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The Carter Doctrine (Our N. American future)

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  • #31
    Originally posted by zraver View Post
    glow I invite you ponder the fact that the US has the largest recoverable oil reserves on Earth (in fact US reserves are nealry 400 billion barrels more than all of the rest of the world combined). US reserves via Kerogen ammount to 3.3 trillion tons or 1.5 trillion barrels.

    Now that oil has past 50 a barrel and not collapsed the economy the stuff is commerically viable, now what were you saying about peak oil?
    Ummm What? Where are you even getting those figures from? The US would burn threw it's The strategic reserve in less than a month just an FYI. And Kerogen? Do you have a clue about how much oil it takes to even get oil? When getting oil from oil sands you use about 1 barrel to get 3. With Shale (kerogen) You use more than 1 barrel. Why? Because you don't need to just extract then separate it but you have to crush the rock up first then carry on with extraction.

    Originally posted by Major Dad View Post
    Gas hydrates
    Cold fusion was always a dream. 'Hot' fusion, though, isn't. Spent fuel can, and should, be reprocessed. Disposal of activated reactor components is problematic, but only as much as we make it.

    And I also have a hard time seeing the down side to a flooded San Francisco.
    Yup! Theres a lot of awesome ways to get energy from other places hell Japan is using rods in the sea to get a little extra power, Denmark 20% and growing of their power comes from wind. Germany has like 400-1000 windmills going now I forget. Waves are good in theory but lot of issues with that not ecologically friendly ****s with the earth. Wind farms are awesome. Dams we'll see less and less, the one on the yellow river is only good for maybe 60 years. But hot fusion is pretty amazing except for the fact that trying to contain something thats like 90 million degrees isn't too easy lol.

    p.s. Too you guys who got all riled up all I got to say is good! Finally some more interesting convos on here was getting f'in boring on here.

    So Alright back to the Carter Doctrine then. Russia and China obviously are in favor of having Iran having say in the region. I mean they're the big bows aren't they? and they are partners for them. How far would you say the US is willing to go to make sure Iran/ China doesn't have control over the region especially in an attempt to claim or get some control over Iraqs Oil supply (I don't just mean by military means) I'm not sure how the division of oil is in Iraq or what companies control what in terms of Oil, but obviously China is going to be in need of it soon enough. It's not like the Saudis are going to Invade Iraq or anyone else who's in the US pocket and vice versa.
    Last edited by glow; 15 Jun 07,, 00:18.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by glow View Post
      Ummm What? Where are you even getting those figures from? The US would burn threw it's The strategic reserve in less than a month just an FYI. And Kerogen? Do you have a clue about how much oil it takes to even get oil? When getting oil from oil sands you use about 1 barrel to get 3. With Shale (kerogen) You use more than 1 barrel. Why? Because you don't need to just extract then separate it but you have to crush the rock up first then carry on with extraction.
      You're mistaken "strategic petrolium reserve" with recoverable oil reserve.

      Strategic petrolium reserve is the oil the government pumps into the salt mines (?) in Louisiana. There's not much oil. You're right. We'd go through that in about a month if we're lucky.

      Recoverable oil reserve is oil that hasn't been explored, but we know where it is. ANWR is a recoverable oil reserve. There's not a whole lot either.

      The real reserve lies beneath the coastlines on the east and the west, and Gulf of Mexico. Unfortunately, or fortunately, depends on how cynical you want to be, the people who complain the loudest about how expensive gasoline is won't allow us to drill here.

      Originally posted by glow View Post
      Yup! Theres a lot of awesome ways to get energy from other places hell Japan is using rods in the sea to get a little extra power, Denmark 20% and growing of their power comes from wind. Germany has like 400-1000 windmills going now I forget. Waves are good in theory but lot of issues with that not ecologically friendly ****s with the earth. Wind farms are awesome. Dams we'll see less and less, the one on the yellow river is only good for maybe 60 years. But hot fusion is pretty amazing except for the fact that trying to contain something thats like 90 million degrees isn't too easy lol.
      There are other forms of energy. All worth exploring. Some worth more than others. We have to let the market decide.

      Gas hydrates is an excellent discovery. It's basically solid methane at room temperature. However, it's slightly difficult to recover as it exists only at depth of 3000 ft or more on the ocean floor. Also, some environmental groups might object because methane is 27 times more effective as a greenhouse gas than CO2.
      "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by gunnut View Post
        Gas hydrates is an excellent discovery. It's basically solid methane at room temperature. However, it's slightly difficult to recover as it exists only at depth of 3000 ft or more on the ocean floor. Also, some environmental groups might object because methane is 27 times more effective as a greenhouse gas than CO2.
        Kinda like hydrogen sure in theory it's good but I sure as hell don't want a container of compressed hydrogen behind or infront of me in a crash!

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        • #34
          Originally posted by glow View Post
          Kinda like hydrogen sure in theory it's good but I sure as hell don't want a container of compressed hydrogen behind or infront of me in a crash!
          As opposed to a large easily puncturable canister of benzene enriched hydrocarbons?


          Or is it that your just a troll?
          In the realm of spirit, seek clarity; in the material world, seek utility.

          Leibniz

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          • #35
            Ummm What? Where are you even getting those figures from? The US would burn threw it's The strategic reserve in less than a month just an FYI. And Kerogen? Do you have a clue about how much oil it takes to even get oil? When getting oil from oil sands you use about 1 barrel to get 3. With Shale (kerogen) You use more than 1 barrel. Why? Because you don't need to just extract then separate it but you have to crush the rock up first then carry on with extraction.
            You horribly under informed

            Kerogen is a mixture of organic chemical compounds that make up a portion of the organic matter in sedimentary rocks. It is insoluble in normal organic solvents because of the huge molecular weight (upwards of 1,000) of its component compounds. The soluble portion is known as bitumen. When heated to the right temperatures in the Earth's crust, some types of kerogen release oil or gas, collectively known as hydrocarbons (fossil fuels). When such kerogens are present in high concentration in shale, and have not been heated to a sufficient temperature to release their hydrocarbons, they may form oil shale deposits.

