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  • Speaker Pelosi Visits Taiwan

    Ya know...I am fed up with kowtowing to tyrants and dictators.

    Speaker Pelosi has a long history of taking a hard line on China. This is a well thought and executed plan on her part.

    https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-p...ay-2022-08-02/


    Pelosi arrives in Taiwan, voicing U.S. 'solidarity' as China fumes


    By Yimou Lee
    and Sarah Wu

    TAIPEI, Aug 2 (Reuters) - U.S. House of Representatives Speaker Nancy Pelosi arrived in Taiwan late on Tuesday on a trip she said demonstrates American solidarity with the Chinese-claimed self-ruled island, but China condemned this first such visit in 25 years as a threat to peace and stability in the Taiwan Strait.

    Pelosi and the rest of her delegation disembarked from a U.S. Air Force transport plane at Songshan Airport in downtown Taipei after the nighttime landing on a flight from Malaysia to begin a visit that risks pushing U.S.-Chinese relations to a new low. They were greeted by Taiwan's foreign minister, Joseph Wu, and Sandra Oudkirk, the top U.S. representative in Taiwan.

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    "Our congressional delegation's visit to Taiwan honors America's unwavering commitment to supporting Taiwan's vibrant democracy," Pelosi said in a statement shortly after landing. "America's solidarity with the 23 million people of Taiwan is more important today than ever, as the world faces a choice between autocracy and democracy." read more

    Taiwan's President Tsai Ing-wen will meet with Pelosi, who is second in the line of succession to the U.S. presidency and a long-time critic of Beijing, on Wednesday morning and then have lunch together, the presidential office said. Pelosi, travelling with six other American lawmakers, is the first U.S. House speaker to visit Taiwan since 1997. read more


    China immediately condemned Pelosi's visit, with the foreign ministry saying it seriously damages peace and stability in the Taiwan Strait, "has a severe impact on the political foundation of China-U.S. relations, and seriously infringes upon China's sovereignty and territorial integrity." The ministry said it lodged a strong protest with the United States.

    Chinese warplanes buzzed the line dividing the Taiwan Strait before her arrival. The Chinese military has been put on high alert and will launch "targeted military operations" in response to Pelosi's visit, the defence ministry said.


    The People's Liberation Army Eastern Theatre Command announced that it will conduct joint air and sea drills near Taiwan starting on Tuesday night, and test-launch conventional missiles in the sea east of Taiwan. read more

    Pelosi is on a tour of Asia that includes announced visits to Singapore, Malaysia, South Korea and Japan. Her stop in Taiwan was unannounced but widely anticipated.

    In a Washington Post opinion piece released shortly after she landed, Pelosi outlined her reasons for visiting, praising Taiwan's commitment to democratic government while criticizing China as having dramatically increased tensions with Taiwan in recent years.

    "We cannot stand by as the CCP proceeds to threaten Taiwan - and democracy itself," Pelosi said, referring to the Chinese Communist Party.

    Pelosi also cited China's "brutal crackdown" against political dissent in Hong Kong, as well as its treatment of Muslim Uyghurs and other minorities, which the United States has deemed genocide.

    As Pelosi's motorcade approached the hotel, escorted by police cars with flashing red and blue lights, scores of supporters cheered and ran towards the black vehicles with their arms outstretched and phone cameras on. The motorcade drove straight into the hotel's parking lot.

    White House national security spokesperson John Kirby said after Pelosi's arrival that the United States "is not going to be intimidated" by threats or bellicose rhetoric from China. Kirby said the visit is not a violation of either any sovereignty issues or America's longstanding "one-China policy."

    "There's no reason for this visit to become a spurring event for a crisis or conflict," Kirby said.

    Pelosi, 82, is a close ally of U.S. President Joe Biden, both being members of the Democratic Party, and has been a key figure in guiding his legislative agenda through the U.S. Congress.






