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  • Originally posted by Ironduke View Post
    It looks as if even if it is repairable, and relatively fast, the Russians aren't fixing it. They are instead procuring ferries and beginning attempts at a pontoon bridge nearby. Which themselves, I think, would be good targets for drones and HIMARS respectively.

    According to an advisor to the governor of Kherson Oblast, the Russians have tried and failed to procure local labor to fix the bridge, who have refused, and nobody's turned up yet to do the work.

    A couple of holes through those slabs look big enough for a mid-sized car to fall through, and I reckon in its current state, the bridge is unusable for heavy vehicles.

    I think one HIMARs salvo every night would be sufficient to keep it out of action. Keep compounding the damage. Maybe someone on the Ukrainian side came to the same conclusion you did, just keep hitting the same spot over and over again. I don't imagine those car size holes were done by a single rocket.
    There's still the Anonivsky Bridge though.From the map previously posted that also needs to be closed for renovations.
    If you are emotionally invested in 'believing' something is true you have lost the ability to tell if it is true.

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    • Originally posted by Monash View Post

      There's still the Anonivsky Bridge though.From the map previously posted that also needs to be closed for renovations.
      I was talking about the Antonivsky Bridge... maybe you're thinking of the Nova Kakhovka bridge that lies atop the hydroelectric dam? Or perhaps the Antonivisky Rail Bridge 4km upriver?

      If the Ukrainians can take down or render unusable the Dariivka Bridge crossing the Inhulets, a two-lane bridge with shoulders, the Nova Kakhovka dam bridge won't do the Russians any good. The city of Kherson and everything west of both the Dnipro and Inhulets would be cut off from the east banks of those rivers. The Dariivka Bridge was already hit with HIMARS, punching modestly sized, evenly spaced holes through the deck.

      Yeah, they could use ferries and try to put down pontoon bridges, but these would be excellent targets for drones and HIMARS.

      Here's a couple photos of the Antonivisky Rail Bridge for reference:
      Attached Files
      Last edited by Ironduke; 29 Jul 22,, 03:30.
      "Every man has his weakness. Mine was always just cigarettes."

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      • Sorry yes I did mean the Dariivka Bridge. It doesn't look like the railway bridge would help them much (albeit I suppose OOE could figure out a way to turn in into a one lane vehicular bridge ). So maybe it heeds a Himaroscopy as well, just to be on the safe side.
        If you are emotionally invested in 'believing' something is true you have lost the ability to tell if it is true.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Monash View Post
          Sorry yes I did mean the Dariivka Bridge. It doesn't look like the railway bridge would help them much (albeit I suppose OOE could figure out a way to turn in into a one lane vehicular bridge ). So maybe it heeds a Himaroscopy as well, just to be on the safe side.
          No, I would do what the Ukrainians are doing - cut their LOCs. Two can play at this game and in fact, the Russians are playing the same game. 6 missile attacks last night aimed at Ukrainian C3s. Both sides are aiming at the shafts of the spear instead of speartips.

          Chimo

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          • Originally posted by Monash View Post
            Sorry yes I did mean the Dariivka Bridge. It doesn't look like the railway bridge would help them much (albeit I suppose OOE could figure out a way to turn in into a one lane vehicular bridge ). So maybe it heeds a Himaroscopy as well, just to be on the safe side.
            The railway bridge has also been struck, but I haven't come across any video or photos of the damage. I imagine civilians aren't allowed to approach it, and it's not as if people can shoot video crossing it in a vehicle.

            This is the Dariivka Bridge after a HIMARS strike. It hasn't been as heavily damaged as the Antonivsky Bridge yet, but it has been struck. And I imagine it would be easier to damage.

            https://www.reddit.com/r/RussiaUkrai...en_damaged_by/ (the best video I've found)



            Off to the left in this video, you can see where the Russians have begun a pontoon bridge across the Inhulets.

            Last edited by Ironduke; 29 Jul 22,, 07:16.
            "Every man has his weakness. Mine was always just cigarettes."

