SS United States in danger of being scrapped

[Ken_NJ]

By Nicole Breskin

DNAinfo Reporter/Producer

CHELSEA — Local activists fear their dream of bringing a historic ocean liner to the Manhattan waterfront could be sinking, following news that the ship’s owner is accepting offers from scrap yards.

Norwegian Cruise Line has been trying for more than a year to sell the SS United States — which took its maiden voyage in 1952 and once carried Marilyn Monroe, Harry Truman and Salvador Dalí — but gave preference to a local preservation entity.

Now rumors are flying that a sale to an overseas scrapper is imminent, with Norwegian Cruise Line shareholders growing tired of footing an annual $800,000 bill in upkeep costs. Meanwhile, preservationists have sought to raise money to purchase the multimillion-dollar ship that is currently docked in Philadelphia.

“The situation is extremely dire with the SS United States,” said Dan McSweeney, executive director of the SS United States Conservancy. “We will do all we can, and then some, to prevent the loss of this irreplaceable national treasure.”

McSweeney, an Upper West Side resident whose father was a crewmember on the ship during its 17-year run, said he recently learned that the cruise line is currently accepting bids from scrappers.
Preservationists Hope to Galvanize Support to Bring Historic Ship SS United States to ManhattanThe Duke and Duchess of Windsor on the SS United States. Marilyn Monroe and President John F. Kennedy also traveled on the ship. (Photo: Courtesy of Charlie Anderson)

He has appealed to both Community Board 4’s waterfront committee and the city's Economic Development Corporation in hopes of bringing the ship to Manhattan’s waterfront as a stationary attraction. But McSweeney now believes he only has days left to turn the tide before the ship gets turned into razor blades.

AnneMarie Mathews, director of public relations for Norwegian Cruise Lines, said the company would sell the ship to the SS United States Conservancy or another buyer who would focus on preservation, but time and money are running out.

“We have continued discussions with the SS United States Conservancy, but to date they have not made an offer to purchase the ship,” she said. “Therefore, we continue to seek alternative arrangements with the intent of selling the vessel to a suitable buyer.”

The SS United States was designed as a warship but operated as a luxury ocean liner until 1969, when the airplane became the primary mode of trans-Atlantic transportation. The 990-foot-long vessel once held the record for fastest trip across the Atlantic Ocean — three-and-a-half days.

The SS United States Conservancy launched an emergency fundraising campaign called “Save Our Ship." The conservancy is also holding a call-to-action event on March 11 at the National Academy of Design on the Upper East Side.

"There's a reason why this ship is still with us,” said Susan Gibbs, the conservancy's board president, whose grandfather, William Francis Gibbs, designed the vessel. “She absolutely must be saved for future generations."

Dan Trachtenberg, chairman of another boat-backing group called the SS United States Foundation, hopes the groups can save the ocean liner.

“We’re strategizing and scrambling to explore what options we have, as our biggest obstacle is money,” Trachtenberg said. “It would be a major travesty to lose the ship because it’s one of a kind: Nothing has been built like it, and there’s no capability to build a ship like it in the future. Once it’s gone, that’s it.”

Read more: Historic Ocean Liner's Planned Move to Manhattan May Get Sunk, Activists Fear - DNAinfo.com

Historic Ocean Liner's Planned Move to Manhattan May Get Sunk, Activists Fear - DNAinfo.com
SS United States Conservancy - The National Effort to Save the SS United States, Our Nation's Flagship

Getting closer that another American icon can be lost. And the Olympia, just down the river from the United States is in a pickle. Not sure but wasn't some of the engineering on the United States the same as in the Midway class carriers?

[Archdude]

Can't the 2 US Senators from New York do something useful and use earmark money (ARRA) to help this cause?

[Rumrunner]

Historic Ocean Liner's Planned Move to Manhattan May Get Sunk, Activists Fear - DNAinfo.com
SS United States Conservancy - The National Effort to Save the SS United States, Our Nation's Flagship

Getting closer that another American icon can be lost. And the Olympia, just down the river from the United States is in a pickle. Not sure but wasn't some of the engineering on the United States the same as in the Midway class carriers?

Where is she gonna go in NYC? All the cruise ship piers are in use and actually near to turning a profit, so they wont allow a rusty ship to sit there while it's restored. Brooklyn? Queens? SI? Might as well scrap her now before giving her a death sentence like that. Anywhere not in midtown where she will get tons of tourist foot traffic will essentially mean she will just be moved to another pier to rot.

