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  • Here's the Protectors Main website.

    http://www.ws-wr.com/epk/BAE_Protect...TOKEN=63842233

    Stats I find interesting: it has a 2 person operating system, which can be controlled from the ship or or land.

    It has thermal imaging for day and night operations.

    Only limited by the fuel it carries.

    It's based on the Zodiac. Therefor, serious question - can it be loaded into a chinook like SOF's use?

    Advantage of USV's is they can enter coastal positions where a blue water navy would never want to go, and monitor it much better, If they are deployable/recoverable by helicopter even though they already have considerable speed, their deployment time to any given hotspot would be dramatically reduced.

    Problem is with helo deployment, it takes a lot to lift something out of the water plainly, and the spot factor. If one estimates a 6000 kg weight, thats out of reach of the seahawk, & about 600 kg's short of being able to be lifted by a merlin. Which leaves the next option of a chook, which means LPD, or supply ship. 8 control stations, 16 operators at anyone time for 8 boats + maintenance staff. Which isn't all that bad at all if your someone like the RN with Merlin HM1's available for operation, you have a useful little anti piracy battle group!
    Ego Numquam

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Oscar View Post
      JAD,

      What you posted is clearly a baseless "rumour" that I saw on many other forums. People who had found that one day in their mailbox, or "a friend of a friend/an exSEAL/ a parent who works in the military who told me", etc....This is clearly an anti obama operation to denigrate his handling of the crisis.
      Stirred up the honeybees, did I? I guess I am used to a dialogue that can include data on "baseless" rumors for informational purposes. Beyond rumor, there is motivation. That's what interests me. Anyway the rumor, if it is one, did not denigrate BHO's performance in my eyes. A president has many more balls to balance than does an ops guy with a gun in his hand. :)
      To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

      Comment


      • Originally posted by astralis View Post
        JAD,



        didn't want to jump you on this one but i don't like rumor-mongering, particularly when it's so blatantly false.

        Aw, come on. Admit it. You loved jumping on me. :P:P:)):))
        To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

        Comment


        • JAD,

          Aw, come on. Admit it. You loved jumping on me.
          only if you happen to be a nubile 18 year old female not encumbered with morals or cloth- never mind.
          There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

          Comment


          • Hey did anyone get the formal request of the "somali government" requesting assistance with the creation of a coast guard.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by astralis View Post
              JAD,



              only if you happen to be a nubile 18 year old female not encumbered with morals or cloth- never mind.
              If I were one I'd expect a sleek, tanned adonis with morals.:))
              To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Maxor View Post
                Hey did anyone get the formal request of the "somali government" requesting assistance with the creation of a coast guard.
                What's this about Somalia wanting to start a coast guard? How many miles of coastline? That's a tall order.
                To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

                Comment


                • to finish burying the rumor:

                  Among the reports disputed by Pentagon officials was a widely circulated Internet critique - purportedly from an anonymous source close to the SEAL community - saying Navy SEALs missed a chance to shoot the pirates on April 10 when Richard Phillips, the captain of the hijacked freighter, jumped out of a lifeboat where he was being held in a failed escape attempt.

                  However, military officials at the Pentagon involved in the operation said Navy SEAL snipers had not arrived on board the Bainbridge at that time and therefore could not have fired on the pirates.

                  Contrary to the critical report, the president did not reject two proposed rescue attempts by U.S. forces prior to the sniper attack, Mr. Jones said.
                  ----

                  EXCLUSIVE: Obama OK'd 2 SEAL teams for pirates

                  http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...s-for-pirates/

                  President Obama dispatched two separate teams of Navy commandos to carry out last week's rescue of a merchant ship captain held hostage by Somali pirates but left the operational details and rules of engagement to military commanders, National Security Adviser James. L. Jones said Tuesday.

                  "I can tell you from a White House and presidential standpoint, there was no conflict, no gnashing of teeth, or excessive influence in trying to manage this thing," Mr. Jones, a retired Marine Corps four-star general, told The Washington Times in an interview.