    Taiwan Foreign Minister Joseph Wu welcomes U.S. House of Representatives Speaker Nancy Pelosi at Taipei Songshan Airport in Taipei, Taiwan August 2, 2022. Taiwan Ministry of Foreign Affairs/Handout via REUTERS


    Four sources said Pelosi was also scheduled on Wednesday afternoon to meet a group of activists who are outspoken about China's human rights record.

    On Tuesday night, Taiwan's tallest building, Taipei 101, lit up with messages including: "Welcome to Taiwan", "Speaker Pelosi", "Taiwan (heart) USA".

    China views visits by U.S. officials to Taiwan as sending an encouraging signal to the pro-independence camp on the democratic, self-governed island. Beijing considers Taiwan to be part of its territory and has never renounced using force to bring the island under its control. Taiwan rejects China's sovereignty claims and says only its people can decide the island's future.

    The United States has no official diplomatic relations with Taiwan but is bound by American law to provide the island with the means to defend itself.

    CHINESE WARPLANES AND SHIPS


    With tensions already high, several Chinese warplanes flew close to the median line dividing the Taiwan Strait on Tuesday morning before leaving later in the day, a source told Reuters. Several Chinese warships have also sailed near the unofficial dividing line since Monday and remained there, the source said.

    The Chinese aircraft repeatedly conducted tactical moves of briefly "touching" the median line and circling back to the other side of the strait while Taiwanese aircraft were on standby nearby, the person said.

    Neither side's aircraft normally cross the median line.

    Four U.S. warships, including the aircraft carrier USS Ronald Reagan, were positioned in waters east of Taiwan on what the U.S. Navy called routine deployments. The carrier had transited the South China Sea and was now in the Philippines Sea, east of Taiwan and the Philippines and south of Japan, a U.S. Navy official told Reuters.

    It was operating with the guided missile cruiser USS Antietam and destroyer USS Higgins, with the amphibious assault ship USS Tripoli also in the area.

    Since last week, China's PLA has conducted various exercises, including live-fire drills, in the South China Sea, Yellow Sea and Bohai Sea, in a show of Chinese military might.

    Russia - itself locked in confrontation with the West over its invasion of Ukraine - condemned Pelosi's visit. Maria Zakharova, Russia's foreign ministry spokeswoman, said it was a provocative U.S. attempt to pressure China, a country with which Russia has forged a strong partnership in recent years.

    "The USA is a state provocateur," Zakharova said. "Russia confirms the principle of 'one China' and opposes the independence of the island in any form."

    During a phone call last Thursday, Chinese leader Xi Jinping warned Biden that Washington should abide by the one-China principle and "those who play with fire will perish by it". Biden told Xi that U.S. policy on Taiwan had not changed and that Washington strongly opposes unilateral efforts to change the status quo or undermine peace and stability across the Taiwan Strait.
    “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
    Mark Twain

  • #2
    yeah, I see a bunch of commentators wringing their hands about "poking the dragon".

    you know, like flying fighters and bombers around Taiwan and threatening an invasion on a daily basis isn't "poking the eagle".
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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    • #3
      Originally posted by astralis View Post
      yeah, I see a bunch of commentators wringing their hands about "poking the dragon".

      you know, like flying fighters and bombers around Taiwan and threatening an invasion on a daily basis isn't "poking the eagle".
      I think it shows despite comments to contrary the Biden Administration has its head on a swivel and is able to handle several things at once. President Biden put together a very capable national security team.
      “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
      Mark Twain

      Comment


      • #4
        Question, could China increase military support to Russia as a retaliatory measure? Apart from the current dog and pony show, what concrete military steps can they take? Or can they even take any?

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by maverick View Post
          Question, could China increase military support to Russia as a retaliatory measure? Apart from the current dog and pony show, what concrete military steps can they take? Or can they even take any?
          Of course they could...but what is really in it for China?

          And there is still over $32 billion of aid offered to Ukraine of the $40 billion we initially offered.

