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Border face-off: China and India each deploy 3,000 troops

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  • Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

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    • Originally posted by Double Edge View Post

      Shiv's second video above says the PLA camp is at 4,300m and the Bum La post is at 4,600 m

      Fine. Not much height there.

      There are no Chinese roads leading to the fishtails according to Shiv's videos so i'm wondering what's going on there.

      It's a long trek to the fishtails as well. You could send a few hundred guys there i guess who will be met by their counterparts on our side

      Not much surprise there then.
      It will be surprising if somehow PLA makes ingress, and we know later the IA were not in commanding position. Both countries know their strengths and weaknesses. It's better to dis-engage, and I'm saying this for the Chinese side. We will only react.
      Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

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      • Defense minister in parliament on Sept 15 used the term 'status quo' five times.

        What does it mean today ?

        The way things were on Apr 20

        But, China has not retreated from the finger areas on the north shore of the Pangong.

        And we don't want to retreat from the heights we've taken on the south shore of the Pangong.

        So what does 'status quo' mean now ?

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Oracle View Post
          Agree with the analyst, the Galwan clash in Jun kicked off 7pm in the evening. This video was taken earlier in the day.

          It would be getting dark so doubt any video footage if it exists will show much.

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          • Originally posted by Oracle View Post
            Why did Ram Madhav take down his tweet ?

            https://twitter.com/ananthkrishnan/s...66641303138306

            It would seem his use of the term 'Indo-Tibetan' border was considered inappropriate by the MEA !!

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            • Originally posted by Double Edge View Post

              Why did Ram Madhav take down his tweet ?

              https://twitter.com/ananthkrishnan/s...66641303138306

              It would seem his use of the term 'Indo-Tibetan' border was considered inappropriate by the MEA !!
              Inappropriate, okay. What is appropriate?

              On China, India is making a mistake

              Ofcourse resident PRC sympathiser would want to troll in here without any understanding of facts or history just to derail this thread.

              No plan to exclude Chinese firms from 5G infra projects: Minister

              Here we go. I hope Bhakts now understand how nationalistic BJP is. What happened to Doval, where is he hiding? Terrible FP. It seems BJP wants the border to be where it is today on the LAC. No hope, no desire of getting back Aksai Chin, Shaksgam valley or PoK. This is the worst phase of our stupid FP.
              Last edited by Oracle; 18 Sep 20,, 07:11.
              Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Oracle View Post

                Inappropriate, okay. What is appropriate?
                Indo China presumably. I just don't see the point of him taking down his tweet.

                It does not take away the fact that he showed up at the funeral which is as close as you get to official recognition of a covert force.

                It does not take away the message we are sending to China which is you occupied these people's land and we're using them to fight your guys.

                Originally posted by Oracle View Post
                Of all the land grabs China has made, the largest is in Depsang, the sector of utmost importance to Indian defences. Yet, this has received little attention.
                Because its a fluid situation. Read the 40 pg article by Iskander Rehman for the US Naval college back in 2017. He'd concluded that India's position in Depsang & Sikkim were good. I don't think much has changed since then.

                People said the 5 point agreement the foreign minister reached in Moscow amounted to nothing. What they are forgetting is it was better than no agreement because that would mean a slide into hostilities.

                Its here that we get a reality check between what Brahma thinks and what the govt in charge of this country thinks we should do.

                Some people are making it out that Chinese have canceled any gains we made on the south shore of Pangong at this meeting.

                Why ? because LAC is not mentioned any more and now its 'border areas' ?

                Does not matter. LAC will be enforced by our guys.


                Diplomacy is unlikely to deliver the status quo ante India seeks. In fact, China seems intent on continuing, below the threshold of armed conflict, coercive military pressure along the entire frontier until India acquiesces to its demands, including reconciling to the new status quo.

                Will China’s win-without-fighting warfare campaign help create a new India steeped in realism and determined to break the cycle of history repeating itself? At a minimum, it promises to shake up India’s business-as-usual approach to national security.
                We gave the Chinese 4 months in Pangong before taking up tactical positions on them. So they know they can only push so far.


                They said this for 5G trials. Thinking might be we can squeeze the non Chinese vendors we go with eventually.

                Huawei can participate in any trials they want, whether they get a 5G contract after isn't guaranteed

                UK for its bluster of no 5G for Huawei has given its telcos seven years to transition away from their equipment. These are practical considerations.

                Originally posted by Oracle View Post
                Here we go. I hope Bhakts now understand how nationalistic BJP is. What happened to Doval, where is he hiding? Terrible FP. It seems BJP wants the border to be where it is today on the LAC. No hope, no desire of getting back Aksai Chin, Shaksgam valley or PoK. This is the worst phase of our stupid FP.
                You get the impression the Indian govt is doing what OOE said he would do ? not just this govt but the one before as well.

                Let them come in and build their infrastructure and when the balloon goes up its all toast.

                Doing it in such a way as to limit any political fallout the opposition can throw at them.

                What have they got in Depsang ? how tactical is it.

                As non-tactical as what they have in Doklam then they will vacate those areas quick if the balloon goes up.

                I've not heard much commentary about Depsang from Nitin or AIM because their sources have not given them much.

                Rajnath did not mention it in his parliament speech either so its a fluid situation.

                Opposition wants us to know that thousands of kms have been occupied there.

                Was arguing with some guy the other day and he was calling Modi a traitor over this
                Last edited by Double Edge; 18 Sep 20,, 15:23.

