I want specific information on Pak-FA

[highsea]

It was never designed to become a massed produced aircraft.. it was a technological bed, used for demonstrating the ability of the Russian aerial designers ability to design and produce a 5th generation aircraft.. It was a challenge to the Raptor; nothing less nothing more.

I doubt MiG feels that way. The 1.42/1.44 was designed to be the next generation Russian fighter (MFI), but it lost out to the SU-47. Remember that Russia hasn't inducted any new aircraft for almost 10 years. If it was so good, then why did the Sukhoi win all the military funding? MAPO had to fund it almost entirely on their own, as the Ministry of Defense couldn't support both projects. Russia's financial difficulties dictate what they can and can't do. The SU-47 performed better in tests, and had a better chance of foreign sales, so that AC was the winner.

Neither one can compete with the Raptor, but a comparison of the Eurofighter Typhoon is probably more accurate. Neither one is really a true fifth generation fighter. They both incorporate composites and internal weapons, but they use old airframe designs- the boxy intakes and square sides on the 1.42, and the forward fuselage and vertical stabs on the SU-47. Neither AC is particularly low RCS by shape- they will rely on coatings and composites. And neither one tries to shield the nozzles, so the best they can get is JSF-like stealth, e.g. frontal aspect only.

[Dima]

just to reply, Sukhoi will be the main leader of the trio of companies involved in PAK-FA, Sukhoi will won 40% of the project while MiG Corporation and Yakovlev design bureau will each get 20%(these are the sahres of the project) T-50, so far they have an electronic model on the computer, that's the farthest they've gotten so far, 2007 will be first flight, only 2 more years to go, EXCELLENT

yes, it will be based on the Su-47, i just hope it lives up to the legend of the Flanker, sad to see it go away

MiG 1.44 is differnet from the MiG 1.42, the model that everyone saw pictures of was the MiG 1.44, the configuratoin of the aircraft would change, production model was named MiG 1.42, while the prototype, which everyone saw was named MiG 1.44, the shape of the wings would change, the engines, the radome as well, there was this one good site on google i read one day, can't find it, you guys go ahead and look for it, it was really interesting, now it's available for export, so is Su-47, highly doubt anyone will purchase them though

[Severnaya]

The MiG 1.42/1.44 was a decent design, with some frontal aspect stealth characteristics. But it was slab-sided, and did not have stealthy intakes, nozzles, or vertical stabs, other than RAM coatings. And it only flew for 15 minutes. Russia wisely cancelled it when it was obviously not a challenger to the Raptor. (Must of been a problem with the "Plasma stealth". )

It was never designed to become a massed produced aircraft.. it was a technological bed, used for demonstrating the ability of the Russian aerial designers ability to design and produce a 5th generation aircraft.. It was a challenge to the Raptor; nothing less nothing more.

[highsea]

...anyways, here are the links, the second one is in russian, and is therefore, most likely the most accurate of the two
http://warfare.ru/?catid=255&linkid=2280
http://paralay.narod.ru/pakfasu.html

for the second site, look at the first picture, and open, it, it compares the T-50 to the F-22, it's actually really nice

Lol, great sites, kid. The first one is the same old recycled pics of the long abandoned MiG I.2000. Anyone that thinks that is the Pak-fa is not too bright. It's a subsonic trainer. The LFI concept is dead anyway, Russia knows better than to try to resurrect it (hopefully, for their sake). Russia bailed out on that project 8 years ago, and Iran has resurrected it as the Shafaq. Maybe a 3rd world AF can use a new LFI, but no modern country will waste the money.

Your second link showed the same pictures, except the top one, which shows the Pak-fa as a F-22 clone without stealthy nozzles.

The truth is that the Pak-fa, if it ever gets built, will likely be based on the SU-47 Berkut, but without the FSW. And this is going to have to compete for funding with the MCA. Russia doesn't have the money to field the AC themselves, and India is the only other user- how many Pak-fa's and MCA's can India afford? And new submarines, aircraft carriers, LCA, MiG-29k, etc...I don't know what the tax rate is in India, but at this rate it's going to get higher...

