Most Adv. Attack Heli, KA-50

[RUSKIE]

This is the worlds Most Adv. Attack Helicopter the KA-50 Hokum last i read Russia had 75 in total, and still Producing.

[RUSKIE]

go here to find out more aboot it.http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ac/row/ka-50.htm

[Lunatock]

Got any HUD video footage available online?

It'd be interesting to compare a Shark's HUD video to the footage of Iraqi insurgents getting waxed by an AH-64 Apache.

[Praxus]

The KA-50 doesn't have a milimeter wave radar like the Longbow does. The Longbow carries 1200 rounds for it's 30mm gun compared to just over 400 in the KA-50. The Hellfire also outranges the Vikhr by over 2 kilometers.

The only thing the KA-50 is better at is the Gunship role and even at that it's a close call. Nice helicopter, but it doesn't measure up to the Longbow.

[lurker]

Longbow doesn't have any armor at all (even no bulletbroof plex on windows), thus have a very little surviveability against anything that can reach it.
Even small arms fire.

Classical scheme of the rotors also doesn't help.

[Praxus]

The armour around the cockpit can protect against all rounds up to and including 12.7mm. It does have armor despite your completely eroneous belief.

The very few loses of the Longbows in Iraq despite the shape a lot of them were in proved that they are very survivable against AK fire. In fact I don't believe a crew died from being shot down.

The main problem was the rotters getting shot to peices when they were flying within range of small arms. Many helicopters with chewed up rotter blades were able to fly it back to base.

[lurker]

Yes it does have armour, enough to protect against AK fire.

No it don't. Look at the photos from Iraq.

Ka-50: crew 1, length 13.5 m, weight 10 tons, armor - >300 kg
AH-64: crew 2, length 17.73m, weight 7 tons, armor - 120kg

p.s. KA-50 gun is also times more powerful than on Apache.

[Praxus]

The armour around the cockpit can protect against all rounds up to and including 12.7mm!!!!

No it don't. Look at the photos from Iraq.

The only thing I saw was chewed up rotor blades and a few engines that were hit.

The armor in the Apache is concentrated around the Cockpit, while the Ka-50 has armor all over the place.

Ka-50: crew 1, length 13.5 m, weight 10 tons, armor - >300 kg
AH-64: crew 2, length 17.73m, weight 7 tons, armor - 120kg

p.s. KA-50 gun is also times more powerful than on Apache.

The Apache gun has proven to be quite effective, 1200 rounds is better then little more then 400.

It is not MANY more times powerful then the Apache gun.


Apache Gun
38mm at 1000 meters

KA-50
55mm (RHA) at 1,000m

It's not even twice as much.

[lurker]

All "armor" on Apache is a small armored plates on the sides of the cockpit, covering about 50% of the pilot's side projection.

All rest of helicopter is "plastic and a little of aluminium". Look at the photo - after engine was hit by heat-seeking missile.



ps. I had better photos, but lost them somewhere. My harddrive is a mess.

[lurker]

About the guns:

Apache M320 gun: caliber 30 mm, 625+/-5 rounds per minute (automatic only), 426 rounds total, only HE and HE+cumulative rounds (can penetrate 25mm soft armor at 500m with 50 grad obliquity).




KA-50 2A42 gun (essentially BMP-2 gun): 30 mm, 800 rounds per minute automatic (200-300 single shot), 500 rounds total, max effective range - 4 km.
AP (can penetrate 15mm at 1500m with 60 grad obliquity) and HE rounds.



ps. Having a lower muzzle velocity (805 m/sec vs 980 m/sec), Apache gun will lose penetrating ability drammaticaly with range, adding to that Apache rounds are lighter (and will lose speed faster)

[Bill]

The 30mm of the apache is for soft targets.

The Hellfires are for tanks, and work quite fine thank you.

The Apache is heavily armored around the cockpit. The crew armor will stop 23mm API, and the forward windscreen will stop 14.5mm HMG rounds.

[lurker]

The Apache is heavily armored around the cockpit. The crew armor will stop 23mm API, and the forward windscreen will stop 14.5mm HMG rounds.

Nope, no armor

[Bill]

PS- The 30mm gun of the KA-50 is like a weakling compared to the mighty GAU-8A Avenger(30x173mm) cannon of the A-10 Warthog.

[Bill]

Wrong.

http://www.vectorsite.net/avah64.html

It has boron armor.

[Lunatock]

All "armor" on Apache is a small armored plates on the sides of the cockpit, covering about 50% of the pilot's side projection.

All rest of helicopter is "plastic and a little of aluminium". Look at the photo - after engine was hit by heat-seeking missile.



ps. I had better photos, but lost them somewhere. My harddrive is a mess.

Seems to have held up better than Hind gunships that were hit by heatseekers in Afghanistan.

And if these things are so fragile, then dig up pics of them reduced to smoldering hulks starting with Operation Desert Storm and right up until today where they were deployed in Afghanistan & Iraq.

The worst beatings Apache's took was at the battle of Tora Bora. They had to break from the usual routine of hitting the enemy from a distance and do strafing runs to provide cover for the ground troops. With one AH-64 having to fall back from the range, after getting hit by at least one RPG. The crew had to set it down to do some field repairs while still in shooting range of Taliban & Al-Qaeda forces. Then they took off and returned to base.