She received the powerplant from the scrapped USS Illinois if I'm not mistaken...

More info than you could ever need here:
Neue Seite 1

[tbm3fan]

Can't the 2 US Senators from New York do something useful and use earmark money (ARRA) to help this cause?

I'm sure the two Senators had something to do with earmarking $18M is Federal money for the Intrepid. They may just be keeping a low profile since the Navy has said the Museum Association is responsible for care of the ship. Don't think for a minute those of us aboard the Hornet didn't notice this and I'm sure the Lexington and Yorktown noticed this money also.

[RustyBattleship]

Several years ago I was connected with a group that wanted to save the ship also. Then when they sent me photos of the inside I knew it was a lost cause.

The topcoat of paint on the interior has been removed and shows the old Yellow Chromate primer. It's considered a Hazardous Material.

The cost of removal of the primer or even sealing over it would bail out two more mortgage companies.

[StevoJH]

Several years ago I was connected with a group that wanted to save the ship also. Then when they sent me photos of the inside I knew it was a lost cause.

The topcoat of paint on the interior has been removed and shows the old Yellow Chromate primer. It's considered a Hazardous Material.

The cost of removal of the primer or even sealing over it would bail out two more mortgage companies.

How does the US Navy train people in maintenance, is it on the job or do they do training courses?

Just wondering because I know that Australian Army Mechanical Apprentices do up old cars (restoration and adding go fast bits) which are then used by the recruitment people at car shows and stuff.

I know it would be a much larger scale but could something similar be done with the United States? At least enough to keep it in good enough shape for a later full restoration to take place....

[TopHatter]

I'm sure the Lexington and Yorktown noticed this money also.

I'm sure the Yorktown people have visions of their ship being seized and/or scrapped right about now. :(

[tbm3fan]

How does the US Navy train people in maintenance, is it on the job or do they do training courses?

At times I wondered this myself when restoring. I'd go over an area that obviously hasn't been touched sine 1969 or 1970 and wonder who the hell did this? Don't they know how to do this right? You should hear our ship's electrician as he does repairs around the ship and curses the previous electricians who worked on the ship for their shoddy workmanship.

One thing I notice up in Suisun is that the more layers of paint a ship has the greater potential for serious cancer eating rust there is. A ship with two layers of paint may look bad at first look until you realize it is all superficial only. Now a ship with 8-10 layers of paint, where it comes off in very large flakes, many times has rust under which has eaten through metal because the many layers of paint kept the surface moist. As a result, as I restore the exterior of the Island section by section, I scrape off almost all the old layers of paint by hand and start with just the original layer of primer left. Corners are notorious for having globs of paint on and in them. I also like the look of a uniform flat surface of paint because that is the perfectionist in me. Every time I pass by the hull of the Iowa I just cringe at all the different layers of paint visible.

[StevoJH]

Fairly sure I read a book about HMAS Melbourne once that said by the time she left service some of her internal bulkheads were held together only by the many layers of paint.

How do you get the paint off? Would pressure washing be enough or do you have to basically sand it all off one section of lead based paint at a time?

The only Museum ships i've been on are HMAS Vampire and HMAS Onslow at Sydney.

[RustyBattleship]

How does the US Navy train people in maintenance, is it on the job or do they do training courses?....

A combination of both. It starts off during Basic Training (called "Boot Camp" in the US Navy because of the white leggins recruits have to wear).

The first two (and most important) trainings are in Damage Control and Fire Fighting. This is often repeated even after Boot Camp just to keep the crew up to snuff and incorporate any new methods that may have come along.

Other specialty jobs may require the personnel to attend another training center such as Carrier assigned personnel for "Cat & Gear" (Catapults and Arresting Gear).

The more meanial (but necessary) jobs, such as swabbing the decks, chipping paint and repainting, are taught aboard ship. However, there is a hidden benifit in that as the sailors get to know more about what is where on a ship and this sometimes leads to cross-training where a person can perform two or more jobs on the ship should the regular crewmen may not be available at that time.

[RustyBattleship]

Fairly sure I read a book about HMAS Melbourne once that said by the time she left service some of her internal bulkheads were held together only by the many layers of paint.