The MiG 1.42/1.44 was a decent design, with some frontal aspect stealth characteristics. But it was slab-sided, and did not have stealthy intakes, nozzles, or vertical stabs, other than RAM coatings. And it only flew for 15 minutes. Russia wisely cancelled it when it was obviously not a challenger to the Raptor. (Must of been a problem with the "Plasma stealth". )

[professional]

Well the primary reason believed is the fact that sukhoi has a lot of its own money that it can invest in the project while mikaloyan has nearly nothing. The new aircraft will be more of a joint venture with sukhoi investing being the majar partner ( as it has more money) and mig as a minor partner. The T50 will carry a mix of the good from the both keeping in mind the economics and targets.

You mean to say that T 50 will have both MIG and SU involved in the project.

SU has money and India is providing more . So it will really be a great plane

and we ll be able to see it soon as there is no money problem.

[Terran empire]

Air Force chief of staff Gen. John Jumper has been working overtime, ever since the F/A-22 "Raptor" stealth fighter program got slashed by the Pentagon leadership.

First, he flew one of the jets himself, at nearly Mach 2, to show off how cool the Raptor really was. Then, he had a team of F/A-22s buzz by the Super Bowl.

Now, according to Inside Defense, he's telling "lawmakers that the U.S. military's ability to dominate the skies may be threatened by a Russian aircraft that has not yet been built, and which aerospace analysts believe may never fly."

Gen. Jumper... warned “the design for the Sukhoi 40 is on the boards right now,” in a Feb. 8 hearing before the Senate Armed Services Committee.

Defense analysts said Jumper was referring to Russia's plans for a fifth-generation fighter that is to replace the Su-27 Flanker and MiG-29 Fulcrum. A design for this new fighter aircraft program, known as the PAK FA, is being crafted with a prototype expected in 2006 and production beginning in 2010, according to a May 6, 2004, Aviation Week article.

Aviation industry analysts, however, believe the enormous costs required to design and build such an aircraft... are beyond the means of the Russian government.

Use of this fledgling Russian aircraft program to make the case for the F/A-22 raised the eyebrows of some analysts. One, who asked not to be named, called it a “pitiful argument.”

http://www.defensetech.org/archives/001395.html
My thinking is that the Russian's might not even use the S 40 and those that would be built would still mot be as advanced as the F-22. But then again you never can tell either way this reads as Jumper prompting more money too the project

[ajaybhutani]

MIG and SUKHOI both had a 5th gen. plane plaanon table. But we all talk about T-50. India also invested in PAK FA.

Isnt MIG 5th gen plane GOOD enough.

Can anyone please tell me the difference between the two and why T50 is chosen...

Well the primary reason believed is the fact that sukhoi has a lot of its own money that it can invest in the project while mikaloyan has nearly nothing. The new aircraft will be more of a joint venture with sukhoi investing being the majar partner ( as it has more money) and mig as a minor partner. The T50 will carry a mix of the good from the both keeping in mind the economics and targets.

[professional]

wow, Kontakt, buddy, that's the dumbest thing i've heard all week, by 2012, the F-22 and Typhoon will be phased out already, wow, that's pretty bad, you need help

- - - -- - - - - - - - - -

for the second site, look at the first picture, and open, it, it compares the T-50 to the F-22, it's actually really nice

MIG and SUKHOI both had a 5th gen. plane plaanon table. But we all talk about T-50. India also invested in PAK FA.

Isnt MIG 5th gen plane GOOD enough.

Can anyone please tell me the difference between the two and why T50 is chosen...

