Border face-off: China and India each deploy 3,000 troops

[Oracle]

Can protest outside the Chinese consulate in Toronto.

Can't do it in India !!

And India is the worlds' largest democracy? Fook India.

[Double Edge]

What I'm trying to say is I don't see the QUAD as being useful. QUAD is a bogeyman to keep the Chinese awake at night.

Quad represents 4 indo pacific democracies that China has no veto over. These four represent a rules based order.

These four are going to shape China's behaviour as China wants to rewrite rules and thinks it can arbitrarily comply with existing ones.

They've started this quad plus thing of late to include NZ, Korea & Vietnam on specific issues.

What sunk the quad the first time was Rudd unilaterally announcing in Beijing that Australia would quit the grouping, some time in 2008. We were livid about this because there was no advance warning.

What revived quad was our single handed opposition to BRI as well as Doklam. This then catalysed the LEMOA agreement.

What John Lee said about ASEAN applies here, countries keeping quiet and not speaking out gives China diplomatic cover to continue wily nilly as is. China has a veto over what these smaller countries can say or even do. Who the hell are they to dictate what arms these countries can buy or who they partner with for minerals exploitation in the SCS.

More countries coming together on the basis of interests and making a stand raises the cost for China. As it is we see how sensitive they are when countries speak up.

People say China does not care what countries say then why was Australia sanctioned. China does care what countries say and the more that speak up the better for all of us.

Now whether the grouping called quad acts as a catalyst for this or something else is immaterial, whatever grouping that comes up is better than nothing. Where China can individually pick on countries and deter them from saying any thing.

[Officer of Engineers]

These four are going to shape China's behaviour as China wants to rewrite rules and thinks it can arbitrarily comply with existing ones.

No, they're not. The ONLY one to shape China's behaviour is the USN.

[Double Edge]

Did a search for 40% increase in Aus defense budget and found loads of links, lol

Australia boosts defence spending by 40 per cent as China tensions rise | SCMP | Jul 1 2020

In a major speech in Canberra, Morrison said the government would spend A$270 billion (US$186 billion) on defence over the next decade, up nearly 40 per cent from the A$195 billion pledged under its previous strategic review in 2016.

That's the basis for the figure. Commentators that mentioned it were correct.

[Double Edge]

No, they're not. The ONLY one to shape China's behaviour is the USN.

There's a lot of space between saying nothing and USN

Getting countries on the same page and willing to actually say something is a precursor to doing something.

Otherwise its like saying its pointless just let USN deal with it.

What happens in that case. China works these countries and turns them against the US.

Keep them divided and Beijing facing.

What's your USN going to do then when its not welcome at these countries ports.

So its about delaying countries bandwagoning onto China if not entirely preventing it.

Keep them hedging which these smaller countries prefer to do anyway. They hate to take sides.

[Officer of Engineers]

There's a lot of space between saying nothing and USN

Getting countries on the same page and willing to actually say something is a precursor to doing something.

Yes, getting to do what the USN wants them to do.

Otherwise its like saying its pointless just let USN deal with it.

It is also pointless without the USN.

What happens in that case. China works these countries and turns them against the US.

Keep them divided and Beijing facing.

What's your USN going to do then when its not welcome at these countries ports.

Ask New Zealand and the Phillipines that.

So its about delaying countries bandwagoning onto China if not entirely preventing it.

Keep them hedging which these smaller countries prefer to do anyway. They hate to take sides.

Still all comes back down to the USN.

[tbm3fan]

There's a lot of space between saying nothing and USN

Getting countries on the same page and willing to actually say something is a precursor to doing something.

Otherwise its like saying its pointless just let USN deal with it.

What happens in that case. China works these countries and turns them against the US.

Keep them divided and Beijing facing.

What's your USN going to do then when its not welcome at these countries ports.

So its about delaying countries bandwagoning onto China if not entirely preventing it.

Keep them hedging which these smaller countries prefer to do anyway. They hate to take sides.

I don't see Vietnam cozying up to China anytime soon if at all.

OZ and NZ not either.

Philippines? Well Duerte is out June 30, 2022 and with him his very unpredictable nature. With it looking very strongly that Austral/Cerebus will take over the Subic shipyard to build for the Philippine Navy and maintain for them and the US Navy. Then I'd have to say the Philippines would be leaning away.

[Oracle]

Indian-American community holds 'Boycott China' protest at Times Square in New York

[Officer of Engineers]

Indian-American community holds 'Boycott China' protest at Times Square in New York

That's a large crowd? Looks like at most 30 people.

[Double Edge]

No, they're not. The ONLY one to shape China's behaviour is the USN.

Let's give this a little test drive shall we.

India's signed LEMOA recently so how about some USN show up at Indian ports to restock.

What effect it will have on the present crisis with China : )

I see absolutely nothing wrong with this. In fact, the Chinese would be stupid not to use Pakistan and the Pakistani Army. Even the US uses NATO whenever possible.

I don't expect the PA to jump in but the PLA AF could make use of their air bases.

That would make them targets for us though. Would the Paks accept this.

PA massing troops on their side just PR for their people that India won't take back PO J&K.

[Oracle]

That's a large crowd? Looks like at most 30 people.

Name and shame. Loss of face is what China cares deeply. It doesn't matter if the crowd consists of 3 people, China will not get a face saver this time, just like Doklam.

[Double Edge]

Indian-American community holds 'Boycott China' protest at Times Square in New York

He pointed out that the international community can hit China on three fronts -- trade, Tibet and Taiwan. The world should boycott Chinese products, support independence of Tibet and support Taiwan.

"The three Ts can be successfully handled by a global coalition led by three world leaders Prime Minister Modi, US President Donald Trump and Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe," he said.

The 3 T's

Good initiative, could get bigger with time.

That's a large crowd? Looks like at most 30 people.

Maybe covid restrictions on crowd size in NYC. As well as fear of getting into groups.

Not finding much in terms of numbers in the CDC's guidelines though or the city's guidelines..

There's a lot there that would resonate with Americans.

[Oracle]

The problem is what is your doctrine? What do you want to do? Fighter sweeps? SEAD? The Russians wanted to do fighter sweeps, to at least make NATO airpower too busy to bother with the ground war. You can't exactly bomb a tank column if you're evading a Russian missile. We wanted to do SEAD so that we could bomb the shit out of tank columns. Our doctrines reflect that.

We need an AWACS in the sky to give us a battle picture. The Russians know their battle picture before they leave their base - to kill that AWACS.

The Chinese? As far as I can tell, they want to use their birds as missile magnets and let the ground base AD net do the real heavy lifting.

I'm trying to find an updated IAF Doctrine. Nothing open-source. I got an old one from 2012, which I'm not interested in going through as it's old. I am marking this post to answer sometime in the future, if I find an updated doctrine.

[Oracle]

This link is suspect, but it has 2 interesting tweets. Check them out.

[Double Edge]

This link is suspect, but it has 2 interesting tweets. Check them out.

Palki's already spoken about Valdivostok

Era of expansionism is over, says PM Modi from Ladakh

Would Winnie the pooh and katora khan even to go their own toilets without security ?