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Ironduke View Post
              Off to the left in this video, you can see where the Russians have begun a pontoon bridge across the Inhulets.
              Damned smart. Using the main bridge as a reverse slope shield.
              Chimo

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View Post
                Damned smart. Using the main bridge as a reverse slope shield.
                I'm not sure what their intent was putting the pontoon south of the Dariivka Bridge, but there's marsh on the east bank just north of the bridge, and not marsh to the south. I don't imagine the existing bridge isn't going to shield much against HIMARS being fired from the Mykolaiv direction either.
                Last edited by Ironduke; 29 Jul 22,, 08:02.
                "Every man has his weakness. Mine was always just cigarettes."

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Ironduke View Post
                  I'm not sure what their intent was putting the pontoon south of the Dariivka Bridge, but there's marsh on the east bank just north of the bridge, and not marsh to the south. I don't imagine the existing bridge isn't going to shield much against HIMARS being fired from the Mykolaiv direction either.
                  It limits the areas from which HIMARS can be fired and, therefore, put under watch for both S&D and an AD net.

                  Chimo

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                  • According to this:
                    https://www.understandingwar.org/bac...ssment-july-28

                    Russian forces are attempting to preserve their ground lines of communication over the Dnipro River connecting Kherson City to rear areas in eastern Kherson Oblast. Russian forces established a ferry crossing under the Antonivskyi Bridge to allow passenger traffic to cross the Dnipro after Ukrainian strikes on July 27 rendered the bridge unusable.[28] Russian occupation authorities repaired the Darivka Bridge east of Kherson City enough to reopen the bridge to passenger traffic; they tore down the previously reported pontoon bridge erected after Ukrainian strikes on the bridge on July 23.
                    So much for the pontoon bridge.
                    "Every man has his weakness. Mine was always just cigarettes."

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View Post
                      Ok, how about 10K or even 5K? Do we have any reports of a brigade size traffic to the front? Surely we can detect multiple regiments shipping their reserve battalions to their respective assembley areas before being transported to the front.

                      No matter how you slice it. We have ZERO intel of a 40K traffic. If the 75K casualty list is anywhere near true (and it is not), 40K troops (the bear minimum to maintain current combat operations) traffic in less than 5 months of combat is not unnoticeable.
                      I would caveat this by adding the statement...There is nothing in open source info that is verifiable. Because if OPSEC is working we should have zero knowledge of what is being said within Intel, and specifically order of battle intel, realms. That needs to stay in the hands of need to know and not show up on CNN.

                      What we are seeing are informed guessing.

                      “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
                      Mark Twain

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Monash View Post
                        Sorry yes I did mean the Dariivka Bridge. It doesn't look like the railway bridge would help them much (albeit I suppose OOE could figure out a way to turn in into a one lane vehicular bridge ). So maybe it heeds a Himaroscopy as well, just to be on the safe side.
                        It's not hard to deck a bridge like this. The US has been doing this since the Civil War. Just need baulk lumber to do it.
                        “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
                        Mark Twain

                        Comment


                        • I would caveat this by adding the statement...There is nothing in open source info that is verifiable. Because if OPSEC is working we should have zero knowledge of what is being said within Intel, and specifically order of battle intel, realms. That needs to stay in the hands of need to know and not show up on CNN.

                          What we are seeing are informed guessing.
                          agreed.

                          of course, there's enough open source indicators regarding Russia moving -equipment-, because that's a lot harder to hide. for instance:

                          https://mobile.twitter.com/Osinttech...54456311300101

                          and empty bases:

                          https://www.rferl.org/a/finland-russ.../31869756.html

                          in the end, as I said before, the ultimate indicator is combat intensity. the Russian forces once had the ability to do multi-BTG attacks across the entirety of Ukraine. then, they had the ability to do multi-BTG attacks in Donbas while conducting offensive fixing ops in Kharkiv.

                          now they're doing company-sized attacks in Donbas, the front-line hasn't substantially changed in a month, and the Kharkiv stuff has stopped.
                          There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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                          • MG Mick Ryan's comments regarding the absolute barbaric and criminal behavior in Russian Soldiers castrating an Ukrainian POW yesterday.