                  He and other military officials gave the most detailed account to date of how Navy SEAL forces were dispatched - first from a base in Africa and later from the United States - to carry out the mission, and how Pentagon officials communicated with the White House. They sought to dispel Internet reports that the military was delayed from taking action by indecision inside the White House.

                  "I don't recognize" the information being circulated on the Internet, Mr. Jones said.

                  Pentagon officials said the owners of the merchant ship Maersk Alabama controlled the scene in the early hours after the hostage-taking on April 8. As soon as the Pentagon took charge on April 10 with its warship the USS Bainbridge on the scene, Mr. Obama first authorized a few Navy SEALs from a base in Africa to deploy to the Bainbridge and take necessary action. The team was flown by transport aircraft and parachuted to waters near the warship, officials said.

                  "It took awhile to get facts and then to get the military on scene," said one senior military official, who spoke only on the condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of discussing special forces operations. "As the picture got more clear and commanders' requests went back down the chain, the guidance was: 'We would like a peaceful resolution. However, if Captain Phillips' life is in danger you can take appropriate action.' "

                  The arrival of the first SEAL team gave the military an emergency capability if the pirates holding the ship's captain became violent. Mr. Jones said the Pentagon requested that a second, more complete SEAL team be dispatched from the United States and Mr. Obama approved that request as well.

                  "This was, from my perspective, a textbook operation," Mr. Jones said in the interview. "There were two things [the president] was asked to approve and he did. And the military executed flawlessly."

                  Among the reports disputed by Pentagon officials was a widely circulated Internet critique - purportedly from an anonymous source close to the SEAL community - saying Navy SEALs missed a chance to shoot the pirates on April 10 when Richard Phillips, the captain of the hijacked freighter, jumped out of a lifeboat where he was being held in a failed escape attempt.

                  However, military officials at the Pentagon involved in the operation said Navy SEAL snipers had not arrived on board the Bainbridge at that time and therefore could not have fired on the pirates.

                  Contrary to the critical report, the president did not reject two proposed rescue attempts by U.S. forces prior to the sniper attack, Mr. Jones said.

                  Navy SEAL commandos based in Norfolk, from the Naval Development Group, part of the Naval Special Warfare Center based in Coronado, Calif., were dispatched to the region. On April 12, snipers on the team killed the three Somali pirates holding Mr. Phillips with what military officials said was a difficult, simultaneous rifle attack.

                  They fired from the fantail of the guided missile destroyer while it was towing the lifeboat to seas that were less choppy.

                  A fourth man captured during the incident, Abdiwali Abdiqadir Muse, was brought back to the United States and charged with piracy in federal court in New York on Tuesday. He appeared in New York with a bandaged hand, smiling at times as he was escorted by federal agents.

                  The rescue operation was delayed because of the time it took to deploy the second SEAL team of more than 20 commandos, along with boats and special equipment, from the United States to the area about 300 miles off the coast of Somalia, Pentagon officials said.

                  At the Pentagon, military officials said the rules of engagement were set by military commanders at Central Command and were more limited than combat rules because the Navy regarded the operation as countering criminal activity, namely piracy.

                  Mr. Jones said the hostage rescue was "a real-world test" for the White House National Security Council crisis system that he heads, as well as a test for the Pentagon.

                  "I think everybody played their part well and there wasn't any overstepping on anybody's equities," he said. "The right questions were asked and the right actions were taken."

                  After the rescue was over, Mr. Jones said, he called Defense Secretary Robert M. Gates and Joint Chiefs of Staff Chairman Adm. Mike Mullen and asked for a postmortem on the operation. "The response I got was that everything was done professionally and calmly," he said.

                  The president and several advisers in Washington held several secure video conferences to discuss the rescue during the five-day standoff, military officials said. No details of the conferences were made public by the officials.

                  Mr. Jones said he has firsthand experience of being on the military end of civilian involvement in a merchant ship seizure. He was a former Marine Corps officer in 1975 when his battalion was involved in the communist Khmer Rouge's capture of the merchant ship Mayaguez at the end of the Vietnam War.

                  Fourteen Marines were killed in an assault to free the Mayaguez, whose crew had been released from the vessel earlier.

