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  • Pacfanweb
    replied
    BB55 only had a cofferdam on the starboard side of the bow, where the repairs were done, IIRC. Some are needed on the port side, but last I heard they were working on the mast and radar. They were originally going to tow her to Norfolk and drydock her and do all the repairs and do them right. Then they were talking about doing a permanent cofferdam like Alabama has. Don't know what went with that idea.

    Here is a great example of why her hull is in its current condition:
    Attached Files
    Last edited by Pacfanweb; 25 Sep 13,, 04:58.

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  • Dreadnought
    replied
    Originally posted by shadow01 View Post
    The Massachusttes had quite a bit of work done to her hull while she was drydocked in Boston. They replaced sea chests, sealed up inlets, and added new steal plates and used red hand epoxy. They also gave her a paint job on her upper hull. Have they inspected her since? I do not know, but they have said she does not sit in the mud.

    Rusty did they ever seriously consider bringing the Massachusetts back on line? From all I have gathered from the staff that takes care of her that was never a serious consideration due to speed limitation and the fact they, raided her for parts for the Iowas.

    But I would have loved to have seen the lady back with the fleet. :)
    As far as I know the only pieces that were taken were fixtures and if not mistaken the tow cable. No machinery was taken from the drivetrains or gunnery systems as the tech was older then the Iowas and the boilers had a different layout with fewer engine and fire rooms being some 200 odd feet shorter.
    Last edited by Dreadnought; 25 Sep 13,, 03:46.

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  • Gun Grape
    replied
    Originally posted by Dreadnought View Post
    Rusty,
    Do these ships not have the cathodic protection belts the Iowa's have? That is excluding the Olympia.
    The North Carolina does. What hurt her was the 50 years of constant abrasion of sand against her hull when the tides changed.

    But she is out of the cofferdam. New steel and paint Along with new zincs.

    Ready for another 50 years of showing her colors as the most decorated battleship of WW2. All under a Carolina Blue sky

    Nothing could be finer.
    Last edited by Gun Grape; 25 Sep 13,, 00:34.

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  • desertswo
    replied
    Originally posted by shadow01 View Post
    The Massachusttes had quite a bit of work done to her hull while she was drydocked in Boston. They replaced sea chests, sealed up inlets, and added new steal plates and used red hand epoxy. They also gave her a paint job on her upper hull. Have they inspected her since? I do not know, but they have said she does not sit in the mud.

    Rusty did they ever seriously consider bringing the Massachusetts back on line? From all I have gathered from the staff that takes care of her that was never a serious consideration due to speed limitation and the fact they, raided her for parts for the Iowas.

    But I would have loved to have seen the lady back with the fleet. :)
    The fleet wouldn't have.

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  • shadow01
    replied
    Originally posted by RustyBattleship View Post
    That is correct. The "Mamie" museum administrators asked a Program Manager in NAVSEA how to cut the shafts off. He is a personal friend of mine so I won't mention his name. But he immediately shot back a copy of the donation "agreement" that forbid them to cut the shafts which would make the ship non-restorable should she be needed in a "National Emergency". He said he could provide procedures to properly remove the propellers (unbolt them) but they were forbidden to cut the shafts.

    Since then, those restrictions have been removed. Especially of the North Carolina which is in serious condition right now where cofferdams have had to be built to replace large sections of shell plating that have rusted away.

    This is scaring me as we now have three major warship memorials deteriorating in the water with one already in the mud. That's the North Carolina, the Texas and the Olympia. I don't know what shape Mamie is in, but if anybody knows I would appreciate some input. We can then "reverse engineer" the start of hull deterioration to keep the Iowa class ships protected.
    The Massachusttes had quite a bit of work done to her hull while she was drydocked in Boston. They replaced sea chests, sealed up inlets, and added new steal plates and used red hand epoxy. They also gave her a paint job on her upper hull. Have they inspected her since? I do not know, but they have said she does not sit in the mud.

    Rusty did they ever seriously consider bringing the Massachusetts back on line? From all I have gathered from the staff that takes care of her that was never a serious consideration due to speed limitation and the fact they, raided her for parts for the Iowas.