            Oil shale is a general term applied to a fine-grained sedimentary rock containing enough organic material (called kerogen) to yield oil and combustible gas upon distillation. In addition to the oil shale, the other groups of organic-rich sedimentary rock are bitumen-impregnated rocks (tar sands and petroleum reservoir rocks), and humic coals and carbonaceous shale.

            The United States Energy Information Administration estimates the world supply of oil shale at 2.6 trillion barrels of recoverable oil, 1.0-1.2 trillion barrels of which are in the United States.[1] However, attempts to develop these reserves have been going on for over 100 years with limited success.[2]

            The kerogen in oil shale can be converted to oil through the chemical process of pyrolysis. Oil shale could also burn directly as a low-grade fuel for power generation and heating, and be used as a raw material in the chemical and construction materials industries. Estonia, Brazil, China, Germany and Russia use oil shale currently

            According to the survey conducted by the RAND, a surface retorting complex (mine, retorting plant, upgrading plant, supporting utilities, and spent shale reclamation) is unlikely to be profitable unless real crude oil prices are at least US$70 to US$95 per barrel.[12] Once commercial plants are in operation and experience-based learning takes place, costs are expected to decline to US$35–US$48 per barrel after 12 years. After production of 1000 million barrels, costs are estimated to decline further to $30 – $40 per barrel.[28] In 2005, Royal Dutch Shell announced that its in situ extraction technology deployed in Colorado could be competitive at prices over US$30 per barrel.[29]

            At the full scale production, the production costs for one barrel of light crude oil of the Stuart plant is projected to be in the range of US$11.3 to $12.4 per barrel, including capital costs and operation costs at a 30 years projected lifetime. However, the project is suspended due environmental concerns.[28][30] Israel's AFSK Hom Tov process, which produces oil from a mixture of oil refinery residue (in the form of bitumen) and oil shale, claims to be profitable at US$16-US$17 per barrel. This technology still being tested.

            Price of oil is currenty USD 68-71 Bloomberg.com: Energy Prices

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            • #36
              And it's yummy.

              -dale

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              • #37
                Originally posted by Parihaka View Post
                As opposed to a large easily puncturable canister of benzene enriched hydrocarbons?


                Or is it that your just a troll?
                Ummm what? The big deal is that they are saying 75L will get you 400 miles. Well if a tank of 75L tank of compressed hydrogen explodes it can take out a building. Gas in a car sure isn't going to blow up like that unfortunately it produces C02 but On Occasion Hydrogen can produce H202

                Or is it that your just being an ass?

                Ever here of the Hindenburg, what did you think that was filled with?


                Originally posted by zraver View Post

                Price of oil is currenty USD 68-71 Bloomberg.com: Energy Prices
                How am I horribly wrong? Your listing a material you need to mine, seperate, extract, process, then ship. But somehow to you it's some grand source of energy. Look how much Oil and electricity is going to go into to just producing it. Hell it's going to be even more expensive than extracting the oil in oilsands. So still not sure how I am wrong here in the first place I said it would be expensive? 1.2 Trillion barrels of another energy source that can be depleted very quickly not too mention the mass amounts of barrels that are used into just getting it.
                Last edited by glow; 16 Jun 07,, 02:42.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by glow View Post
                  Ummm what? The big deal is that they are saying 75L will get you 400 miles. Well if a tank of 75L tank of compressed hydrogen explodes it can take out a building. Gas in a car sure isn't going to blow up like that unfortunately it produces C02 but On Occasion Hydrogen can produce H202
                  H2O2 can be rapidly decomposed to H2O with a suitable catalyst.
                  "Of all the manifestations of power, restraint impresses men the most." - Thucydides

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by chankya View Post
                    H2O2 can be rapidly decomposed to H2O with a suitable catalyst.
                    LOL I guess lets hope it gets implemented well so after a hydrogen car explodes and takes out a parking lot it wouldn't be as hard to identify all the blonds.

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by glow View Post
                      Or is it that your just being an ass?
                      Bye.
                      In the realm of spirit, seek clarity; in the material world, seek utility.

                      Leibniz

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by glow View Post
                        p.s. Too you guys who got all riled up all I got to say is good! Finally some more interesting convos on here was getting f'in boring on here.
                        Advertising that you're trolling for some "interesting convos"? Good one.
                        “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

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                        • #42
                          Interesting read

                          Oil shale - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


                          "Some have learnt many Tricks of sly Evasion, Instead of Truth they use Equivocation, And eke it out with mental Reservation, Which is to good Men an Abomination."

                          I don't have to attend every argument I'm invited to.

                          HAKUNA MATATA

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Parihaka View Post
                            Bye.
                            Aw...man...another one bites the dust.

                            And to think I was entertained for days by this one.
                            "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by gunnut View Post
                              Aw...man...another one bites the dust.

                              And to think I was entertained for days by this one.
                              I like to keep em around for you to play with, but there comes a point where their arrogance hits the tipping point. This one has tried to be back 3 times and counting, seems he misses telling us about himself.
                              In the realm of spirit, seek clarity; in the material world, seek utility.

                              Leibniz

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                              • #45
                                Wow, I knew telemarketers were bad, but I didn't know that they were this bad.

                                And TopHatter, do you still have some Kool Aid left for me?
                                I have no idea what I'm doing. Honestly!

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