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  • Charlie Gasparino, financial news reporter at Fox Business and heavily tied into Wall Street, from his twitter on May 3rd:

    BREAKING: Big NY donors are balking at giving money to both @realDonaldTrump and @JoeBiden. sources tell @FoxBusiness. Concerns that both - for different reasons - aren't fit for the job. Increasingly the NYC Wall Street donor class is being courted by @NoLabelsOrg.

    “SCOOP: People inside @NoLabelsOrg tell me the organization will attempt to run a 3rd party candidate ONLY IF @JoeBiden and @realDonaldTrump are the respective nominees of the Dem and GOP. Its polling shows that’s the likely outcome. Outreach to donors shows an appetite by big Dem and Republican donors for an independent if it’s a Biden-Trump race. Names being thrown around are @GovLarryHogan, @Sen_JoeManchin.
    In a followup response to a comment this was a surprising leak to a conservative outlet as Gasparino works for Fox:
    “Sorry not a leak; my source is a possible NoLabels delegate who works on Wall Street and is politically unaligned.”
    As I follow third parties more than 99% of Americans, I've known about them for awhile. No Labels has kept on the down-low but they are very well-funded and have a group of "leftish Republicans/rightish Democrats" that were elected politicians inside it. Larry Hogan is part of the national leadership of the group. Joe Lieberman is in it. They have ballot access so far in 4 states, including Arizona where Democrats are suing to get them off the ballot. While if they have buckets of money, they'll be able to like Ross Perot get onto all the ballots, there's a few states where ballot access is just awful designed by the Republicans and Democrats to minimize the threat of this kind of thing ever occurring. I think they'll need a candidate to get those.

    The organization says they are not a political party (which means they're not technically required to disclose their donors) but are a group providing the ballot access for a white knight incase we have a Biden-Trump election redux. They say they are not planning to back a candidate for any political office except President.

    I think such a candidate in today's environment would drop one of the two main parties down to 3rd in a lot of states, although obviously it depends on who is running. (Perot took 2nd in Utah ahead of Clinton in 1992 and 2nd in Maine ahead of Bush, which he almost won). What Perot did in 1992 has become more and more impressive to me in hindsight that when we still had institutionally strong political parties and machines, he got 1 out of 5 Americans to vote for him. The "strong political parties" are dead, Donald Trump and Bernie Sanders in 2016 demonstrated that. So we'll be 32 years on from Perot, more Americans say they're independent than ever, there's an acknowledgement by most people that both parties have just ran to their extremes, this could realistically work. If you had a strong candidate running here (admittedly a giant asterisk), I could see:

    Northeast/Pacific Coast/Hawaii - Trump would drop to 3rd place everywhere except for probably New Hampshire, I'd give this candidate a strong chance to win Maine which it and Alaska are the most independent-friendly states in the country

    Midwest/Plains/Rocky Mountain states - outside of the major cities, Democrat vote share would collapse even further, maybe even to single digits in a lot of counties. I've done deep dives into Indiana election results because it's where I live and I'm in politics a small amount, and the Democrats at least in this state, they've completely fallen apart post-Trump. This state voted for Obama in 2008. Even the good things they can point to there's a counterpoint. They're for example gaining the historically very rich Indianapolis suburb and establishment Republican Hamilton County (Carmel) but they're also losing Chicago outer suburb Lake County (Gary) which has voted heavy Democrat for a century as labor and Democrats continue their slow divorce, so in the end as far as net vote gain it's a wash. There's 92 counties in the state and more than 90% of them are diehard Republican already.

    South - this candidate would perform weakest here just as Perot did, where the two party system would stay intact due to Southern cultural reasons (note: lived in North Carolina until I was 30)
    Last edited by rj1; 05 May 23,, 14:59.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by rj1 View Post

      The organization says they are not a political party (which means they're not technically required to disclose their donors) but are a group providing the ballot access for a white knight incase we have a Biden-Trump election redux. They say they are not planning to back a candidate for any political office except President.
      For the moment, I'm afraid that's what we're going to have.

      Still, there's practically an eternity of time before now and Election Day 2024. It'll be interesting to go back and read this thread after the fact.
      “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

      Comment


      • Tara Palmeri at Puck News had a rough transcript of a recent No Labels teleconference. She kept callers' names private except for the organization's leadership and...Joe Manchin.

        Comment


        • Barr: Trump will deliver ‘chaos’ and ‘horror show’
          Former Attorney General Bill Barr said Friday that former President Trump will deliver “chaos” and a “horror show” if he returned to the White House in 2024.