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                • Originally posted by Oracle View Post
                  Ofcourse resident PRC sympathiser would want to troll in here without any understanding of facts or history just to derail this thread.

                  Here we go. I hope Bhakts now understand how nationalistic BJP is. What happened to Doval, where is he hiding? Terrible FP. It seems BJP wants the border to be where it is today on the LAC. No hope, no desire of getting back Aksai Chin, Shaksgam valley or PoK. This is the worst phase of our stupid FP.
                  What to make of Swami's latest here ? How much of a PRC sympathiser is he.

                  Generally he has people fawning all over him but he isn't getting many takers in the comments there or in general when he speaks about China

                  Where did all the swami fanboys go ?



                  He does not want to support Tibetans. He does not want to attack China.

                  His simple point is they have entered our house and should get out.

                  I was quite taken aback by his remarks that the Tibetans did not agree to the border and had to be bribed and he's referring to McMahon here at Simla back in 1914.

                  He has this tendency of making statements that catch you off guard which some times are true and other times are not.

                  Has he been co-opted by China. Their way is co-opt the elites. He always maintains good relations with them.

                  What better dharmic leader can they find

                  At the end of the day the man is an economist. I listen to him when he speaks about economics.

                  His foreign policy prescriptions i'm a bit more circumspect and since the guy cannot shut up even the MEA once had to put up a statement that he does not make foreign policy. He must have said something and they did not want to deal with enquiries from foreign reporters about 'Indian leader or lawmaker' said bla bla about something.

                  The guy is a rank opportunist and the feeling is moment things turn bad will either bite you or betray you.
                  Last edited by Double Edge; 18 Sep 20,, 16:25.

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                  • When decent people deal with a bunch of thugs, the thugs get the upper hand


                    India can’t afford a knee-jerk reaction on the LAC. That’s what China is hoping for | The Print | Sept 18 2020

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                    • One for OOE. This thesis on mountain warfare came recommended

                      High Altitude Warfare: The Kargil Conflict And The Future | Navy Postgraduate school | Jun 2003 (pdf)

                      Combat at altitudes approaching 18,000 feet (5,485 m) above sea level between India and Pakistan at Kargil illustrates the timeless nature of high altitude warfare.

                      U.S. combat experiences in the mountains of Afghanistan in 2002 parallel those of the combatants at Kargil despite the overwhelming technological advantage of U.S. forces.

                      Trained and well-equipped light infantry is the only force capable of decisive maneuver in mountainous terrain.

                      Heavy volumes of responsive firepower, in concert with bold maneuver, determine victory.

                      Artillery, rather than air power, remains the preferred source of firepower to support ground maneuver.

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                      • This time Rohits bandwidth didn't crap out and we could hear him clearly.



                        He gives a good background to Depsang around the 25 min mark

                        Same story of previous govts neglect like Pangong.

                        We let them build roads in our area of perception and then use those roads to patrol to our point until one fine day they say no.

                        In some parts of Depsang the points of differing perception can be as far as 25 km (!)

                        Depsang is where the most salami slicing took place.

                        Could Depsang experience a 'readjustment' like Pangong did Aug end ?

                        Sure
                        Last edited by Double Edge; 19 Sep 20,, 01:05.

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                        • Arrested scribe Rajeev Sharma was passing information on India's border strategy to Chinese: Police

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                          Journalist was going to send China info on current troop deployment at LAC, Delhi Police says

                          Chinese woman, 1 other held for paying money to arrested journalist for sensitive information


                          Last edited by Oracle; 19 Sep 20,, 15:11.
                          Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

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                          • How does a guy like him have access to such documents ?

                            During Doklam he was giving them info on troop deployments ? How the heck can he do that

                            Having access to ministries does not mean he gets to snoop around in drawers

                            The worst this guy can do is break an embargo. So they are given info and are told not to break it until a deadline.

                            Note this is post facto info and its about timing.

                            Break embargo you lose access to your source and nobody will do that.


                            I'm a bit confused here. Check out his twitter & youtube channel

                            Anything strange ? no.

                            Leaks that others don't say ? no

                            Let's say he does have classified info.

                            He's not the story in that case but the story is how or why is India's MOD sharing such sensitive info with people ?

                            I cannot believe they are doing this because it makes no sense. They can't report on it so why are they being told at all.

                            Check out this video



                            1) As WHO chair, India will get Taiwan into WHO.
                            2) India will sell BrahmOS to Indonesia. Didn't do it with Vietnam but some how will do it with Indonesia
                            3) India will get more active in the SCS
                            4) Etailers will have to state whether a product for sale was made in India or not

                            Anything earth shattering in there ?

                            He's either reported what happened or speculated



                            He also writes stories so maybe there may be more to it but i can't find anything fishy in his non-fiction work.
                            Last edited by Double Edge; 20 Sep 20,, 01:05.

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                            • Can't speed up the acclimitisation process in pressure chambers. Has to be done naturally.

                              We know because we've tried it too.

                              It's -10 degrees C there now and set to drop to -30 in a month and a half


                              Altitude begins to take a toll in Ladakh | HT | Sept 19 2020

                              Some Chinese troops have been evacuated from the Finger 4 heights to a field medical facility ahead of Finger 6 during the last two to three days due to health complications linked to high altitude, the officials said, with the development turning the spotlight on the challenges of high-altitude warfare.
                              Last edited by Double Edge; 20 Sep 20,, 15:43.

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                                Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

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