Originally posted by Minskaya
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Documentary = Afghanistan: The Price of Revenge
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Originally posted by Agnostic Muslim View PostOver a decade of war, the death toll, economic losses, proliferation of terrorist groups ... what more do you need?
So where is it?
Other than support the Taliban call for negotiations over the extradition/trial of OBL and AQ leaders, which 'Talibani actions' have I justified?
Hafiz Saeed has denied any involvement in the Mumbai Attacks, and yes, ranting and raving about cricket to smear Pakistan would place you in the Bharat Rakshak nut-case category.
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Weird.Minskaya played the archeologist,digging up articles from the times of Assurbanipal.Which is common knowledge around the world.Yet AM just didn't knew.
Just to point the irony,we're also told the entire NATO is deaf,dumb and blind wrt sanctuaries in Pakistan.Not enough evidence
I'm still a firm believer in the idea that yelling at people works.Last edited by Mihais; 20 Jun 13,, 04:38.
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Originally posted by Agnostic Muslim View PostYou should have directed your energies at digging out facts to refute my argument, as Minskaya did, rather than simply hurling abuse and 'getting exasperated'.
Originally posted by Agnostic Muslim View PostMaybe you should have done the same and provided the excerpts from that interview to refute my contention about the Taliban desire to negotiate with the US several posts ago.
Or as people smarter than me have described you: "AM is an obnoxious liar, a facile rewriter of recent history"..."he's has taken obfuscation and dissemblance to heretofore unimagined heights."
I could only dream of writing so well.
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Originally posted by TopHatter View PostWith the truckload of fanciful bullshit you're spewing, it's no wonder Mihais is exasperated....not to mention the rest of us.
Would it have changed your position one iota? I doubt it. You've never been much on facts.
Maybe if you pulled your head out of your ass you'd have known that all along.
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Originally posted by Minskaya View PostRegardless of whether he was a willing accomplice, Mullah Omar knowingly chose his path and that of the Taliban government... to harbor Osama bin Laden and al Qaeda .
Source: The Guardian
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I prefer to think there's actually smart people in the White House. Certainly the tail bunnies have evolved and allegiances changed over the years. Most of the originals are dead, a few in hiding and those remaining in Quetta are far more political animals than circa 2001. As demonstrated by their activities they've come to regard Pakistan as just as great an enemy as the US.
Afghanistan has had eight years of, in context, stability with an entire generation growing up in the urban areas with a freedom and access to resources not seen since the fall of the soviet backed regime. As OoE points out, the ANA, which while not stellar, is certainly proficient enough and will certainly be well funded enough to 'go all medieval' on the tail bunnies with the withdrawal of the US/NATO constraints.
If these negotiations succeed in giving the tail bunnies a degree of autonomy in the southern provinces but under a watchful brief by the Afghan govt. (and the odd drone) then the TB are more likely to concentrate on solidifying their gains in Afghanistan's southern provinces and Pakistan's western ones, and given Pakistan's proclivities are more likely set for conflict against Pakistan than against Afghanistan: a kind of sub-state, straddling two borders and ignoring the Durand Line.
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Originally posted by Agnostic Muslim View PostThis ranting, abusive post of yours would suggest that the individual requiring a 'break' and 'taking a breath' is you.
Originally posted by Agnostic Muslim View PostI was not aware of that interview
Originally posted by Agnostic Muslim View Postand it certainly contradicts the statement made by the Taliban Ambassador about extraditing OBL.
The job of an ambassador is "diplomacy"...from the Greek word δίπλωμα meaning "lie your ass off, even if current events or your nation's leadership are saying the exact opposite"
See also Valerian Zorin and Muhammad Saeed al-Sahhaf for textbook examples.
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Guest repliedThe fact that the US has not put a whole lot of effort into this tells me the US government have the same feeling. The bloodbath is coming and no one cares enough to stop it.
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Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View PostThe US is negotiating with the Taliban to get them to surrender before the ANA goes on a bloodlust. The US ain't afraid the Taliban is going to win. They're afraid that Taliban women and children will get slaughtered.
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Guest repliedThe US is negotiating with the Taliban to get them to surrender before the ANA goes on a bloodlust. The US ain't afraid the Taliban is going to win. They're afraid that Taliban women and children will get slaughtered.
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Originally posted by Agnostic Muslim View PostSo what exactly has changed between 2001 and 2013 in terms of the Taliban and Mullah Omar that makes negotiating with the Taliban (ostensibly with the goal of having the Taliban share power in exchange for an end to their violent insurgency) an acceptable proposition for the US government and various US military leaders now?
This is becoming painfully circular. We get it, you think it was all a really bad idea. I think it was a necessary thing, but sadly watered down with touchy-feely nation-building efforts that fall on a deaf and blind populace, who care only about immediate $$ and their personal safety. If they cannot find it within themselves to get rid of the taliban and the extreme mullahs and madrassas, then why should we?
Our "negotiations" with the taliban should consist of a broadcast - "If we find you have exported violence outside your borders again, we will come for you. We will kill you. If you want to beat Afghanis who dance or play music, if you want to keep girls like cattle, if you want to bugger little boys, it's between you and God."
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Originally posted by Minskaya View PostRegardless of whether he was a willing accomplice, Mullah Omar knowingly chose his path and that of the Taliban government... to harbor Osama bin Laden and al Qaeda .
Source: The Guardian
Turki:... Incidentally, we had a rather friendly conversation in June 1998. I told Mullah Omar that it would be better to give us bin Laden, that is, if he had any interest in continuing his friendly relations with Saudi Arabia. He agreed, at least in principle. We agreed to set up a joint committee to arrange the details of bin Laden's extradition. ...
...
SPIEGEL: The situation had taken a dramatic turn. In August, Al Qaeda terrorists blew up the US embassies in Kenya and Tanzania, and the US government launched bombing attacks on bin Laden's training camps in Afghanistan. Did this change Mullah Omar's position?
Turki: I had come to pressure him to go ahead with the extradition, and I encountered a completely transformed Omar. He was extremely nervous, perspired, and even screamed at me. He denied that he had promised us he would extradite bin Laden, and wanted nothing to do with a joint committee. He wanted to know what had possessed us to want to arrest such an illustrious holy warrior as Osama bin Laden! And why we didn't prefer to free the world of the infidels! He was furious. I could not help but think that we might have been taking drugs. When he continued to insult Saudi Arabia and the royal family, I ended the meeting. I recommended that my government freeze its relations with the Taliban, and that's exactly what happened ...
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So your point is if the US was not willing to negotiate with the Taliban in 2001 then why are they doing it in 2013 ?
Quick answer : context
At what level these talks are going on is not clear, track C or is it D.
In what official capacity is the US talking to the Taliban.
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Originally posted by Minskaya View PostRegardless of whether he was a willing accomplice, Mullah Omar knowingly chose his path and that of the Taliban government... to harbor Osama bin Laden and al Qaeda .
Source: The Guardian
Originally posted by Chogy View PostNor will we ever, since admission of such is a one-way ticket to Gitmo. No sane individual is going to step forward and admit to helping to plan the 9/11 attacks.
AQ's "track record" prior to 9/11 was not secret.
You have just invited the U.S. Embassy bombers into your home. "I'll bet they behave themselves from now on. We are in no way culpable for their actions before this, or after."
Really, AM? Really?Originally posted by Double Edge View Post
Am not undrstanding your point with this discussion ? crying over spilt milk
What is your objective in defending this flawed narrative.
To what end ?
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