          “If you believe in his policies, what he’s advertising as his policies, he’s the last person who could actually execute them and achieve them,” Barr said of Trump at an event in Cleveland. “He does not have the discipline.”

          When pressed further, Barr claimed his former boss doesn’t have “the ability for strategic thinking” or “setting priorities.”

          “It is a horror show when he’s left to his own devices,” Barr said. “And so, you may want his policies, but Trump will not deliver Trump policies.”

          “He will deliver chaos and, if anything, lead to a backlash that will set his policies much further back than they otherwise would be,” he added.


          Barr, who served as attorney general under Trump and former President George H.W. Bush, was in Cleveland discussing his book, “One Damn Thing After Another: Memoirs of an Attorney General.”

          The former attorney general has become a frequent critic of Trump since leaving the administration in December 2020. Shortly before resigning, Barr revealed the Department of Justice found no evidence of widespread voter fraud in the 2020 election, despite then-President Trump’s claims.

          Last month, he suggested Trump was the Republican candidate “most likely to lose again” to President Biden in 2024.
          __________

          But but but....his POLICIES!!

          Shit, it's almost like "his policies" wasn't a good enough reason to put him in the Oval Office....because he doesn't have the aptitude or work ethic to run a fucking lemonade stand.
          “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

          Comment


          • Attack ads, social media posts, vitriolic speeches: Trump's feud with DeSantis is personal

            It's not just politics. It's personal.

            An onslaught of attack commercials, pillorying social media posts and berating stump speeches is evidence that former President Trump isn't just battering a political rival. He is castigating Gov. Ron DeSantis for his perceived betrayal.

            Trump has pretty much said so himself.

            "See, I'm a loyalist," Trump said in a March speech in which he again recited how DeSantis asked for his endorsement in the 2018 Florida governor's race, and how that support was pivotal to DeSantis winning. "So he gets the nomination because of you. He wins the election because of you. Two years later, the fake news is up there saying, 'Will you run against the president? Will you run?' And he says, 'I have no comment.' I say that's not supposed to happen."

            What has followed has been a series of sharply-worded attack ads, with stinging images, singularly aimed at his erstwhile political apprentice while sparing, or ignoring, an actual rival, former South Carolina governor and U.S. ambassador Nikki Haley, also considered a turncoat by many of the Trump faithful.


            Former President Donald Trump stops by Downtown House of Pizza as he greets his supporters after giving a speech during Lee County Republican dinner in Fort Myers. Trump was critical of Gov. Ron DeSantis in that address as well.

            From eating pudding to "You're fired": Trump ads take pointed aim at DeSantis

            One spot ridiculed the governor for reportedly eating chocolate pudding by scooping it out of a container with his fingers. The governor has said he does not remember ever doing so, at least as an adult, but the ad pounced on the notion in a way that one steadfast Trump critic said was "creepy."

            An even more blistering commercial directly struck at the governor's forsworn fealty.

            It noted how Trump's endorsement "saved" DeSantis politically in that 2018 gubernatorial campaign and showed a clip of the governor thanking Trump for "standing by me when it wasn't necessarily the smart thing to do."

            "Instead of being grateful, DeSantis is now attacking the very man who saved his career," the ad goes on to say. "It's time DeSantis remembers how he got to where he is."

            Then it concludes with a clip from a 2018 DeSantis campaign ad in which the then-GOP gubernatorial candidate quoted Trump's signature phrase from his The Apprentice TV show. "Then Mr. Trump said, 'You're fired,'" DeSantis said in the ad. "I love that part."

            The ad finished by firing this zinger: "Truth is, there is only one man who can make America great again."

            Trump's biting commercials aimed only at DeSantis. Because he's top rival? Or is it personal?

            The ads aren't the only reason why Trump, who was impeached and acquitted twice and then indicted in March, has surged to a double-digit lead over the as-of-yet non-candidate DeSantis in poll after poll. A survey of GOP primary voters by a CBS News-YouGov poll, issued May 1, found Trump with a 36-point lead over DeSantis, 58% to 22%.

            Trump World orbiters say the "personal" nature of Trump's attacks are intended, and unmistakable.

            "He got elected because of Donald Trump," said Mike Lindell, founder of the MyPillow company, and a regular at Trump political events at Mar-a-Lago. "He was like, way down. He was nobody and because Donald Trump believes in the guy, that's how he got elected. And then DeSantis turns on him."