                            A thread by Mick Ryan, AM


                            In the last day or so, a video showing Russian soldiers conducting a hideous and repulsive act against a defenceless Ukrainian prisoner of war has circulated. While I will not amplify this, I wanted to provide some thoughts. 1/15



                            First, from a purely human level, I am sickened that one human will do this to another. It is a depraved and inhuman act - there is nothing that justifies it. Second, as a soldier, it breaks my heart to see a fellow soldier - now a non-combatant - being treated in such a way. No soldier deserves such disgusting treatment. Third, the Geneva Conventions protect such individuals. There are many good reasons for this, which I should not need to describe here. But you can read the 1949 Geneva Convention relative to the Treatment of Prisoners of War here: (ohchr.org/en/instruments…)

                            Fourth, this behavior by the Russian soldiers is further evidence (as if we needed any more) that the Russian Army is professionally corrupt & morally bankrupt. The entire Russian Army chain of command, because of the leadership environment they have nurtured, is responsible. An army that either explicitly (or implicitly) permits such behavior will never be capable of fighting as an effective and cohesive force. Wars still have rules. An army that operates with an ‘anything goes’ ethos is just not an army. It is an armed group of criminals. This is why the study of the profession of arms, #ethics, and the profound responsibility of exercising lethal force on behalf of one’s nation, is such an important area of study and indoctrination in military institutions. And it is the responsibility of our political leaders to also understand these imperatives - because they must hold soldiers to account for their behavior. And to do that, they must know what right looks like in a professional and ethical military institution. Fifth, this - like all the atrocities committed by the Russians in #Ukraine - can be tracked back to the statements by Putin about Ukraine not being a real country. This is part of the dehumanization process that clearly pervades down the entire chain of command. There will be many calling for the ‘elimination’ of those responsible. I understand this impulse. But as a soldier, I cannot agree with it. These murderous scumbags must be tried and made an example of, so that others know we will never allow them to get away with it. Never. We can’t go down the path of rough justice or retribution. Remember, there is a reason Ukraine is fighting for its sovereignty, and why we are supporting it. They are fighting for their existence, and for a world where such acts are not permitted nor tolerated. My heart goes out to the family and fellow soldiers of the victim of this disgusting act. The pain they will be feeling now is immeasurable. I want to express my sympathies to them. There will be some that might take issue with my stance. But, as the (retired) soldier of a democracy, this is the only approach that a member of the profession of arms can take. All else results in chaos, and a continuous chain of revenge, unethical and inhumane acts. Should the perpetrator of this subsequently be killed in combat - well, that’s life. And if he is, I hope he burns in hell. But if captured, bring him to justice, and show the world that even in war, armies of democracies believe in rules & holding transgressors to account. And it goes without saying - we need to provide as much physical and moral support to #Ukraine as we possibly can. The West needs to do all it can for the courageous Ukrainians to defeat Russia as quickly as possible. End.
                            “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
                            Mark Twain

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                            • AR, your link isn't working. Is he talking about this?

                              https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-62344358
                              "Every man has his weakness. Mine was always just cigarettes."

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Ironduke View Post
                                AR, your link isn't working. Is he talking about this?

                                https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-62344358
                                No this. I didn't include a link to Mick's post. It was just a threadroll copy & paste.

                                https://news.yahoo.com/footage-appea...l?guccounter=1

                                Footage appears to show Russian soldier castrating Ukrainian prisoner of war

                                Thu, July 28, 2022, 5:37 PM
                                Alleged evidence of Russian forces torturing Ukrainian prisoners of war has emerged.​ A video posted across social media platforms on Thursday shows what appears to be a Russian soldier castrating a captured Ukrainian fighter.​ Since the Kremlin invaded Ukraine on Feb. 24, several accusations have been made that Russian soldiers have committed war crimes. Moscow categorically denies this.

                                Out of respect for the victim and our audience, ​Yahoo News ha​s​ decided not to release the full, unedited video.
                                “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
                                Mark Twain

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