IRS investigation for Conservative Targeting

[cyppok]

Error | C-SPAN

Washington, DC
Friday, May 17, 2013

The House Ways and Means Committee holds the first Congressional hearing on the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) subjecting applicants for tax-exempt status to higher levels of scrutiny based on political leanings.

Slowly it is hitting the fan in the proper way. I've been watching it for a few hours it seems there is something coming down the pipe. My guess is the pro-publica crackdown by IRS is going to demolish some parts of the agency.

My guess there is going to be a build up of support to change things. Political meddling is the turf of parties and IRS overstepped the boundary between enforcement and framing the debate which is congressional prerogative. Very similar to a secretary trying to usurp their bosses duties.

All of this will have significant blowback in the next elections. There will be push-back it seems.

[zraver]

Error | C-SPAN

Slowly it is hitting the fan in the proper way. I've been watching it for a few hours it seems there is something coming down the pipe. My guess is the pro-publica crackdown by IRS is going to demolish some parts of the agency.

My guess there is going to be a build up of support to change things. Political meddling is the turf of parties and IRS overstepped the boundary between enforcement and framing the debate which is congressional prerogative. Very similar to a secretary trying to usurp their bosses duties.

All of this will have significant blowback in the next elections. There will be push-back it seems.

Doubt it, seriously doubt it. The IRS has 106,000 employees, they overwhelmingly vote democrat and are dues paying union members. There will be some gnashing of teeth in Congress, some chit chat about reform but anything that makes it out of the house will be swept under the rug by Reid and his bully boys in the senate.

[cyppok]

Doubt it, seriously doubt it. The IRS has 106,000 employees, they overwhelmingly vote democrat and are dues paying union members. There will be some gnashing of teeth in Congress, some chit chat about reform but anything that makes it out of the house will be swept under the rug by Reid and his bully boys in the senate.

Apparently you are under the assumption that Congress does not control the legislation/budget the IRS operates under. You ignore the very simple act of de-funding the IRS and the House and even the Senate will do that.

I again repeat what I mentioned above. This is not a partisan matter, the IRS overstepped the bounds it operates under. They tried to control the distribution of monetary backing for the legislators. Today it is republicans tomorrow it is democrats. Like I said secretary tried to decide for their boss how things are played.

What seems unlikely very often times gets changed by things we perceive as minor. Once the change gets going the outcome will be interesting. You are under the assumption that people and corporations HAVE TO pay taxes and they cannot escape them. They can give the gov't the finger by non-participating OR offshoring both legally and illegally. The stupidity of trying to force things is what is happening in Argentina right now...

We are 1 year from interrim elections...

What stood out to me was that there was a debate on "legal" vs "inappropriate" to downplay this and the flip-side was sapina of documents and interactions, because they can go for the hunt into Treasury and gut the chain of command through responsibility abrogation if it was incompetent. But if someone actually directed the "separate" treatment it becomes impeachable and legality becomes written by the congressmen.

my favorite part is around 1:50
"do you think congress has the right to know all the information that you knew?"
he basically says no by non-responding, yes or no.

[zraver]

Just watch, nothing will change.

[cyppok]

Just watch, nothing will change.

Politicians are generally re-elected, there are swings from one party to the other though.
The IRS attacked political(money) base the most connected people whom bought and paid for this government.
These people have long memories and change their political colors as it suits them like Bloomberg and a few others.

Even Democrats realize they have to retaliate in this instance, its an agency biting the Congressional hand that feeds it.
Also elections coming up and the one after that will be in-play as well.

I think it will change within the next three years. (yes long time but not so long in grand scheme of things)

[Mandala]

Was anything illegal done? I do not think political organizations should be tax exempt.

[cyppok]

Was anything illegal done? I do not think political organizations should be tax exempt.

Yes, augmenting the process to be biased based on political leanings.
Ergo political prosecution due to ideology.

If they are all should be treated same if they aren't same thing.

The problem is that this is a selective aspect if in the future it goes downstream for people being audited based on their belief on one particular issue at some point you may get severe backlash in ways you never realized you could. Ergo complete breakdown of compliance culture as it relates to all the fees/taxes etc. that are adhered to today. In some ways there have been aspects as it relates to companies in one industry which have donated to one party and not the other being under investigation while their competitors getting subsidy or no scrutiny whats so ever.

[Chogy]

Sadly, I have to agree with Z.

In the last few months, there have been some horrendous events that (in the past, at least) would be labeled as severe scandals, and pursued with vigor. Today, under this administration, the news is muted, deflected, ignored, and the righteous anger goes nowhere.

[astralis]

chogy,

i don't know about "in the past"-- i mean, republicans are calling them severe scandals now. :)

but it's not really sticking because none of it reaches the WH level. plus, re: the NSA scandal, the republicans are divided as to whether this is actually a scandal or not.

so politically, while it seems more serious than, say, Whitewater, it doesn't even have that effect, let alone the effects of something like the Iran-Contra scandal or (dare I say it), Watergate.

[tbm3fan]

May have to update this thread a little to: IRS targets conservative and liberal groups both

Documents show IRS also screened liberal groups - SFGate

[Bigfella]

May have to update this thread a little to: IRS targets conservative and liberal groups both

Documents show IRS also screened liberal groups - SFGate

This should be fun to watch.

[Julie]

I just like seeing all the "untouchables" under the microscope...:pop:

[DOR]

May have to update this thread a little to: IRS targets conservative and liberal groups both

Documents show IRS also screened liberal groups - SFGate

That was part of the original report, and the only ones that were caught using an inappropriate tax status were "blue" PACs.

I wonder what the GOPers will dig up for the next scandal, when this one fades away. . . doesn't really matter, I guess, as long as they can keep from making any kind of a positive contribution.

[/rant]

[tbm3fan]

That was part of the original report, and the only ones that were caught using an inappropriate tax status were "blue" PACs.

I wonder what the GOPers will dig up for the next scandal, when this one fades away. . . doesn't really matter, I guess, as long as they can keep from making any kind of a positive contribution.

[/rant]

What I always though funny was the fact that the Republicans thought they were being singled out as though the IRS had an agenda against them. I, on the other hand, know a few retire IRS agents and a good friend's father was one, and yes they had an agenda. Their agenda was simple and that was "everyone" must pay taxes and "everyone" was cheating some way. Pretty basic agenda there but it ain't ideological.

[Parihaka]

For it to be meaningful a comparison needs to be made as to how long it took for those identified as conservative vs those identified as liberal surely? Wasn't that the import of the original argument? And wasn't that issue which the Cincinnati branch was admitted to be doing? i.e. delaying conservative groups while flicking liberal ones through?