            Longtime Trump adviser and political strategist Roger Stone acknowledged the attacks on DeSantis cut deeper than, say, those on yesteryear rivals like U.S. Sen. Marco Rubio and former Gov. Jeb Bush.


            Political consultant Roger Stone, seen here at Mar-A-Lago on April 4, 2023, said he agrees that former President Donald Trump has taken Gov. Ron DeSantis' actions as a personal affront.


            Stone said it's a "fair statement" to say that Trump has taken DeSantis' actions as a personal affront.

            Stone echoed the former president's sentiments that his "endorsement catapulted" DeSantis to the GOP gubernatorial nomination five years ago. He recalls how Trump, amid a heavily contested midterm battle for control of Capitol Hill, still came to Florida "three times in the final two weeks of the 2018 election" to boost DeSantis to what was ultimately a slim 33,000-vote victory over Democrat Andrew Gillum.

            Stone has been among the governor's harshest critics since speculation of a possible DeSantis White House run began to swirl. In a viral video a year ago, Stone told Trump to "watch DeSantis" before calling the governor an expletive. In 2021, he threatened to run against DeSantis in last year's gubernatorial election if the governor did not abandon his reported 2024 ambitions.

            "Donald Trump didn't play any initial role in getting Marco Rubio into the U.S. Senate," Stone said. "In all honesty, Ron would be, if I were to make a smart ass remark, I'd say he'd be managing a McDonald's now if he weren't governor."

            Lincoln Project, which knows a thing or two about political ads, not shocked by Trump attacks at DeSantis

            The ferocity of the attack on DeSantis should not surprise anyone, said a leader in the group that made a name for itself airing biting TV and online commercials aimed at Trump.

            Rick Wilson, a Tallahassee-based former GOP political strategist and a founder of the Lincoln Project, said he can see why "Trump feels betrayed by DeSantis" and concedes the former president's "anger with DeSantis is justified on that particular point." But Wilson said no one should be shocked by the level of vitriol in the personal attacks.

            "Ron DeSantis and Donald Trump? This show was always only going to end one way, and that way was blood," Wilson said. "It was never going to be a peaceful transition of power between these two guys. There was never going to be a day where Donald Trump woke up and said, 'You know, I think I'm going to let DeSantis get away with this stuff.' It was never going to happen."

            Founded in late 2019 by former Republicans and so-called "Never Trumpers," the Lincoln Project's anti-Trump ads were a staple of the 2020 presidential campaign.

            Since then, the group has broadened its topics to include support for Ukraine in its fight with Russia as well as other issues. Its ads have won numerous "Pollie Awards" presented by the American Association of Political Consultants (AAPC) as well as "Webby Awards" from the International Academy of Digital Arts and Sciences.

            Wilson said the Make America Great Again Inc. commercials fired at DeSantis are "good ads for their audience, the hardcore cranky MAGA types" that will be critical in the GOP primaries next year.

            "I like to think I do some pretty good ads," Wilson added, saying the Trump ads were "effective, but they weren't politically elegant. The pudding one gives you the creeps."

            There's been a changing of the guard among Trump's political advisers, expert says

            He counsels other Republicans and Democrats to look beyond the commercials, however, and be prepared.

            Wilson said there's been a changing of the guard among Trump's political advisers. He said Trump's inner circle, with veterans like Susie Wiles and Chris LaCivita, are top-tier political strategists and the former president seems to have traded his chaotic style for a much more "disciplined and focused campaign."

            "All the clowns are off the train and they've got serious people there," Wilson said. "I take them seriously because they are the kind of people that we used to be when we were in the Republican Party. Serious people doing hard work."

            Trump's team understands how to define opponents early on when they are relatively unknown politically, Wilson said. They've also managed to keep their candidate focused, and that's evident in Trump's landing almost a dozen endorsements from Florida congressional Republicans, which demonstrates he "is doing the work this time.

            "He's putting in the days and hours," Wilson said, adding: "It's not going to be pretty for DeSantis."

            Has the Trump-DeSantis alliance been irrevocably broken? That may not be the case.

            Some who have supported Trump for years caution against reading too much into the Trump-DeSantis fray.

            "I don't think it's personal. I think it's politics," said Joe Budd, founder of the Club 47 Trump fan club. "Trump sees DeSantis as his number one competitor for the Republican nomination. So it's politics. I really don't believe it's personal. Trump can say a lot of things that might seem personal, but it's purely political."