    But I would have loved to have seen the lady back with the fleet. :)

    Leave a comment:


  • desertswo
    replied
    Originally posted by Dreadnought View Post
    Rusty,
    Do these ships not have the cathodic protection belts the Iowa's have? That is excluding the Olympia.
    I was wondering myself if their weren't at least zinc anodes installed. That's hardly a new science. Regardless, as the guy who used to own cathodic protection, my opinion is that the only real thing that can be done if no dry docking and repair is in the offing, is wrap them in electric cables and emit a current that will counter the bi-metalitc corrosion taking place. That would be the one big reason to remove the screws if still installed.

    Leave a comment:


  • Dreadnought
    replied
    Rusty,
    Do these ships not have the cathodic protection belts the Iowa's have? That is excluding the Olympia.

    Leave a comment:


  • RustyBattleship
    replied
    Originally posted by shadow01 View Post
    I remember when the Massachusetts whent into the drydock in Boston for her hull cleaning and sealing. They wanted to remove all 4 screws and cut the shaft ends and weld them to seal out and more leakage over time. The Navy allowed them to take the two outboard screws off and use them for display purposes, but would not give permission to cut the shafts and weld them up.
    That is correct. The "Mamie" museum administrators asked a Program Manager in NAVSEA how to cut the shafts off. He is a personal friend of mine so I won't mention his name. But he immediately shot back a copy of the donation "agreement" that forbid them to cut the shafts which would make the ship non-restorable should she be needed in a "National Emergency". He said he could provide procedures to properly remove the propellers (unbolt them) but they were forbidden to cut the shafts.

    Since then, those restrictions have been removed. Especially of the North Carolina which is in serious condition right now where cofferdams have had to be built to replace large sections of shell plating that have rusted away.

    This is scaring me as we now have three major warship memorials deteriorating in the water with one already in the mud. That's the North Carolina, the Texas and the Olympia. I don't know what shape Mamie is in, but if anybody knows I would appreciate some input. We can then "reverse engineer" the start of hull deterioration to keep the Iowa class ships protected.

    Leave a comment:


  • shadow01
    replied
    Originally posted by Dreadnought View Post
    1) Although they now belong to their respective foundations, the USN still dictates what can and shall happen aboard the ships. In the bottom line the USN still acts as Administrator of the each foundations contracts. It also tell them how they will be maintained and when they shall be drydocked for upkeep. So to answer the question...The USN retains ownership of the ships however is only the Administrator to their contracts as the different foundations are responsible for the ships matrerial conditions and safety.

    2) If we are speaking a "live fire" then the answer would be a definative "no". A full service charge would no doubt drop windows in the surrounding buildings. The damage would be great (and expensive). Even the secondary batteries are fired with a fraction of their full service charge and they are VERY loud depending the amount of powder used.
    The USN would also not approve of this without being under their control and must be petitioned prior to anyone touching those guns for such a reason.

    So as too answer that question would be a definative "no". You will never see them fire a full service charge unless for some unforseen reason the Navy was to requesition them. Which we dont ever forsee happening again. (Then again nobody could forsee them being recommed in the 80's either).

    3) No it does not. BB-62 (New Jersey) has had certain modifications done too it in order to allow the public at large to tour the turret, its shelldecks, powder mag level and gunplot. These modifications does not/will not impare the turrets use outside of undoing her mods (catwalk and access) and returning her to "full" material status.

    4) The "expansion" joint is the source of flexibility for the ship. Allowing all of that weight (ships decks etc) to remain fluid and flexible. Only the exposed parts (main deck) can be damaged by the elements the interior workings of it cannot be as far as I know. Im pretty sure it would be an easy fix to restore it as now a days you see these same joints onboard your luxury liners etc. That is why they can carry cabins with balconies so high above the main deck with all of the weight it entales.

    If they were smart, they would have contacted the Beau of Ships and repaired it in the proper method that they the USN recommend. The USN designates a liason for their ships to be repaired and they would only approve of such repairs in writing only after consultation and inspection.

    These ships are normally "annually" inspected so it would be to their own benefit to point that out to their official contacts or when they are inspected.

