2022-2024 Russo-Ukrainian War

[Ironduke]

I think in light of the US election results, it's time to confiscate all frozen Russian assets in the US and hand them over to Ukraine, before Jan. 20.

That way at least Ukraine can use the funds to purchase weapons and materiel at market rates in the coming years, as there won't be any aid packages forthcoming for the next four years.

I'm sure Russia will get all worked up and demand reimbursement from the next administration, and while I don't see Trump giving any money to Ukraine, I don't think he'd reimburse the Russians their lost assets either. Thus there'd be a Russian grievance and tensions, a more adversarial US-Russia relationship than may otherwise be the case. I think it might queer the pitch a bit, throw a wrench in the gears, in terms of the Trump administration's ability to "negotiate" an outcome in the war favorable toward Russia. Trump would be unable to offer an unfreezing of assets in exchange for a cease-fire (that would be favorable anyways to Russia), thus no buttering of Russia's bread on both sides.

[Bigfella]

Solid idea Ironduke. Not sure what if any complications it involves, but it would certainly help Ukraine.

[Ironduke]

Solid idea Ironduke. Not sure what if any complications it involves, but it would certainly help Ukraine.

In light of a recent Supreme Court decision (Trump v. United States) it's also perfectly legal for Biden to confiscate and hand over the money. He has absolute immunity for any official act. Thus there can be no domestic complications for such an act, Biden has full carte-blanche.

[Monash]

I'm not as despairing as others might be about how Trump will 'handle' the war in Ukraine. Yes, he could decide to drop Ukraine like a hot rock but his claim since the war started was that he would end it quickly by making a deal. Just letting Ukraine collapse isn't a deal though. One policy that was discussed by his advisers a few months ago was to force an armistice by simply talking to both sides & getting a feel for what they wanted and then unilaterally telling both Russia and Ukraine 'here's the deal'. This is where the border is going to be and these are the terms' e.g. end of sanctions, no NATO for Ukraine etc etc. Ukraine if you don't agree we cut off all support, Russia if you don't agree we go 'all in' and sent Ukraine everything it needs to win. Your choice.

Point being the optics of just letting Ukraine fall would be bad, 'very bad'. Something like the second option I outlined would make Trump the 'peacemaker'. Oh and before I forget all that doesn't mean he's still not a giant dick BTW!

[Bigfella]

In light of a recent Supreme Court decision (Trump v. United States) it's also perfectly legal for Biden to confiscate and hand over the money. He has absolute immunity for any official act. Thus there can be no domestic complications for such an act, Biden has full carte-blanche.

it all comes down to how convinced people are that Trump will rapidly sell Ukraine out. If Trump can be persuaded to grudgingly back Ukraine, especially with stuff like artillery shells, then Biden doing this would poison the well irrevocably. On the other hand, if it is pretty much guaranteed Trump will shaft Ukraine then this is a good idea.

Glad I don't have to make decisions like this.

[Officer of Engineers]

In light of a recent Supreme Court decision (Trump v. United States) it's also perfectly legal for Biden to confiscate and hand over the money. He has absolute immunity for any official act. Thus there can be no domestic complications for such an act, Biden has full carte-blanche.

The problem is that this is private property (ie, Russian civilians). It tantamounts to declaring zero property rights in the US.

[Ironduke]

The problem is that this is private property (ie, Russian civilians). It tantamounts to declaring zero property rights in the US.

I don't think so. Nobody would view the confiscation and transfer of Russian state assets as setting any sort of precedent on the property rights of private US citizens.

[Ironduke]

it all comes down to how convinced people are that Trump will rapidly sell Ukraine out. If Trump can be persuaded to grudgingly back Ukraine, especially with stuff like artillery shells, then Biden doing this would poison the well irrevocably. On the other hand, if it is pretty much guaranteed Trump will shaft Ukraine then this is a good idea.

Glad I don't have to make decisions like this.

We could barely get the last Ukraine aid package approved, it took the Hamas attack on Israel for the Republican leadership to come around and make a grand deal to bring three separate bills to the floor to aid Ukraine, Israel, and Taiwan. Even then, a majority of Republicans in the House voted against the Ukraine aid package.

Now with a Trump White House, and a Republican Senate and House, with an overtly anti-Ukraine JD Vance as VP, and DJT Jr. shittalking Ukraine non-stop, likely publicly re-iterating the things his old man says in private? Further Ukraine aid doesn't stand a chance. Let's not forget Trump still blames Ukraine over his first impeachment.

[jlvfr]

Meanwhile, North Korean troops seems to be getting the benefits of modern civilization:

North Korean soldiers addicted to porn after getting unrestricted internet access in Russia

[Officer of Engineers]

I don't think so. Nobody would view the confiscation and transfer of Russian state assets as setting any sort of precedent on the property rights of private US citizens.

What's the difference?

[Ironduke]

What's the difference between the Russian state and an individual human being? You're asking this?

[Officer of Engineers]

What's the difference between the Russian state and an individual human being? You're asking this?

I'm asking what's the difference between Russian owned private property and American owned private property.

[Ironduke]

I'm asking what's the difference between Russian owned private property and American owned private property.

You mean, what's the difference between Russian-owned public property and American-owned private property?

Russian state assets frozen in the US are by definition not private property. The answer to your question is self-evident.

[Officer of Engineers]

You do realize that part of the assets seized belong to Russian oligarchs and some of these assets are linked to Putin directly. Those are NOT state assets but seized assets by the same order.

[Ironduke]

You do realize that part of the assets seized belong to Russian oligarchs and some of these assets are linked to Putin directly. Those are NOT state assets but seized assets by the same order.

Who said anything about oligarch assets?