            Budd, who last year was the GOP nominee in a congressional district that includes Palm Beach County, said the seemingly personal nature of the attacks on the governor are not "beneficial" and that even those supporting Trump don't care for them. But Budd insists the goal is to win.

            "It's purely political. He sees DeSantis as his number one rival, and, you know, he's trying to knock DeSantis down, that's all," said Budd, adding that he is neutral in the Trump-DeSantis feud.

            Even Stone, who has had harsh words for the governor, stops short of saying he believes Trump will hold a grudge forever.

            "Trump has a long history of reconciling with people that he breaks with," Stone said. "So, it's impossible to say what the future might hold."
            ____________
            “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

            Comment


            • Senate GOP sees Trump as looking increasingly dominant

              Senate Republicans say former President Trump is consolidating his support in the Republican Party and now looks more likely to become the party’s nominee in 2024 despite his legal problems.

              Trump has doubled his polling lead over his closest rival, Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis, since Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg indicted him on March 30.

              During that time, the former president has picked several prominent endorsements in Congress, including the support of National Republican Senatorial Committee Chairman Steve Daines (R-Mont.).

              Republican senators and GOP strategists say Daines’s endorsement is a sign that Trump is viewed as the favorite to win the party’s presidential nomination in 2024.

              They say the leader of the Senate Republican campaign arm wants to have a good working relationship with him to maximize the chances of winning back control of the Senate.

              “I just think that his nomination is inevitable. I really do. He’s going to be the nominee. I’d be stunned if he’s not,” said one Republican senator who requested anonymity to discuss the primary and hasn’t yet endorsed a candidate.

              “You’ve seen the numbers. I’ve talked to voters. People are beginning to recognize that. Steve Daines’s endorsement reflects that reality. He’s going to be the nominee, we want him to work with us,” the senator added.

              Trump led DeSantis by an average of 16 points on March 30, the day Bragg indicted him in New York, according to national polls analyzed by RealClearPolitics. By May 1, Trump’s average polling lead over his rival had grown to nearly 30 points.

              Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.), who is endorsing Trump’s presidential bid, said the former president “seems to be” consolidating his support in the party.

              “He’s certainly growing, if you believe in polling, and you hear it on the ground too. Part of it was a reaction to the New York prosecution. He became a victim of an out-of-control left-wing prosecutor and it gave him a bump,” he said.

              “Now does he sustain this? I’m supporting him but, you know, it depends on how DeSantis engages. Does he run? If he runs, what campaign does he run?” Graham added.

              Some Trump allies are speculating that DeSantis may decide not to challenge Trump after all given the former president’s huge polling lead.

              DeSantis said Friday he will make a decision “relatively soon.”

              “You’ve got to put up or shut up on that,” he said at a news conference.

              A second Republican senator who has stayed neutral and requested anonymity to discuss the race agreed that Trump is the clear favorite heading into next year’s election. The senator said Daines wants to get ahead of the pack in endorsing Trump to increase the odds of working with him to help flip the Senate.

              The lawmaker said “I assume Trump will be the candidate” on the Republican presidential ticket in next year’s general election.

              The senator said a growing sense of Trump’s inevitability likely drove the recent decisions by Daines and Sens. Marsha Blackburn (R-Tenn.), Bill Hagerty (R-Tenn.) and Mike Braun (R-Ind.) to back Trump’s third White House bid.

              A Republican strategist said Daines wants to have a good relationship with Trump so they can work together to back the most electable candidates in next year’s Senate primaries.

              “It looks like Daines is working to try to point Trump to some of the stronger candidates in Senate races,” the strategist said.

              One of the GOP senators who endorsed Trump privately expressed reservations about his electability in an interview with The Hill shortly after he launched his presidential campaign in November.

              The lawmaker said he wanted to wait to see if Trump could move past his obsession over what he claimed was widespread fraud in the 2020 election.

              Trump still regularly claims without evidence that he lost the last election because of fraud but Senate Republican concerns about his electability against President Biden have waned.

              An Economist/YouGov poll of 1,500 adults nationwide conducted April 29 to May 2 showed Trump and Biden tied in a hypothetical matchup while it also showed Biden ahead of DeSantis by three points.

              “Not only Donald Trump doing well in the primary and he’s the clear frontrunner in the primary, he’s also beating Joe Biden in the general election, 47 to 43,” said Jim McLaughlin, Trump’s pollster, of his firm’s polls on a hypothetical rematch of the 2020 election.

              “Our polling never had [Trump] ahead in the general in either 2016 or 2020,” he said.