                  "I've been on the end of an 8,000-mile[-long] screwdriver," he said. "I was really happy how this thing played out. All the operatives had all the top cover they needed. The risk assessment was done. The execution was spot on."

                  Any delays in moving the forces that ultimately took action were not the result of obtaining authorization from the White House or Pentagon but the time it took to move SEALs, their vessels and other equipment from the East Coast to the Horn of Africa, a flight distance of about 7,800 miles, the senior official said.

                  The SEAL team in Norfolk is normally made up of more than 120 commandos. For the Somalia rescue, the team was trimmed down and involved more than 20 troops, including vessels.

                  The team mobilized as rapidly as possible and moved out within hours of the White House approval. The senior official said the request to use the forces was approved in a matter of hours.

                  "Once what we asked for had been approved, the long pole in the tent was getting them there," the official said. "That took ... roughly a day, to get loaded and wheels up, then aerial refueling to get them there."

                  Vice Adm. William Gortney, commander of Navy forces in the Middle East, told reporters on Sunday that "there were standing orders that if [Mr. Phillips] was at risk and we on scene determined that he was under imminent danger, to go ahead and take decisive action."

                  Authorities went through "a deliberate, slow deliberate process to let the negotiation process work itself out to a nonviolent end," he said. "And unfortunately, that did not occur."

                  A defense official said one reason for any hesitation in taking action was the less-than-successful raid on a pirated yacht in the Gulf of Aden on April 10. That raid by French military forces killed two Somali pirates and freed four hostages but led to the death of one other hostage.

                  The anonymous SEAL source stated in the Internet posting that was attributed to "some SEAL pals in Virginia Beach" that the president would not authorize the SEALs to deploy for 36 hours despite requests from the on-scene commander.

                  The senior military official said that assertion was false.

                  The posting also stated that rules of engagement imposed by the president prevented action unless the hostage's life was in imminent danger.

                  The military official said the commander had authority to take action at all times because Mr. Phillips was being held at gunpoint, but that he was balancing his authority with Washington's request to seek a peaceful outcome.
                  There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Maxor View Post
                    Hey did anyone get the formal request of the "somali government" requesting assistance with the creation of a coast guard.
                    Sir,
                    That is indeed part of the problem. Am I right in assuming that UN involvement such as a peace keeping force requires a recognized Government which rules in the affected area to authorize the UN to act? If so that could be a tough nut to crack with this type of ransom money at stake.
                    Grim

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by astralis View Post
                      to finish burying the rumor:
                      What's interesting is how rumors manage to take in ordinarily cautious folks. The guy who sent it to me was relaying it from a solid military type in San Diego who has been accurate in the past. BTW, I never accepted it as true. I saw many like them when I was at the Pentagon. We took them seriously only to the extent that it was our job in public affaors to verify, clarify and/or deny them.
                      To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

                      Comment


                      • Did anyone watch South Park last night? It was on the Somali pirates. Cartman ran off to join them, and became the leader of the pirates. It was hilarious.
                        "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by gunnut View Post
                          Did anyone watch South Park last night? It was on the Somali pirates. Cartman ran off to join them, and became the leader of the pirates. It was hilarious.
                          Yes I did, loved it.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by gunnut View Post
                            Did anyone watch South Park last night? It was on the Somali pirates. Cartman ran off to join them, and became the leader of the pirates. It was hilarious.
                            Yep and the ending was spectacular

                            http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/225462

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by JAD_333 View Post
                              What's this about Somalia wanting to start a coast guard? How many miles of coastline? That's a tall order.
                              Well I hear there are some folks out on their waters already, and those guys are armed too. Maybe they can just hire them .

                              Really though-isn't that similar to the whole Iraq Awakening idea? We hired the tribal militias for security so they would stop working for AQI. So here we'd hire the pirate crews.

                              Comment


                              • JAD,

                                What's interesting is how rumors manage to take in ordinarily cautious folks.
                                people will be more easily taken in if it's something they WANT to believe. i notice on the freerepublic boards no one is really talking about the Washington Times piece. i wonder why.
                                There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

                                Comment

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