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  • #46
    Originally posted by Triple C View Post
    I have. I don't remember who, or from where; it might be a marine from tanknet.

    A couple of photographed Hezbullah and Iraqi insurgents, dead and alive, seem to be wearing vests.
    I still think a light M-4 is a better PDW than a dedicated sub gun with exotic ammo.

    If the new ammo can punch through the vest, the M-4 certainly can. If the M-4 can't punch through, then no pistol sized ammo, no matter how pointy, can punch through.

    For simplicity in training and logistics, a light M-4 makes more sense.
    "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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    • #47
      Originally posted by gunnut View Post
      I still think a light M-4 is a better PDW than a dedicated sub gun with exotic ammo.

      If the new ammo can punch through the vest, the M-4 certainly can. If the M-4 can't punch through, then no pistol sized ammo, no matter how pointy, can punch through.

      For simplicity in training and logistics, a light M-4 makes more sense.
      Hence me suggesting a Magpul PDR. Same round, smaller/lighter frame.
      In Iran people belive pepsi stands for pay each penny save israel. -urmomma158
      The Russian Navy is still a threat, but only to those unlucky enough to be Russian sailors.-highsea

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      • #48
        Very interesting. It will be better if it can use the standard M-16 mags.

        Still, there needs to be a different training for this rifle. Not many common parts with the M-16 family other than the ammo.
        "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by gunnut View Post
          Very interesting. It will be better if it can use the standard M-16 mags.

          Still, there needs to be a different training for this rifle. Not many common parts with the M-16 family other than the ammo.
          The Knight's Armamment PDW is built to look, feel and handle like a small M-16. It uses 6x35 ammo that is supposed have 40% the recoil of the 5.56 round. So what it loses in round commonality, it wins over in cross-training.
          In Iran people belive pepsi stands for pay each penny save israel. -urmomma158
          The Russian Navy is still a threat, but only to those unlucky enough to be Russian sailors.-highsea

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          • #50
            I know that his is a bit of a necro post, but here is my opinion on mp7 vs p90. I personally prefer the mp7. Why? because of its small size and ease to use. Anyone who has shot a pistol and fired a AR would know instinctively how to use it. The same can't be said of the p90. Its size is slightly larger than a pistol, and very barely larger than an mp5k, which was the original standard for the PDW tests. It can also be fired like a pistol, one handed, without being bothersome.

            As for the PDW question: "Should we adopt a PDW system?" My straight out answer is yes. Anyone who has ever been inside a tank or a LAV knows that conditions are cramped, often too much for any sort of use or movement of a standard size carbine should the need arise. It is also next to impossible to use said carbine in the confines of a truck or hummvee if you need to immediately engage an enemy (Such as an ambush while protecting a VIP or simply being caught with your pants down). In today's engagements against terrorists, vehicles like tanks and LAVs are becoming less useful, and ambushes where crew are caught outside of the vehicle are increasing.

            The solution: I agree that neither mp7 or p90 is what the military needs. What it needs is a PDW carbine, like the Knight's Armament PDW, but something that is multi caliber, that can accept 5.56, 6.8 SPC, or 7.62x39mm so it can have the punch of a full length AR. Remember, in an ambush, especially in a city, you probably will be engaging targets at less than 300 meters, so you don't need that full length barrel of an AR.
            Last edited by AceVendetta; 03 Sep 11,, 23:12.

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