              “A lot of folks don’t understand — it’s pretty amazing, people who are supposed to be smart — why Donald Trump is as popular as he is, especially amongst the base. The reason is because he had a successful presidency. [Voters] agreed with him on the issues,” he added.

              Trump has compiled 11 Senate Republican endorsements while DeSantis, who has yet to formally announce his plans to run for president, has yet to secure any strong Senate support.

              Utah Sen. Mike Lee (R-Utah) hosted a meet-and-greet event for DeSantis in Washington on April 18. The only other senator who showed up was Sen. John Cornyn (R-Texas), who said afterward that he doesn’t plan to endorse in next year’s presidential primary.

              Some of Trump’s critics in the Senate GOP leadership argue that it’s too soon to declare Trump the party’s likely nominee in 2024.

              “I think the polls are going to be very fluid. They have been already. Coming out of November, DeSantis was ahead. Now Trump’s ahead. I just think there’s a lot of volatility in the electorate right now and I think national polls are probably going to be a little misleading. Presidential stuff is all state by state,” said Senate Republican Whip John Thune (S.D.), who opposed efforts by Trump allies to object to the certification of Biden’s 2020 victory on Jan. 6.

              Thune acknowledged Trump “has got a formidable position” and “he’s got a very loyal following” but argued “I think there are an awful lot of people there that are up for grabs too.”

              Cornyn, an advisor to the Senate GOP leadership, said “it’s very early.”

              Whit Ayres, a prominent Republican pollster, said the possibility of additional indictments against Trump by the Department of Justice and the Fulton County district attorney in Georgia could swing the race away from Trump, predicting that charges from those prosecutors would have more credibility than Bragg’s indictment.

              “People seem to have an inevitable tendency to jump to premature conclusions well before we know many of the key elements of a campaign environment,” he said in response to comments by some GOP senators that Trump’s victory in next year’s primary looks inevitable.

              “What might be the political effects of serious felony indictments backed up a mountain of compelling evidence?” he said of potential felony charges that Trump incited the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the U.S. Capitol and tried to interfere in the 2020 election in Georgia.

              “Are Republican voters really going to dismiss multiple credible felony indictments backed up by substantial evidence, if indeed they occur? They might but I don’t know the answer to that,” he said.

              Graham, one of Trump’s closest allies on the Hill, however, argued that Trump is running a more disciplined campaign, which will enhance his perceived electability in the general election.

              “The more he talks about the contrast between his presidency and that of Biden the better off he’ll be. You see that’s beginning to pay dividends,” he said.

              Asked about the chairman of the Senate Republicans’ campaign arm endorsing Trump, Graham said “I think Steve understands — I know he has a close relationship with him — but he sees Trump as the most likely nominee.”

              “It’s an acknowledgement of Trump’s power in the Republican primary world,” he said.
              _____________

              Uh, duh??
              “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

              Comment


              • They can't seem to flick that booger off their finger!

                Or is it really a Brokeback Mountain situation?
                “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
                Mark Twain

                Comment


                • DeSantis says Trump deploying ‘Democrat attacks’ on Social Security, Medicare


                  Former President Trump (left) speaks at his Mar-a-Lago estate. Florida Republican Gov. Ron DeSantis (right) sits with his family before addressing supporters at The Ronald Reagan Presidential Library.

                  Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis (R) accused former President Trump of deploying “Democrat attacks” against him over his past support for changes to entitlement programs as the governor considers joining Trump in the 2024 primary.

                  “Those are Democrat attacks, I don’t think anyone really buys that,” DeSantis said Friday in an interview with Newsmax. “Donald Trump himself wrote a book where he was talking about the need to increase the age of eligibility for Social Security to 70.”

                  Trump’s campaign has dinged DeSantis for supporting a GOP budget proposal while he was in Congress that would have raised the retirement age to 70 to receive Social Security benefits. As the debate over the future of entitlement programs including Social Security and Medicare has reignited with the fight over the debt ceiling in Washington, Trump has said that Republicans should not touch the programs.

                  A federal report this year showed the trust funds that back Social Security will be depleted by 2034, implementing an automatic reduction in the level of benefits that are paid out.

                  DeSantis said in the interview that Republicans needed to be able to discuss changes to the programs, but he blasted Trump for resorting to “Democrat tactics.”

                  “Clearly, nobody has ever proposed to do anything to affect the current senior citizens,” he said.