How do you get the paint off? Would pressure washing be enough or do you have to basically sand it all off one section of lead based paint at a time?

The only Museum ships i've been on are HMAS Vampire and HMAS Onslow at Sydney.

"Washing" with high pressure water is good enough to take off the layers of barnacles and other sea fouling below the ship's waterline. While in drydock that is.

Marine fouling is also removed by divers using rotating scrubber brushes. But sometimes they get carried away using steel bristles and often take off the protective coating of paint (a sorrowful experience we had on New Jersey).

Topside repainting often requires complete removal of the top layer. Depending upon the shape and size of the object to be painted (hand rails, winch foundations, bulkheads, etc.) will require one or more of the following tools:
A welder's slag hammer (chisel on one end and point on the other).

Hammer and chisel.

Needle gun (like a small air powered riveting gun but with stiff steel bristles).

Jitterbug (air powered hand tool with 3 or 4 steel round bars with square ends).

Hand grinders (air powered circular "sanders" but with carbide disks that can cut through metal, therefore rarely used).

All of these above methods are very noisy and anybody around them must wear ear protectors.

And no, we cannot use a chemical paint remover.

[Gun Grape]

You should hear our ship's electrician as he does repairs around the ship and curses the previous electricians who worked on the ship for their shoddy workmanship.

Some of that may be shoddy work. But another reason is a change of codes. Your electrician is use to dealing with up to date NEC work. That stuff wasn't around back in the day and what he now sees as shoddy workmanship was sometimes standard procedure back then.

I'm remodeling (Gutting and starting over) a former government building from the late 1940s. As we tear walls and ceilings out, you can pretty much tell the time hat part was remodeled or if it is still original. Codes, standards and techniques change. If someone tried to do the same nowdays they would be laughed out of business.

[Archdude]

Several years ago I was connected with a group that wanted to save the ship also. Then when they sent me photos of the inside I knew it was a lost cause.

The topcoat of paint on the interior has been removed and shows the old Yellow Chromate primer. It's considered a Hazardous Material.

The cost of removal of the primer or even sealing over it would bail out two more mortgage companies.

I could have sworn I saw a PBS special on the SS United states that where NCL had already paid to have all haz mat material removed in Turkey. This special was televised in the last two years.

When was your "several years ago" time-frame?

The reason I am passionate about this ship, as well as the others, like the Olympia, Yorktown and others, is because of my love for our country's maritime history. Once a ship like the SS United States is lost forever, it can't be brought back, even in the history books.

When I showed friends of mine the pictures of the Missouri's restoration in Hawaii, especially the spot where the Japanese signed the surrender documents that end WWII, it blew their minds that the actual ship is still afloat.

Saving a ship like the United States, the Olympia, the Yorktown and others is essential to help educate Americans and others of our maritime history. Additionally, it might help create a few jobs along the way and interest youth in a maritime career or even teaching naval history in a school.

[RustyBattleship]

I could have sworn I saw a PBS special on the SS United states that where NCL had already paid to have all haz mat material removed in Turkey. This special was televised in the last two years.

When was your "several years ago" time-frame?

The reason I am passionate about this ship, as well as the others, like the Olympia, Yorktown and others, is because of my love for our country's maritime history. Once a ship like the SS United States is lost forever, it can't be brought back, even in the history books.

When I showed friends of mine the pictures of the Missouri's restoration in Hawaii, especially the spot where the Japanese signed the surrender documents that end WWII, it blew their minds that the actual ship is still afloat.

Saving a ship like the United States, the Olympia, the Yorktown and others is essential to help educate Americans and others of our maritime history. Additionally, it might help create a few jobs along the way and interest youth in a maritime career or even teaching naval history in a school.

That "several years ago" would have been about 1998 or so. If the HAZMAT has been removed, then I'm all for saving her.

And I fully agree that we must keep the most notable ships preserved for their roll of history making that has made us what we are today. Without the technology and production methods developed to build those ships, we would still be using oars.

[tbm3fan]

Since all these ships have yellow chromate how exactly would HAZMAT go around removing it? Wouldn't it be better to simply leave it in it's place and paint over it to seal? Similar to what we do for asbestos when there are issues? I know almost the entire first layer of paint on the Hornet Island exterior is either yellow or green chromate and that is a lot of square feet. Or are you only concerned when it is exposed to the ravages of time?