    In some cases they may even recieve help from the USN on matters such as this.

    Hope this helps to answer your questions.
    I remember when the Massachusetts whent into the drydock in Boston for her hull cleaning and sealing. They wanted to remove all 4 screws and cut the shaft ends and weld them to seal out and more leakage over time. The Navy allowed them to take the two outboard screws off and use them for display purposes, but would not give permission to cut the shafts and weld them up.

    Leave a comment:


  • Dreadnought
    replied
    Originally posted by 85 gt kid View Post
    Heres the more general questions I stated above. So far i've been one 3 BBs (Massachusetts, New Jersey and the Wisconsin (i've even done a little volunteering one BB-64). Anyways I've read/seen somethings that I wanted to clear up so here it goes:

    1) I read somewhere in the "We Got the IOWA" thread I think where I believe RustyBattleship said something about keeping with the "re-activation rules". I can try and look for it if need be but it was my understanding that the Navy and Congress have basically written the 4 girls off so is there something that i'm missing?

    2) Now I know that technically you could fire the main guns and that "supposedly" that was gonna happen to one of the ships but is it a real possibility that one of the museums will do that in the future? I think I would sell all my cars to go see one of them big guns fire .

    3) Do the alterations to BB-62's Turret 2 affect her ability to ever use that turret in real life?

    4) Ok so in April I volunteered for a few hours on the Wisconsin (I unfortunately had a 5 hour drive so I couldn't stay long). The VC had me work in the starboard berthing space on the main deck (in between the funnels). Apparently the expansion joint seal is practically gone and when it rains it over flows the overflow pan and litteraly floods the berthing space. I think I pumped 25 gallons out of the floor ! Anyways does anyone know of an "easy" way to fix it that isn't totally wrong? Who know they may have done something with it by now but if not then maybe I could go up there in December and help fix it ;).

    Hopefully I didn't drown you guys in questions!

    1) Although they now belong to their respective foundations, the USN still dictates what can and shall happen aboard the ships. In the bottom line the USN still acts as Administrator of the each foundations contracts. It also tell them how they will be maintained and when they shall be drydocked for upkeep. So to answer the question...The USN retains ownership of the ships however is only the Administrator to their contracts as the different foundations are responsible for the ships matrerial conditions and safety.

    2) If we are speaking a "live fire" then the answer would be a definative "no". A full service charge would no doubt drop windows in the surrounding buildings. The damage would be great (and expensive). Even the secondary batteries are fired with a fraction of their full service charge and they are VERY loud depending the amount of powder used.
    The USN would also not approve of this without being under their control and must be petitioned prior to anyone touching those guns for such a reason.

    So as too answer that question would be a definative "no". You will never see them fire a full service charge unless for some unforseen reason the Navy was to requesition them. Which we dont ever forsee happening again. (Then again nobody could forsee them being recommed in the 80's either).

    3) No it does not. BB-62 (New Jersey) has had certain modifications done too it in order to allow the public at large to tour the turret, its shelldecks, powder mag level and gunplot. These modifications does not/will not impare the turrets use outside of undoing her mods (catwalk and access) and returning her to "full" material status.

    4) The "expansion" joint is the source of flexibility for the ship. Allowing all of that weight (ships decks etc) to remain fluid and flexible. Only the exposed parts (main deck) can be damaged by the elements the interior workings of it cannot be as far as I know. Im pretty sure it would be an easy fix to restore it as now a days you see these same joints onboard your luxury liners etc. That is why they can carry cabins with balconies so high above the main deck with all of the weight it entales.

    If they were smart, they would have contacted the Beau of Ships and repaired it in the proper method that they the USN recommend. The USN designates a liason for their ships to be repaired and they would only approve of such repairs in writing only after consultation and inspection.

    These ships are normally "annually" inspected so it would be to their own benefit to point that out to their official contacts or when they are inspected.

    In some cases they may even recieve help from the USN on matters such as this.

    Hope this helps to answer your questions.
    Last edited by Dreadnought; 23 Sep 13,, 18:21.

    Leave a comment:

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