                  A pro-DeSantis super PAC last month launched a TV ad defending him on Social Security and going after Trump for his attacks. The interview from DeSantis echoed some of the same framing from the ad.

                  “Donald Trump is being attacked by a Democrat prosecutor in New York,” the narrator in the ad released last month said. “So why is he spending millions attacking the Republican governor of Florida? Trump’s stealing pages from the Biden-Pelosi playbook.”

                  DeSantis also said in the interview that he has not spoken to Trump since his campaign for reelection in Florida last year.

                  The governor, who won that campaign easily, consistently polls in second place of a hypothetical 2024 GOP primary field — behind only Trump.

                  DeSantis has not yet announced a White House bid; Trump announced his in November.
                  ___________

                  Um, Ron? Have you been in a coma since Trump came down that stupid escalator or something?
                  “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

                  Comment


                  • Trump expands lead over GOP to largest yet: poll

                    Former President Trump has expanded his lead among a hypothetical GOP primary field for 2024, topping Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis (R), who hasn’t yet launched a bid, by 41 points, according to a new poll.

                    The new Morning Consult survey released Tuesday found Trump in the lead with 60 percent of potential Republican primary voters, followed by DeSantis with 19 percent.

                    The pair were the clear frontrunners in the poll, with former Vice President Mike Pence and conservative entrepreneur Vivek Ramaswamy next up with 5 percent each. Ramaswamy has officially entered the race, but Pence hasn’t yet said whether he’ll run.

                    Former South Carolina Gov. Nikki Haley, who was the first big-name Republican to get in the 2024 ring with Trump, snagged just 3 percent in the poll — followed by former Wyoming Rep. Liz Cheney, who hasn’t declared a campaign, with 2 percent.

                    Former Arkansas Gov. Asa Hutchinson, who entered the White Houuse race last month, earned just 1 percent.

                    DeSantis has long polled as a top potential 2024 contender to challenge Trump, though recent polling has suggested the former president is pulling ahead of the Florida governor, who has said he plans to make a 2024 decision “relatively soon.”

                    Forty-two percent of the potential Republican primary voters in the poll who picked Trump as their first choice chose DeSantis as their second — and 43 percent of those who picked DeSantis first said Trump was their backup choice.

                    Conducted May 5-7, the poll surveyed 3,574 potential Republican primary voters and had a margin of error of plus or minus 2 percentage points.
                    ______
                    “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

                    Comment


                    • It's a death cult.
                      “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
                      Mark Twain

                      Comment


                      • GOP’s 2024 Candidates Dare Not Cross Trump After Sexual Assault Verdict
                        Even Trump’s fellow 2024 candidates wouldn’t immediately speak out against him—except for one.

                        Faced with a devastating jury verdict condemning GOP 2024 frontrunner Donald Trump as a sexual abuser, fellow Republicans running for president weren’t just hesitant to attack Trump—they largely sided with him.

                        Vivek Ramaswamy, an entrepreneur and longshot presidential candidate, echoed Trump’s excuse that the federal court case in New York City was nothing more than a political show trial.

                        “This seems like just another part of the establishment’s anaphylactic response against its chief political allergen: Donald Trump,” he said.

                        Another longshot presidential candidate, right-wing political talk radio host Larry Elder, delivered a pithy remark dismissing the verdict against Trump by comparing it to sexual assault allegations against President Joe Biden.

                        “Was Tara Reade available for comment?” Elder tweeted, referencing a former staffer in Biden’s office when he was in the Senate.

                        Reade came out in 2020 with allegations that Biden had sexually assaulted her at a Capitol Hill office building in 1993. But the AP refused to run a story about it after allegedly discovering inconsistencies in her story.

                        While most prospective candidates were silent—Ron DeSantis, Nikki Haley, Mike Pence, Tim Scott, Chris Christie, and Chris Sununu, all didn’t immediately issue statements, among the rest of the field—one Republican longshot did issue some light criticism.

                        Former Arkansas Gov. Asa Hutchinson, who was previously a U.S. Attorney there, said that over the course of more than 25 years of experience in the courtroom, “I have seen firsthand how a cavalier and arrogant contempt for the rule of law can backfire,” Hutchinson said, adding that the jury came to a decision on Trump’s “indefensible behavior.”

                        Tuesday was a historic moment, as Trump became the first ever former American president to be held liable in court for sexual abuse. Jurors ended a two-week trial by deliberating for a mere three hours before concluding that Trump in 1996 sexually attacked the journalist E. Jean Carroll in the fitting room of a Manhattan department store.

