Mr. Obama focused his remarks on the future.

                    “We’ve got a sizable part of the U.S. population, for the first time, that are in a position to enjoy the financial security of health insurance,” the president said.

                    Mr. Obama spoke after meeting with state insurance commissioners at the White House, where he shared some of the new enrollment numbers and demographic data.

                    In the early months of signups, the number of young people between the ages of 18 and 34 — who tend to be healthier — hovered around 25 percent. But as White House officials predicted, many young people appear to have waited until close to the March 31 deadline to enroll, increasing their participation. The administration had offered a grace period until Tuesday to accommodate people who had begun, but not completed, the signup process by a deadline of March 31.

                    Health experts have long warned that the state-by-state, competitive insurance marketplaces set up by the law could be severely undermined if the pool of customers who signed up were mostly sick or elderly. In such a case, premiums could spike, and insurance companies might choose to abandon the federal marketplaces entirely.

                    The overall percentage of young people enrolled is not a guarantee that all of the insurance marketplaces across the country will work perfectly. Individual insurance companies will make decisions about what their premiums are based on the makeup of their own client list.

                    But the higher proportion of young enrollees is a rebuke to the critics of the Affordable Care Act, who had predicted that it would fail to attract younger, healthier customers to buy insurance.

                    In the months ahead, insurance companies will assess the age and health of their customers as a way of determining their premiums for next year. Mr. Obama said he expected premiums would probably increase, as they have annually for many years.

                    But White House officials insisted that the overall cost of health care is rising more slowly than previous estimates by the Congressional Budget Office. And they said that the higher proportion of young people who have enrolled is likely to keep many premiums lower than they would otherwise have been.

                    “Health care spending has risen more slowly than at any time in the last 40 years,” Mr. Obama said.

                    In recent weeks, as the enrollment numbers improved from the difficult start last fall, Mr. Obama and his aides have become more aggressive in their efforts to promote moments in the law’s success.

                    By having Mr. Obama be the first person in the administration to announce the latest enrollment numbers — in previous months, that task often went to Ms. Sebelius — administration officials signaled their willingness to more directly engage Republican critics on a by-the-numbers assessment of the law.

                    In addition to the enrollment figures, officials on Thursday cited other statistics that they said proved the law was working. They said 129 million Americans with pre-existing health conditions, including 17 million children, were no longer in danger of losing health coverage or having premiums rise drastically.

                    They also said that 105 million people did not have to worry about reaching a lifetime cap on insurance benefits, something that was made illegal under the health law. And they said that eight million older Americans have saved $10 billion because of lower prescription drug costs under the law.

                    Republicans dismissed the president’s announcements, saying they were a misleading attempt to make the health law look rosier than it is. Brendan Buck, a spokesman for House Speaker John A. Boehner, said the White House was continuing to “obscure the full impact of Obamacare.”
                    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

                    Comment


                    • of course what i find really funny is how this should have been a crowning achievement for the likes of Heritage Foundation and Newt Gingrich and Mitt Romney, and now...
                      There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

                      Comment


                      • Megan McArdle begs to differ
                        Is Obama Cooking the Census Books for Obamacare? - Bloomberg View
                        In the realm of spirit, seek clarity; in the material world, seek utility.

                        Leibniz

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                        • Attached Files
                          Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.

                          Abusing Yellow is meant to be a labor of love, not something you sell to the highest bidder.

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                          • pari,

                            Megan McArdle begs to differ
                            private calculations come to the same result:

                            ACASignups.net | Tracking Enrollments for the Affordable Care Act (aka Obamacare)

                            and note that she's not "begging to differ", all she is doing is insinuating that perhaps the Census Bureau is up to something, but she can't prove what, but man that sounds suspicious and all...perhaps at every level, man...
                            There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

                            Comment


                            • Astralis,

                              That's because EVERYONE knows we gummint beee-ooorokrats take ALL our marching orders from our political overlords!!!!!!
                              “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
                              Mark Twain

                              Comment


                              • Asty:

                                Obama's mission accomplished statement reminds me of Bush's after the initial stage of the Iraq war. Big problems still lurk in the shadows.

                                This smacks of political theater to counter the GOP's biggest issue going into the fall congressional elections. Eight million signups is good on the face of it, but the ultimate success of Obamacare is far from known.

                                There are minefields yet to be overcome. A few were mentioned in the Wash Post article you posted.

                                Will people who sign up for Obamacare be reliable premium payers? So far, it appears 20% are not.

                                Administration officials have said previously that they could not tell how many people have paid premiums because those payments are between individuals and their insurance companies. In February, however, industry experts and insurance companies said that one in five people who signed up failed to pay their premiums on time and therefore did not receive coverage when it began in January.

                                Did all the people who signed up need Obamacare, or were they previoulsy insured people looking for lower rates?

                                The administration did not release two other crucial statistics that would help determine the success of the law: the number of people among the eight million who bought insurance for the first time and the number who paid their initial premiums.

                                Data that is positive is always available. Data that might be negative is not.

                                The number of those who were previously uninsured is important, since many people could simply have been moved from plans that were canceled by the law. Administration officials have promised to release that information when they have it, but they have said it is not data that is collected by the government.

                                Is claiming mission accomplished premature? In view of a key statistic, it may be.

                                Although more young people signed up for health insurance, for example, the number remained below the level that some analysts believe is optimal for keeping premiums low in the insurance marketplaces. The administration said Thursday that 28 percent of those who bought policies were between the ages of 18 and 34, but some analysts said the optimum level would be 40 percent.
                                To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

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