          Nothing says that can't be used to up the amount and types of weapons we send.
          “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
          Mark Twain

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by astralis View Post
            yeah, I see a bunch of commentators wringing their hands about "poking the dragon".

            you know, like flying fighters and bombers around Taiwan and threatening an invasion on a daily basis isn't "poking the eagle".
            The same critics would have been all over Pelosi, the Biden admin and Democrats if she U turned and cancelled the trip after China threatened retaliation. Obviously a degree of risk but most of the outrage, at least domestically, is just politics.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by statquo View Post

              The same critics would have been all over Pelosi, the Biden admin and Democrats if she U turned and cancelled the trip after China threatened retaliation. Obviously a degree of risk but most of the outrage, at least domestically, is just politics.
              I'm shocked. SHOCKED!!!

              https://media.giphy.com/media/b2omCv2khTGiA/giphy.gif
              “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
              Mark Twain

              Comment


              • #8
                I'll pass along a bit of a conversation I had with someone in my office last month. Extremely smart fellow out of Cal Tech and had been CFO of several tech companies over the years and has extensive dealings in Asia. Old line conservative and would come in every year with the WSJ for reading material. Only this year he brought a book for the first time. I have no idea since he never has had to wait. Now retired and have known him for 20+ years. He calls up and is one of the few who doesn't use my title but my first name as in a long time friend manner when he schedules in July as always. A conservative I can get along with since it is mostly from the economic point of view and not the social life style choice spectrum.

                So we talk for an hour before getting down to business which is why I intentionally schedule two hours for him. You all would do the same. We talked about China and this was his economic/financial view. Demographics working against China. Investment dollars leaving China. Bigger trouble in real estate than we know. A slowing of the economy compared to past growth. If China were to make a move on Taiwan, via military force, they would do it before the 2024 election. One person's reading of the tea leaves.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Albany Rifles View Post
                  Ya know...I am fed up with kowtowing to tyrants and dictators.

                  Speaker Pelosi has a long history of taking a hard line on China. This is a well thought and executed plan on her part.
                  You know the right just hate her guts literally. Maybe for the same reason as China in part because the person wielding the power is female. However, she is tough as nails, and has learned from some of the best when young. You could put her and Thatcher in the same line up.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by tbm3fan View Post

                    You know the right just hate her guts literally. Maybe for the same reason as China in part because the person wielding the power is female. However, she is tough as nails, and has learned from some of the best when young. You could put her and Thatcher in the same line up.
                    As I'm sure you know her dad was a tough as nails, sharp elbowed Baltimore politician. No one needs to ask Madame Speaker to get tough on China. She unfurled a pro-protester banner in Tiananmen Square while visiting as a young Congresswoman in 1991 and she was threatened by police. She has been hardline on China for decades.
                    “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
                    Mark Twain

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      https://www.cnbc.com/2022/08/05/chin...to-taiwan.html
                      Oh dear!
                      Now she won’t have another chance to unfurl; as she did in 1991 on a visit to Beijing,
                      her protest banner regarding the Tiananmen Massacre.
                      When we blindly adopt a religion, a political system, a literary dogma, we become automatons. We cease to grow. - Anais Nin

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Amled View Post
                        https://www.cnbc.com/2022/08/05/chin...to-taiwan.html
                        Oh dear!
                        Now she won’t have another chance to unfurl; as she did in 1991 on a visit to Beijing,
                        her protest banner regarding the Tiananmen Massacre.
                        She has zero fucks to give...
                        “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
                        Mark Twain

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Chinese men are hitting themselves as self punishment for "letting" Pelosi visit Taiwan.

                          https://imgur.com/gallery/FCjyagv

                          #copiumwar
                          "Every man has his weakness. Mine was always just cigarettes."

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            It’s time for our reasonable people to sit down with their reasonable people (yes, they exist, on both sides), and lay it on the line: You do what you need to do for your own domestic political purposes, and so will we. But, at the end of the day, we have common interests that we need to discuss.

                            See you after your Party Congress?
                            Trust me?
                            I'm an economist!

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                            • #15
                              You're joking, right? Reasonable people are bullies who offer you a choice between a beating (war) or handing over your lunch money (trade).
                              Chimo

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