                        But most Republicans were far from willing to criticize their once, current, and future standard-bearer.

                        Sen. Bill Hagerty (R-TN) went on Fox News to chalk the entire case up to just another shot at his party’s top candidate.

                        “This has been going on for years. And he has been amazing in his ability to weather these sorts of attacks and the American public has been amazing in their support for him,” said Hagerty, who also acquitted Trump during his 2021 Senate impeachment for sparking an attack on the very Congress where he serves.

                        While most Republicans hadn’t spoken at all about the verdict, the chairwoman of the Republican National Committee, Ronna McDaniel, shrugged off the verdict and told Fox News viewers that suburban moms like her are more concerned about the way Biden is handling the U.S. economy.

                        “I think a lot of women are incredibly disappointed with the Biden administration, so they’ll be looking at the Republican nominee, whoever that is,” McDaniel said.

                        Meanwhile, Carroll issued a statement Tuesday night saying she filed the lawsuit against Trump to “clear my name and to get my life back.”

                        “Today, the world finally knows the truth. This victory is not just for me but for every woman who has suffered because she was not believed,” she said. “I would like to express my deep and lasting gratitude to all those who have stood by me from the start, especially my incredible and fearless legal team, led by Robbie Kaplan, who never, ever backed down in pursuit of truth and justice.”
                        _______
                        “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

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                        • Did not watch, but everyone reacting says CNN gave Trump a complete gift last night. He rhetorically overpowered the moderator in the Town Hall setting and had an entirely friendly live audience. One person wondered whether CNN should consider it an in-kind donation.

                          (With hindsight, Chinese-originated Covid was such a gift to the Biden campaign. Biden didn't have to campaign at all hardly and severely hindered Trump from using what he's best at it in politics of getting a large live crowd to cheer him.)

                          It does show the problem for any Republican wanting to combat him in the primary. Trump through his presence and sheer force of will in a live environment will overcome any attempt at hamstringing him and won't play by the rules because he doesn't have to. CNN gave him free air time to state everything because they are desperate for ratings in a bad financial time for them. For example, he's not doing presidential debates inside the party because he knows he doesn't have to. It's brute force power more than anything, which to be fair every other politician does or would do if they can get away with it.

                          I do see a trap being laid here, all these candidates are going to be in a primary talking about the elephant that is not in the room, and once someone emerges as a leader from that pack that can threaten him, Trump will call for a 1-on-1 debate on his terms. The guy or girl will be forced to accept after talking for months how Trump is ducking out of competition, but then Trump can defuse the other candidate in a similar situation to last night. No one has ever figured out how to combat this. I don't think Biden did in 2020 even if he won. Trump famously destroyed Jeb Bush's campaign in 2015 before it ever got going. Rubio tried as a strategy to sink to Trump's level in early 2016 and failed at it.

                          Reading a "top 10" of the night I did laugh at one of them. They had a focus group post-Town Hall and question the CNN guy asks the focus group was: "why does Trump continue talking about 2020 and not 2024?", and the response from one group member was "the first question he was asked tonight was about was 2020".
                          Last edited by rj1; 11 May 23,, 17:13.

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                          • Originally posted by rj1 View Post
                            Did not watch, but everyone reacting says CNN gave Trump a complete gift last night. He rhetorically overpowered the moderator in the Town Hall setting and had an entirely friendly live audience. One person wondered whether CNN should consider it an in-kind donation.
                            I didn’t watch either but plenty of reaction.

                            Goes both ways though. Call it a gift to pro-Trump supporters but he didn’t win any independents over. He just reminded people why they didn’t vote for him in 2020.

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                            • Originally posted by rj1 View Post
                              Did not watch, but everyone reacting says CNN gave Trump a complete gift last night. He rhetorically overpowered the moderator in the Town Hall setting and had an entirely friendly live audience. One person wondered whether CNN should consider it an in-kind donation.
                              CNN should definitely write that off as a charitable donation. They might as well have stuck a shotgun in their mouth and pulled the trigger with their toes.

                              Originally posted by rj1 View Post
                              (With hindsight, Chinese-originated Covid was such a gift to the Biden campaign. Biden didn't have to campaign at all hardly and severely hindered Trump from using what he's best at it in politics of getting a large live crowd to cheer him.)
                              I would argue that the actual gift to anyone running against Trump in 2020 was that COVID showed, graphically, day after day, just how incompetent and uncaring Donald Trump is, even when the lives of millions of Americans are directly at stake. It was a giant exclamation point to the previous 4 years of Trump's inability to do anything constructive.