[Dima]

wow, Kontakt, buddy, that's the dumbest thing i've heard all week, by 2012, the F-22 and Typhoon will be phased out already, wow, that's pretty bad, you need help

American military officials say that the F-22 will be effective at least until 2050
anyways, here are the links, the second one is in russian, and is therefore, most likely the most accurate of the two
http://warfare.ru/?catid=255&linkid=2280
http://paralay.narod.ru/pakfasu.html

for the second site, look at the first picture, and open, it, it compares the T-50 to the F-22, it's actually really nice

[ajaybhutani]

links
http://www.deagel.com/pandora/?p=pm00276001

The Sukhoi and RAC Mig corporations are developing the Russian fifth generation fighter aircraft concept intended to replace current Su-24, Su-25, Su-27, Su-30, Mig-29, and Mig-31 aircraft. The Su-47, formerly S-37 Berkut, prototype developed by Sukhoi and the Mig 1.42, also referred to as the Mig 1.44, prototype developed by RAC Mig will be be the basis of the new aircraft. According to some reports, the fifth generation could be produced in two variants a single engine and twin-engine long range aircraft.

The MFI (Front-Line Multirole Interceptor) and LFS (Lightweight Frontal Fighter) fifth generation concepts no longer meet the Russian Air Force requirements. Mig 1.44 and Su-47, strongly related to the older MFI concept, are now seen as technological demonstrators. The Future Tactical Aviation Concept (PAK FA) was disclosed by the Russian Air Force in early 2002 as the program aimed at providing the fifth generation fighter.

The PAK FA fighter will have a maximum takeoff weight of 20 tons and a combat radius of 1,200 kilometers. It will be fitted with integrated avionics, state-of-the-art sensors and new weaponry. Dimensions would be between those of current Mig-29 Fulcrum and Su-27 Flanker. The estimated cost of each airplane will not exceed $30 million being affordable for many export customers and the Russian Air Force.

Sukhoi will act as the prime contractor and RAC Mig should be the main sub-contractor. The Russian fifth generation fighter primary role will be air-to-air engagements with secondary ground/surface attack capabilities. Final specifications remain uncertain, but Russians hope to match US F/A-22 Raptor and F-35 capabilities and outperform Typhoon, Rafale and Gripen multi-role fighters.

The Russian Air Force plans to carry out the maiden flight of the fifth generation fighter by 2005 with an intended entry into service date by 2010. About 1,000 fifth generation fighters would be produced for the Russian Air Force between 2010 and 2020. It is anticipated that the Russian fifth generation fighter available for export will be NATO-interoperable.

It has been reported that the Russian Air Force will operate the PAK FA in conjunction with either Mig-AT or Yak-130 light attack aircraft/trainer and the Su-34 heavyweight, long-range, attack aircraft beyond 2010.
Specifications
Max Range 1,200 km 648 nm
Max Weight 20,000 kg 44,092-lb

Equipment
Powerplant AL-41

[professional]

Information on PAK-FA plz. I already posted this thing on land warfare, but those sons of pigs told me to come here. So, can one of you kind people tell me some stuff on the new jet that Russia will be making with others. Thank you.

[Rahul]

Highsea and Jay, I second what you said.

I am curious Kontakt Era, will this thread end up like the thread in Land Warfare when your argument degenerated to ranting about how the T90 was a "tonka truck," about India's poor, anti-Pakistan statements, and similar rubbish?

Also, you say that the EuroFighter and F-22 will be phased out by 2012. Yet you then say we are still using f15s and f16s. That right there should be enough for you to realize that the Eurofighter and F-22 are intended to be used for much more than just 7 years (now to 2012) after all the time and money put into their development my friend. Like Ajay said, google it. There is very very little known about this project between India and Russia.

[Kontakt Era]

It was just a joke

But some websites say that the jet is going to be better than the Euro-Fighter and the F-22, but it also says that its gonna be out by 2012. THats a while man. The F-22 and the Euro-Fighter will be phased out by then. Hey howcome the u.s. still uses f-15s and f-16s, if they are old?

[Jay]

You have the IQ of a fucked-up fart. And now with this mentality, you think we are going to give you info??

[ajaybhutani]

And as far as i know it was a joint project between russia and india . And not russia and france .