                              It does show the problem for any Republican wanting to combat him in the primary. Trump through his presence and sheer force of will in a live environment will overcome any attempt at hamstringing him and won't play by the rules because he doesn't have to. CNN gave him free air time to state everything because they are desperate for ratings in a bad financial time for them. For example, he's not doing presidential debates inside the party because he knows he doesn't have to. It's brute force power more than anything, which to be fair every other politician does or would do if they can get away with it.
                              Agreed, any GOP candidate that agrees to debate Trump is an utter fool. It'll be interesting if Trump agrees to a debate in the general election too.

                              Originally posted by rj1 View Post
                              I do see a trap being laid here, all these candidates are going to be in a primary talking about the elephant that is not in the room, and once someone emerges as a leader from that pack that can threaten him, Trump will call for a 1-on-1 debate on his terms. The guy or girl will be forced to accept after talking for months how Trump is ducking out of competition, but then Trump can defuse the other candidate in a similar situation to last night. No one has ever figured out how to combat this. I don't think Biden did in 2020 even if he won.
                              I think he did about as well as you can expect when dealing with a small child throwing a temper tantrum.

                              All he had to do was simply let Trump rant on and on nonsensically before finally telling him 'Will you shut up man...this is so unpresidential!'
                              “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by TopHatter View Post
                                CNN should definitely write that off as a charitable donation. They might as well have stuck a shotgun in their mouth and pulled the trigger with their toes.

                                I would argue that the actual gift to anyone running against Trump in 2020 was that COVID showed, graphically, day after day, just how incompetent and uncaring Donald Trump is, even when the lives of millions of Americans are directly at stake.
                                I could say that about Trudeau, Cuomo, DeSantis, Boris, Pritzker, Newsom, my governor Eric Holcomb, Xi, teachers' unions, the people at NIH that gave a funding grant to the Wuhan lab to study coronaviruses (allegedly for gain of function which NIH denies but they were not being transparent about things) that the general public still know nothing about. This generation of politicians are shit. The amusing thing now is some of these people responsible for all these decisions made are trying to walk back and act like they're not responsible for what happened. Trudeau in my opinion is a completely over-his-head dumbshit that is a less talented Bill Clinton, so he doesn't surprise me. Fauci actually said publicly recently he was not responsible for schools deciding to close. Just about every school district and government in America said "follow the science" and you passed on the science dude. I get science changes and evolves as it definitely has with Covid, but you are the reason and responsible for that outcome. Educational outcomes and mental health for a ton of kids in grade schools the past few years has been a disaster (my wife is a middle school counselor) and because the modern American philosophy on education is you never hold kids back a grade even if they should be, a lot of these kids are never going to catch up and you've condemned a lot of them the rest of their lives to a lower class status. Nate Silver going through stats on what has occurred compared it to the invasion of Iraq. He received a lot of pushback on that, but educators spent a couple decades of Ph.D. papers talking about achievement gaps as the be all end all of discrimination to minorities and then in 2021 started magically acting like that did not matter as white children that went to private schools were zooming further and further away from all the black and Latino kids going to public schools entirely remote. We can talk about how the Biden administration is big on labor rights supposedly and then endorsed a policy of firing workers without performance cause. Do not sit and lie to me Biden is pro-labor.

                                I remember the day I could see that the general public finally shifted on things. Couple family relations work in hospitals and they banned patients coming in from wearing cloth masks anymore, had to be an N95 mask because in comparison the cloth mask does nothing to stop transmission. I shared that in a forum with mostly Brits on it and that made people newly against mask updates because they didn't want to be forced to upgrade from cloth to an N95. "No, let's instead virtue signal with the item that does not do a good job in stopping transmission."

                                Agreed, any GOP candidate that agrees to debate Trump is an utter fool.
                                They'll have to if they want to win the nomination. Because all of them are going to mention he's not there and then when Trump asks them to debate they'll be shamed into it by all the press.

                                It'll be interesting if Trump agrees to a debate in the general election too.
                                The Republican National Committee unanimously voted last year to pull out of the Commission of Presidential Debates. Which good on them, the CPD do nothing but serve the power structure and seek to ensure there's never anything that changes the status quo. Although I think it serves Biden well too there are no debates. He even joked at the White House Correspondents Dinner on how little public appearances and granting of interviews to journalists he does.
                                Last edited by rj1; 11 May 23,, 22:14.

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